Is it a crime to add a J-pickup to this beauty?

[Beedster]

Stick in a P-Retro and only if you still can't get the sound you want install a J-PUP. I had the same dilemma with an early 70's maple fretless Precision and John East solved it for me.

Chris

[Hutton]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1338546491' post='1676039']
Stick in a P-Retro and only if you still can't get the sound you want install a J-PUP. I had the same dilemma with an early 70's maple fretless Precision and John East solved it for me.

Chris
[/quote]

Very interesting Chris. Could you say what benefits in sound/tone you got from fitting the P-Retro?

[Beedster]

[quote name='Hutton' timestamp='1338546810' post='1676052']
Very interesting Chris. Could you say what benefits in sound/tone you got from fitting the P-Retro?
[/quote]

Almost unlimited control over tone from a unit that requires no mods to go into a standard design Precision. I could do anything from SERIOUS dub through to in yer face clank with a few tweaks. It's an extremely elegant solution to the P-Bass circuit problem, which has usually required either mods (for the battery) or has been unsatisfactory tone/versatility-wise (e.g., the SD actives). My main question to John - as I was in similar position to the OP - was 'will it give me something close to a Jazz tone?'. He's a very straight-up guy and was not prepared to say yes but said 'try it and see'. I did and it was close enough for me.

C

[Beedster]

And a true bypass

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1338547213' post='1676060']
Almost unlimited control over tone from a unit that requires no mods to go into a standard design Precision. I could do anything from SERIOUS dub through to in yer face clank with a few tweaks. It's an extremely elegant solution to the P-Bass circuit problem, which has usually required either mods (for the battery) or has been unsatisfactory tone/versatility-wise (e.g., the SD actives). My main question to John - as I was in similar position to the OP - was 'will it give me something close to a Jazz tone?'. He's a very straight-up guy and was not prepared to say yes but said 'try it and see'. I did and it was close enough for me.

C
[/quote]

Why was this more effective than using the controls on your amp?

[Beedster]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1338547525' post='1676069']
Why was this more effective than using the controls on your amp?
[/quote]

Good question; It probably wouldn't be more effective if my amp had the frequency sweep options that the P-Retro has. That's why the P-Retro's such a powerful unit, previous P-Bass circuits I'd used simply replicated what the pre-amp stage of my amp did.

[Hutton]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1338547213' post='1676060']
Almost unlimited control over tone from a unit that requires no mods to go into a standard design Precision. I could do anything from SERIOUS dub through to in yer face clank with a few tweaks. It's an extremely elegant solution to the P-Bass circuit problem, which has usually required either mods (for the battery) or has been unsatisfactory tone/versatility-wise (e.g., the SD actives). My main question to John - as I was in similar position to the OP - was 'will it give me something close to a Jazz tone?'. He's a very straight-up guy and was not prepared to say yes but said 'try it and see'. I did and it was close enough for me.

C
[/quote]

Thanks for that Chris. I may well consider a P-retro myself.

[chris_b]

Cutting up a bass is drastic move. It’s irreversible, expensive and it doesn’t always work. I added a J pickup to a Precision and the improvement was marginal. I wish now I’d not bothered, but alternatives didn’t exist back then. I'd see what you get with a quality off board preamp (like a Sadowsky) first.

My next choice would be to replace the P pickups with a quality replacement set like Nordstrand. The improvement in the quality of the tone might be all that you want.

[mcnach]

[quote name='lowregisterhead' timestamp='1338529514' post='1675791']
No. Unless you were to fit a white Dimarzio, in which case I would have to report you to the Bass Fashion Police.
[/quote]

ha ha

[mcnach]

[quote name='lojo' timestamp='1338531245' post='1675802']
No it's your bass

What model is it out if interest ?

I love the body, want to swap for a lake placid blue one? I'll even route it for you
[/quote]

It's a "Crafted in Japan" 70s style Fender Precision. From 2007.
I bought it off AndyTravis of this forum... Natural/Maple and black guard is my all time "favouritest" combination (see my avatar for another example)...
So... no, I would not swap the body

[mcnach]

[quote name='charic' timestamp='1338531473' post='1675804']
If you add it you could always add a killswitch to the J effectively restoring your sound
[/quote]

I would probably go for a rotary switch (to be disguised as a third knob) to select pickup. Not a big fan of blends or the VVT in Jazz basses... although I don't totally hate them either and it would be an easier option.

[mcnach]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1338533683' post='1675836']
Nice wood... I tend to think no to the J pickup on those grounds, but then again if it doesn't/can't trash the value, I can't see why you wouldn't want a J pickup on it anyway
[/quote]

I don't think it would trash the value if done well. Although some here would disagree
The thing is, it's not a configuration I can seem to find out there, so it seems that I make my own or go without.
And the J bridge is one of my favourite sounds...

