charic Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 I don't have enough knowledge to work it all out off the top of my head so I'll pass this one on Looks useful though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1342006252' post='1727819'] I always need a reason before I want to learn anything too [/quote] Yep, must be a real challenge for school teachers and also probably why I was hopeless at maths in school but soon managed to learn what I needed when I started uni and work. Thanks to Fumps for starting the topic though - I'm enjoying it too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1342007559' post='1727851'] Yep, must be a real challenge for school teachers [/quote] Yeah a lot of teachers couldn't give me a reason to learn things and I could be a bit of a git at school. Resulted in me loving physics (could see applications everywhere) and hating biology, chemistry and maths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 (edited) oooo oooo ooooo I just found this........yey Edited July 11, 2012 by fumps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 At first glances it looks like you got it right then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChick Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 If it does indeed prove to be right, I am going to print and laminate it!! The lead singer of my new band likes to change the keys of songs, so this could be a life saver (I had a HUGE learning curve last night!) Thanks Fumps - you are one top dude! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 (edited) [quote name='charic' timestamp='1342008827' post='1727891'] At first glances it looks like you got it right then [/quote] I did that all by myself ....... I'm a chuffed puppy !!! [quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1342009618' post='1727916'] If it does indeed prove to be right, I am going to print and laminate it!! Thanks Fumps - you are one top dude! [/quote] That's the first clean thing i've put on the internet that someone has said that about......ahem. It works out, I have compared the two & I'm correct. Sometimes all I need is to understand why & the rest seems to fall into place for me......I was a little nervous I'd got that wrong but as it turns out .....it matches with someone else's chart so unless they have made the same mistakes I have....i dud a gud un ! Space chick if you want this chart, please send me your email & i will send you it as an attachment. Edited July 11, 2012 by fumps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChick Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 In that case, I'm going to see if I can blag laminating from my friend on the work reception desk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mingsta Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 I hear ya OP I'm the same age as you and for too long I've been a bass karaoke'ist And in that I mean I can play the songs I learn with a decent groove and feel, but I know nothing about music or basic chord structures and would fail miserably to make my own lines on the fly in a jamming situation. Deep down I know I've got it in me, but I need to start opening up that side of my brain and learn some fundamentals. Looking to start taking lessons as soon as I get my wedding out fo the way in Sept. Good luck on your journey, hopefully I won't be far behind ya! Ming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarah thomas Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 Crikey Fumps, you've leapt right over my head! Brilliant. Your chart makes sense to me, coming at it from a different angle. Taking the key of C, C major is the scale of the first mode, also called the Ionian mode. Still in the key of C, D minor is the scale of the second mode, known as the Dorian mode. It is exactly the same as playing the C major scale, only you start and finish on D. (There are different minors, this one is known as the Dorian minor.) I'm not certain of the names of the other modes, except for the 5th mode, which is called the Mixolydian mode and in the key of C, starts on G, uses the notes of the C major scale, and ends on G. So in F major, the first chord uses the F major scale (F Ionian) starting on F and ending on F. The second chord (Dorian mode) uses the F major scale, starting on G and ending on G. The third chord uses the F major scale starting on A and ending on A. The fourth chord starts on Bb and ends on Bb flat. And so on. I hope that makes sense. I'm struggling now! It seems weird that starting and ending a scale on a different note can make it sound so different, but it does. Try it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 (edited) [quote name='sarah thomas' timestamp='1342012782' post='1728029'] Crikey Fumps, you've leapt right over my head! Brilliant. [/quote] HI Sarah not really lass I have just used this to isolate the info I needed [url="http://www.musicopedia.com/scales/4-bass.php"]http://www.musicoped...ales/4-bass.php[/url] I then put all the info I needed into a chart that makes sense to my tiny little mind (Although I found that other chart & someone is obviously thinking the same as me) I struggle when I have to disseminate lots of info, the way I do it is that I break it down it all into small pieces & then link it together with other parts it may be a longer way in the long run but otherwise i just get lost & lose interest. Edited July 11, 2012 by fumps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='mingsta' timestamp='1342011777' post='1727990'] I hear ya OP I'm the same age as you and for too long I've been a bass karaoke'ist And in that I mean I can play the songs I learn with a decent groove and feel, but I know nothing about music or basic chord structures and would fail miserably to make my own lines on the fly in a jamming situation. Deep down I know I've got it in me, but I need to start opening up that side of my brain and learn some fundamentals. Looking to start taking lessons as soon as I get my wedding out fo the way in Sept. Good luck on your journey, hopefully I won't be far behind ya! Ming [/quote] Yes mate the best way I'm finding is to start from the start, the funny thing I'm getting is that my hands & technique is above what i'm learning but now because i'm understanding what i am learning, the information is instantly useful. Have a go mate, i'm really