Mark_Andertons Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 (edited) Some of you guys may know Wampler, they're a US boutique guitar FX maker started by a guy called Brian Wampler. The man is a tone maniac and is known for making pedals that sound incredibly close to classic amplifiers without (thus far) any digital wizardry involved, just good old fashion solder wire. Now I'm pretty close to the guys over at Wampler because they're one of the best selling guitar FX brands at Andertons and I was chatting to them this evening about Bass FX and whether there were any in the pipeline and their response was intriguing. They told me that they were in principal quite interested in making some pedals for bass but they hadn't really any idea what bass players actually wanted. Jason their famously British marketing guy's answer was this: [quote]Bass Pedals, I don't know mate. We get asked for them all the time, but when we ask what they want, they come up with really helpful things like "A diatonic Harmonizer, that has a silicon fuzz, optical compressor that works dependent on what string you play and if I've been to the chippy". So, once we get some sense out the bass players...[/quote] So we then went on to talk about doing some market research to find out what bassists want from a pedal. So this is where the market research starts. Bearing in mind that Wamplers expertise is in the area of non digital mostly tone shaping/modulation effects and amp recreation. What do YOU want from a boutique bass pedal (that you would pay around £120-150 for) Edited June 7, 2012 by Mark_Andertons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Simple - any drives that they make to have a clean blend. Much more useable on a bass that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 +1 Fuzz with clean blend ftw! Also DI and a White LED that flashes faster and faster the further you turn the grit/destroy/enlargement/drive/testosterone knob. Cheers Truckstop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark_Andertons Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 (edited) my personal thought is that Wampler should do what they do best for guitars. i.e. make a pedal that has the classic GK clean tone, a pedal with the classic gritty tubey Ashdown tone etc. So you could have your rig as a Mark Bass say and be able to engage a pedal that would give it the tone of an Ashdown, or Fender Bassman say. Wampler do this incredibly well with pedals that emulate the Soldano SLO100, Marshall Plexi etc and I don't think there are many bass pedals that set out to actually give you proper amp sounds. Edited June 7, 2012 by Mark_Andertons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil.i.stein Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 (edited) a combined o.d and distortion circuit with crossover and sensitive controls. currently waiting on an FEA dual-band distortion for that reason. ..now... if you could add a fuzz ciruit that 'blends' nicely with the combined aggressiveness of OD and distortion, you'd win in my book ! , but that's just me... and it would cost more than your proposed figures.. i've seen Wampler pedals in Hot Rox, Nottingham, btw.. Edited June 7, 2012 by phil.i.stein Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Personally I would die before I bought an amp simulator pedal. The characteristics of my bass, amp and cabs would alter the sound too much to make it worth using. Maybe useful in the studio, but then there are lots of plug-in's one can use that are cheaper and far more adjustable. In my experience bassists that use effects have already spent a lot of time and money getting their rig to work with their pedals, I can't see an amp simulator fitting in to anyone's rig! Maybe if it were marketed as a preamplifier-type pedal (like the sansamp, hartke vxl, behringer bdi21) then yes it'll have stuff competition. Sold soley on the merits of being an amp sim, I don't think it'll sell very well. Especially at the £120-£150 mark. But of course ymmv, IMO/IME etc etc Truckstop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark_Andertons Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 [quote name='Truckstop' timestamp='1339108293' post='1684004'] The characteristics of my bass, amp and cabs would alter the sound too much to make it worth using. [/quote] Why shouldn't this be true of guitars too though and yet it works? The characteristics of my Fender Strat with vintage pups into a Fender Blues Junior are my main tone but when I kick in a Wampler Pinnacle I still get the sound of saturated Marshall JCM800. As I say that's exactly what Wampler have done fantastically for the guitar market. But maybe I'm alone in thinking it would be transferable to Bass. Just my opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 [quote name='phil.i.stein' timestamp='1339108000' post='1683998'] crossover [/quote] I'm also thinking that split band processing is the future for bass. Clean blend might just be the poor relation of being able to process the low and and high ends of your signal separately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 How about a diatonic Harmonizer that has a silicon fuzz? I think a splitter/summer that has multiple outs/ins with a filter on each out. So for example, if it had 3 outs, you could have the 1st out so it just sends lows (stuff below 150hz), the 2nd sending at @ 3-400hz & the 3rd sending the