Value is not much of an issue. This bass is growing on me. At first I loved the looks, and it took me a while to really enjoy playing it: a combination of being fretless (not very experienced) and a Precision (I was not a big fan). I know, I know, why did I buy it?
Well, I'm glad I did.
I've been slowly selling off superfluous basses and when it came to fretless I thought I could keep my cheap one and sell this one, since I don't play fretless all that much anyway. But it's just delicious to play. A bit heavy, but on the other hand it feels "solid". I've used various string types on it, and finally the D'Addario Nylon Tapewounds are bringing this bass to the front for me. I get a better "mwah" with the Status Hotwire I had before, but it still very nice, and I can even slap on this now

I have been using it for rehearsals with Sea Bass Kid, to force me to get used to fretless better... and I'm coming to really love it.
Last night we started working on a funky number that came out of a jam, and the fretless with an OC-2 can melt the coldest person at 100 paces. Can't wait to try this live.

What I'm trying to say is... this bass is about to cross the line to "100% keeper", like my Stingray, my SUB and possibly the G&L.
From that point of view... value is not a consideration.

Edited June 1, 2012 by mcnach

[mcnach]

[quote name='essexbasscat' timestamp='1338535275' post='1675849']
If you love it, why not get a jazz and have two basses ?
[/quote]

If I could find a Jazz in this very configuration, I would be aiming for it.
Unlined fretless mable board Jazz?
Only if I buy a neck from Warmoth, at >$300 plus the cost of the bass.

[mcnach]

[quote name='ThomBassmonkey' timestamp='1338536107' post='1675861']
I wouldn't, assuming it's the 70s CIJ in your sig, it'd be cruel to deprive the world of what looks like a very good condition 40 year old bass.

If it's not original then I don't see why not, if it has all it's original parts, get another bass for your P/J.
[/quote]

Not 40 years old! Only 5
It's a 70s as in "70s style", this bass was made in 2007.

[mcnach]

[quote name='apa' timestamp='1338537207' post='1675870']
Would it not be more prudent to buy a J body, fit that neck and route for a P pup under the scratch plate. Then you have a reversable mod on the J body (The P body will be scared for life) and ready made routing and controls for 2 pickups.

A

PS - Hi its been a while
[/quote]

Hey, a while indeed, Mr Mod King!

It is a possibility, but... this bass *feels* perfect as it is, right now... using a different body etc is adding a whole lot of unknowns. PLus, the body looks amazing, it would REALLY be a crime not to show it off!

[mcnach]

[quote name='Hutton' timestamp='1338538638' post='1675903']
I think the point here is that, as you say, you love the bass but keep wishing you had a J pup. It's your bass and it doesn't seem to me that you're going to setlle to the bass until you fit the extra pup. If you do fit a J pup I'd be interested to hear what you think of the new sound as I currently have a CIJ fretless precision with just the one precision pup. All the best with your decision making!
[/quote]

Ah, no, then I will wait and you do it first!

Well, if/when I do it, rest assure it will be documented here.

[mcnach]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1338540216' post='1675936']
It's your bass. If you think that adding the pickup will turn it from a good bass into a great bass then go for it. Otherwise sell it as it is and buy something that will do the job.
[/quote]

Something that *might* do the job is something like a Squier VMJ fretless, plus pickups.
And I know of someone local who is selling a bass along those lines, with nice pickups etc.

Thing is... I do prefer the P-bass neck.
This bass is just too nice to play to think that I could easily replace it. And it would certainly not be as good looking


I know, I will just go the whole way and get a new pickguard and route the body for two Jazz pickups!!!



There aren't any unlined maple fretless Jazz basses that I could find... or I would be considering having one of them instead of molesting the Precision.

Edited June 1, 2012 by mcnach

[Matt P]

i'm a fan of P/J basses and my main bass is a '77 p-bass with an added j, (what you're considering building is a fretless clone of my bass!) but i wouldn't have the guts to have the mods done myself, i'd be going for the p-retro as it can be reversed easily.
my bass came ready modded and if it hadn't been modified i wouldn't have been able to afford it.

maybe next time i'm up at the in-laws i'll bring my bass for you to have a noodle on!

Matt

[mcnach]

[quote name='Ou7shined' timestamp='1338540521' post='1675938']
Don't do it Jose. She's a classic beauty.
I don't think you will gain all that much from a bridge pup anyway. Besides Ps and Js are just not meant to be together - if you want to do it for tonal reasons put in an equally matched humbucker not a single coil... and we know you ain't gonna do that.

Have you played about with a PJ recently?
[/quote]

Touche!
yeah, that P/MM project has been abandoned. Sorry, I should have probably told you when I decided I was sure to park it forever.
I just realised that I didn't *need* that bass (for those who don't know what I'm talking about: a Sue Ryder P-bass I stripped, where I planned to install an inverted P type and a MM type pickup, with a SD 3-band preamp)... and I don't have so much time to invest these days unless it's an instrument I am really going to use. I've been selling a bunch of things recently for that reason.