enjoying my journey so far ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='sarah thomas' timestamp='1342012782' post='1728029'] Crikey Fumps, you've leapt right over my head! Brilliant. Your chart makes sense to me, coming at it from a different angle. Taking the key of C, C major is the scale of the first mode, also called the Ionian mode. Still in the key of C, D minor is the scale of the second mode, known as the Dorian mode. It is exactly the same as playing the C major scale, only you start and finish on D. (There are different minors, this one is known as the Dorian minor.) I'm not certain of the names of the other modes, except for the 5th mode, which is called the Mixolydian mode and in the key of C, starts on G, uses the notes of the C major scale, and ends on G. So in F major, the first chord uses the F major scale (F Ionian) starting on F and ending on F. The second chord (Dorian mode) uses the F major scale, starting on G and ending on G. The third chord uses the F major scale starting on A and ending on A. The fourth chord starts on Bb and ends on Bb flat. And so on. I hope that makes sense. I'm struggling now! It seems weird that starting and ending a scale on a different note can make it sound so different, but it does. Try it! [/quote] I think you're mixing up intervals and scales The chart is for intervals, not scales (although you can derive scales from the chart aswell). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 [attachment=112859:notes.JPG] I did this one as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChick Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='fumps' timestamp='1342018149' post='1728171'] [attachment=112859:notes.JPG] I did this one as well [/quote] Add the minor scales to this too and I've got another for the laminator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 If you want to put some of your interval knowledge to use look up Perfect Cadence and Imperfect Cadence These are the two interval changes I mentioned earlier and have a significant difference in how they leave you feeling. Your making remarkable progress mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 11, 2012 Author Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1342018307' post='1728179'] Add the minor scales to this too and I've got another for the laminator [/quote] Will do mate just give me a bit a time & i will post it ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiamPodmore Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 (edited) We've got the Thumpinator, now we just need the Fumpsinator, a new pedal designed to make you learn theory, instantly use it and then make diagrams to make everyone else's life easier too! On a more serious note, glad you're posting it all up here, it's motivating me to learn it all too. Liam Edited July 11, 2012 by LiamPodmore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarah thomas Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1342015832' post='1728112'] I think you're mixing up intervals and scales The chart is for intervals, not scales (although you can derive scales from the chart aswell). [/quote] Ah, that'll be it. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted July 11, 2012 Share Posted July 11, 2012 [quote name='fumps' timestamp='1342007169' post='1727841'] So if i made this chart this will give me all the answers i need ?...[/quote] Good evening, Fumps... There you go, snagged in one..! Well done..! It would seem as though you have grasped the gist, no problem (now wash your hands, though...). You could easily extend to the 'black notes' ([i]Am I allowed to say that..?[/i]), such as Bb etc, making all 12 keys. Be warned, of course, before embarking on your next question; there lies madness... ([i]No, what am I saying..? It's too late to be thinking about that[/i]...). Once the proverbial penny has dropped, one can either... 1 - Go mad and learn by heart all of those relations, practice them in all keys and start working out chord extensions up to 13ths or... 2 - Put it under your belt as background knowledge and build upon this further to the next 'mystery'. It is useful, however, to come back to these key 'nuggets' from time to time I prefer the second option (there may well be others, ymmv...). You are now able to understand (and doubtless, play...) a bass line for a ii V I progression, in any key. That's 90% of the jazz repertoire. Hoick your prices up, chum. Good work. Gold star. Could go far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 12, 2012 Author Share Posted July 12, 2012 lol cheers Dad3353. I'm not looking to become a theory oracle, just a basic understanding of what I'm playing is what I'm aiming for, if I knew it was like this though I'd had done this ages ago. As soon as I used to hear "Theory" I used to instantly start working out my shopping list in my head until the person changed the subject because it was something I never thought would go into this dusty dried up cow pat i call my brain. [attachment=112908:minor.JPG] hope this one is of use to someone. Alternatively i have all these charts now on one Excel workbook so you can play around with them if you want. just pm me your e-mail address & i will send you the workbook & can always send you updates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingBollock Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 I have put both your charts together and printed them out on one sheet, which I shall laminate and stick somewhere where it can easily be seen. They shall come in most handy. Thanks dude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceChick Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Yep, I've printed them all and they are in my gig folder You are a treasure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumps Posted July 13, 2012 Author Share Posted July 13, 2012 no worries guys i'm glad my learning is helping others. maybe a sticky for this kind of stuff could be a way forward in another sub forum ? as I say I have a excel work book with all these in & as I go on I will add more pages. But I'm loving the learning process of music now.....so expect more things like this to follow & maybe the odd stupid question to help my little tiny mind understand the obvious lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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