higher stuff (all filters adjustable with just one or two dials) so you can put different effects on each & then sum them back together within the said pedal. Each "in" with a level control to balance them up & maybe the ability to invert the phase on each one too. It's the only thing I can think of that hasn't been made yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartelby Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 [quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1339137038' post='1684105'] I think a splitter/summer that has multiple outs/ins with a filter on each out. So for example, if it had 3 outs, you could have the 1st out so it just sends lows (stuff below 150hz), the 2nd sending at @ 3-400hz & the 3rd sending the higher stuff (all filters adjustable with just one or two dials) so you can put different effects on each & then sum them back together within the said pedal. Each "in" with a level control to balance them up & maybe the ability to invert the phase on each one too. [/quote] So a nice simple pedal? I like it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 A chorus/mod delay that emulates a Yamaha E1010? The Level 42 fanboys would probably like that. But the unit does have a pretty awesome sounding chorus - rich and deep. A dual band valve compressor? Pretty much everything else I'd be interested in is already provided by other manufacturers. For guitar, why hasn't someone done a Fender Super Champ emulator? A highly sought after almost legendary amp that appears to have been overlooked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 This is my dream pedal: 3 band dirt pedal. Band 1 is compression with attack, threshold, ratio, and crossover to band 2. Bands 2 and 3 are distortion which goes from grit to fuzz like a way huge red lama, with a crossover in between. These have level and "drive" controls, as well as the crossover between the two. What would make this a truly amazing pedal would be if you could add individual attack controls to the dirty bands... so that would be 11 knobs, probably a stupid idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Dedicated pedals to a particular style, for example: A dirt pedal would have: Distortion Overdrive Fuzz Chuck in an EQ and a clean blend and you're laughing A modulation would have: Chorus Flanger etc... I can't explain myself well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 [quote name='Mark_Andertons' timestamp='1339108924' post='1684013'] Why shouldn't this be true of guitars too though and yet it works? The characteristics of my Fender Strat with vintage pups into a Fender Blues Junior are my main tone but when I kick in a Wampler Pinnacle I still get the sound of saturated Marshall JCM800. As I say that's exactly what Wampler have done fantastically for the guitar market. But maybe I'm alone in thinking it would be transferable to Bass. Just my opinion [/quote] I think you are correct. My main bass rig is a Hartke LH500 with some Mark Bass cabs. It is really clean and I love it So I have a Tech21 VT Bass pedal to give me SVT sounds when I need them. I run that last with my more traditional drives & fx before it, so effectively the VT pedal becomes the front of my amp. Amp Sim pedals are different to dedicated dirt boxed though. Amp sims are fine using the whole signal - but dirt boxes should always have a clean mix control. If you look at the pedalboard thread here you'll see all maner of dirt pedals being paired with the trusty old Boss LS2 Line Selector used for nothing more than mixing some clean in. The low end is prevented from disappearing that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 [quote name='Mark_Andertons' timestamp='1339104259' post='1683891'] Jason their famously British marketing guy's answer was this: [Quote] when we ask what they want, they come up with really helpful things like "A diatonic Harmonizer, that has a silicon fuzz, optical compressor that works dependent on what string you play and if I've been to the chippy". [/Quote] [/quote] Judging by the replies so far, sounds like they knew all along then! Peeps who are suggesting clean blend - would you really prefer that to split band? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 [quote name='topo morto' timestamp='1339157619' post='1684531'] Judging by the replies so far, sounds like they knew all along then! Peeps who are suggesting clean blend - would you really prefer that to split band? [/quote] Oh yes. I've run rigs with a 4 way split signal and used band splits. I find a full width signal to be far superior. I find split band to sound like there is something missing. The full signal can be eq'd to get the desired result much easier. EQ on a full signal allows the impact of a particular freq to be reduced but it is still there! Using a band split totally removes part of the signal. My silliest rig had 2 outputs on the bass, each into a separate preamp that split the signal in half again and processed it separately as 4 tones, then summed it back to 2 and then into a 5000W PA amp. It was awesome. My back hated it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1339175258' post='1684984'] Oh yes. I've run rigs with a 4 way split signal and used band splits. [/quote] One more than bootsy..... [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f36/bootsys-rig-1979-a-514029/"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f36/bootsys-rig-1979-a-514029/[/url] If