But this is different
It's fretless. And I don't have other fretless (well, one right now, but it's probably going to go to live in Spain with my brother).

I would put a humbucking J there. Just not sure what. I like the Dimarzio Model J, but looks wise is a no-go, and not sure it would be well matched to the existing P. I have to investigate.

I was never a big fan of P/J (mostly because I was not a fan of P basses!), but I find a P-bass does a passable impersonation of a neck Jazz ( just heard so many times the opposite, that I could not resist to throw that one in there! ) and adding a bridge Jazz seems the reasonable thing to do

A drummer friend of mine just joined a band (supporting Hawkwind this weekend!) and she took me along to a rehearsal a couple of weeks ago. The bassist used a Fender P/J. We chatted a lot afterwards, of course. I liked that bass. Not fretless though... although the original bassist played a fretless, and she was really interesting (the name is Syren, if you want to check them out, there's a video or two on Youtube, although the best stuff is only on the CDs).

[mcnach]

[quote name='AndyTravis' timestamp='1338541179' post='1675946']
Aaaaargh! No!

Buy a p/j body and shove the neck on it!

That bass is perfect as it is, regretted selling it since the day I sent it you!!!

Gah!!!!
[/quote]





I'm sorry to have hurt your feelings... I did think of putting a note to warn you to stay out!

It's just a tiny weeny bit of wood!

A new body would just... not be the same bass. And this one does feel great. I'm very happy you sold it to me

[mcnach]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1338545076' post='1676010']
It's your bass - do what the hell you want with/to it!
[/quote]

Of course!!!

But I'd like it better if you told me to do one thing and I did the opposite

[mcnach]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1338546491' post='1676039']
Stick in a P-Retro and only if you still can't get the sound you want install a J-PUP. I had the same dilemma with an early 70's maple fretless Precision and John East solved it for me.

Chris
[/quote]

I had a P-Retro on a Squier CV 60s.
It was interesting but I didn't really warmed up to it.
I like other John East preamps, the MMSR is fantastic, and teh J-Retro is cool too. BUt the P-Retro... yes, it offers a LOT of different tonalities, but I never really got to grips with it. This may be more a reflection on myself and my expectations than the preamp itself... but I prefer a standard cut/boost for a particular frequency affair. The P-Retro confused me, and add the passive tone control as a starting point... no, not for me.

Maybe I didn't give it enough time... but I didn't find it useful for me in a live situation. For recording to choose a given sound, great... but too complex for my little brain... I don't want to have to think when adjusting the controls live

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1338547870' post='1676077']
Good question; It probably wouldn't be more effective if my amp had the frequency sweep options that the P-Retro has. That's why the P-Retro's such a powerful unit, previous P-Bass circuits I'd used simply replicated what the pre-amp stage of my amp did.
[/quote]

I suppose in your case you are right. I have access to programmable parametric EQ in my rig so unwanted frequency peaks can always be tamed. That's why for me on-board EQ circuits unless they do something different to the standard cut/boost or are designed to work on each pickup individually are of little use.

[Beedster]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1338551764' post='1676183']
Maybe I didn't give it enough time...
[/quote]

Took me about a month of tweaking (and a few emails to John), but it was well worth it. It's not unlike a new girlfriend, give it a while and all those idiosyncrasies and become quite simple to understand and predict. I understand that it didn't work for you on the Squier, but that's a different bass (I assumed fretted?) and probably a different problem - bear in mind I chose the P-Retro to use on exactly the same instrument you're talking about, maple fretless 70's Precision, and for exactly the the very same reason

[mcnach]

[quote name='Matt P' timestamp='1338550442' post='1676144']
i'm a fan of P/J basses and my main bass is a '77 p-bass with an added j, (what you're considering building is a fretless clone of my bass!) but i wouldn't have the guts to have the mods done myself, i'd be going for the p-retro as it can be reversed easily.
my bass came ready modded and if it hadn't been modified i wouldn't have been able to afford it.

maybe next time i'm up at the in-laws i'll bring my bass for you to have a noodle on!

Matt
[/quote]

Oooh, yes please.

I'm not sure why people think it's so expensive. I mean, compared to having a second bass!

I have a router, if I get a good template I might just go at it myself. I "practiced" on a couple of OLPs and some Stagg 5-stringer, and the cut is pretty good, no surrounding finish chips etc... but I would need a template and a couple of router bits suitable to follow the template (the ones I have are "freehand")...
Not sure, because if I mess this one up I'd really be kicking myself.

I don't know... considering that I still haven't installed the MMSR preamp I bought for my G&L, this may never happen. Where does time go these days? When I was younger I had way more time than I could use. NOw...
Oh, I know... I think 3.5 bands and Basschat probably has something to do with it