there was a pedal costing £120-£150 that could do all that, I'd consider it. IMO the basic theme with bass drives is that you want to be able to leave the bass and lower mids firm and clean - and maybe fill them out a bit... while dirtying up the top end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 (edited) variable crossover, with different valve o/d circuits for both, fizzy, cobra-spitting top end and fudgy, fuzzy-felt meets velvet wrapped in kiwi fruit skin bottom end. That's not too much to ask, is it? Actually, probably just a silicon OD for the top end and a Germanium based circuit for the low end, that should pretty much cover it. Edited June 8, 2012 by paul_5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I personally think that if a company genuinely has no idea, they should probably stay well away. Most companies have an idea, run with it, then evolve it based on feedback (no pun intended). Simply starting from scratch using random player ideas is only going to be muddled. There are plenty of companies putting out great pedals useable on bass and guitar who have a great vision. Earthquaker Devices, Fuzzrocious, Dwarfcraft Devices, CoPilot FX etc etc Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topo morto Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I reckon we're getting there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 [quote name='topo morto' timestamp='1339182378' post='1685129'] I reckon we're getting there... [/quote] Sold! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethFlatlands Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Hmm... A distortion pedal with clean blend and a filter to target the upper and lower frequency ranges of the effected signal. Although this may be a stupid idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matybigfro Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I think the bass amp sim category is catered for well in the bass market (ie VT style pedals) most players want OD and Fuzz pedals that meld well with their current gear not completly change the tone of it IMHO. Personally I think any company that brought out low and med gain OD's, a classic fuzz and a full on modern synthy Fuzz with the following control's would be onto a winner Clean blend control with a tone control that is a low pass filter freq roll off control (ie so you have full signal clean blend or turn down for just the very lowest clean signal) and then sepeare control's of Gain, Low, Mid and Treble Tone control's both cut and boost (switches to change centre freq of each tone control would also be nice) and dirty signal volume control. If your really ambitious keep in a standard MXR size case, again a low gain, a medium gain, classic fuzz and synth modern fuzz would kill with these control's. Other idea's would be the Filter section of the EHX bass micro synth as stand alone pedal I'd pay for that favourite bass filter I've ever heard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lxxwj Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 (edited) Tube overdrive pedal, with an actual 12AX7 if possible! [quote name='GarethFlatlands' timestamp='1339183321' post='1685150'] Hmm... A distortion pedal with clean blend and a filter to target the upper and lower frequency ranges of the effected signal. Although this may be a stupid idea. [/quote] I like this idea. So then we could have distorted highs and non-muddy lows. Edited June 9, 2012 by lxxwj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Mariner Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 [quote name='Mark_Andertons' timestamp='1339108924' post='1684013'] Why shouldn't this be true of guitars too though and yet it works? The characteristics of my Fender Strat with vintage pups into a Fender Blues Junior are my main tone but when I kick in a Wampler Pinnacle I still get the sound of saturated Marshall JCM800. As I say that's exactly what Wampler have done fantastically for the guitar market. But maybe I'm alone in thinking it would be transferable to Bass. Just my opinion [/quote] As a guitarist who plays bass occasionally, it seems that *most* bass players have a very different approach to guitar players when it comes to tone. Many seem to have a 'fit and forget' approach to tone, using a single sound for a whole song or even a whole set - I asked a question once about switching between pickups on a Jazz instead of blending tones, and the main response was "why would you want to change tone?". Gear also seems to be selected to fit a particular sonic sweet spot for a band/musical style, and not mucked about with very much. While there are those who do step outside this, the *impression* I have is that bass players are nothing like guitar players in experimenting with and using different effects and sounds, and approach music as a technical exercise, rather than a sensory experience (other than feeling their trousers flap in the breeze). The holy grails of tone are all readily available and clearly identified, rather than to be sought in some pedal equipped with unobtainium transistors from a boutique maker. FWIW I remember when Brian first set his business up and was emailing us all about his mods and stuff - really wish I'd bought some of his early pedals, but had no money then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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