Lemon Song Better than Jamerson

[gjones]

Aha here we go! For all you Jamerson lovers enjoy [url="http://video.pbs.org/video/2256479348"]http://video.pbs.org/video/2256479348[/url]

Edit after watching it I couldn't find the clip. Maybe it was in 'Standing in the Shadow of Motown'?

Edited August 21, 2012 by gjones

[Beer of the Bass]

It's an interesting point, that the discipline of being a hired gun means that we don't know what Jamerson would sound like doing his own thing.
Though I reckon one of the things which made Led Zep a bit more interesting than your average rock band was that JPJ and Jimmy Page had done several years of pop sessions, so had some of that discipline, versatility, and JPJ's killer arranging skills to boot. I think this enabled them to have a bit more variety in their music than a younger band fresh out of school would have had.

[pobrien_ie]

[quote name='gjones' timestamp='1345508241' post='1778419']
Aha here we go! For all you Jamerson lovers enjoy [url="http://video.pbs.org/video/2256479348"]http://video.pbs.org/video/2256479348[/url]

Edit after watching it I couldn't find the clip. Maybe it was in 'Standing in the Shadow of Motown'?
[/quote]

That's an interesting video. Thanks for posting.

I hadn't seen any photos of Jamerson using the maple board 50's (57 or 58 I think) P Bass before. You can see a serious amount of wear on the board

[chris_b]

On many of his sessions JJ was just given chord charts so [i]he[/i] was creating the bass lines you hear.

On the other hand, all I hear in Led Zep is JPJ playing standard 60's R&B bass lines in-between a thousand fantastic Jimmy Page guitar riffs.

IMO "For Once In my Life" top trumps any line JPJ created.

[pobrien_ie]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1345540029' post='1778514']

IMO "For Once In my Life" top trumps any line JPJ created.
[/quote]

+1

[ezbass]

I think people need to remember the abbreviation 'YMMV'. If a bass line is interestin and supports the song it's all good IMO. having the freedom to come up with your own lines is wonderful and where the good stuff comes from. It is occasionally unfortunate that we slavishly study and copy these iconic lines which were probably pretty much off the cuff and miss the opportunity to be impressive in our right. JJ, JPJ, Rocco, Pino, etc, etc....... it's all good.

[Wil]

[quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1345450106' post='1777501']
Although before Led Zep, John Paul Jones was producer and bass player on songs like this:

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwA43FHkxjo[/media]
[/quote]

Always loved the playing on this song but had no idea it was JPJ. Stunning track.

[Fat Rich]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1345540029' post='1778514']
On many of his sessions JJ was just given chord charts so [i]he[/i] was creating the bass lines you hear.

On the other hand, all I hear in Led Zep is JPJ playing standard 60's R&B bass lines in-between a thousand fantastic Jimmy Page guitar riffs.

IMO "For Once In my Life" top trumps any line JPJ created.
[/quote]

I think most of the arrangers at Motown let Jamerson do his own thing within reason. One of the notable exceptions was "What's Going On" where Jamerson was chuffed to bits that the bass part was written for him in his own style.

[Dingus]

Whereas, as others have also stated , I don't subscibe to the idea of music being a competition where anyone can be crowned " the best", I think in this instance it is fair to say that Jamerson will have had far more of an influence on JPJ than the other way round . JPJ will certainly have been aware of Jamersons brilliance and has clearly tried to integrate some aspects of the Motown style into his own playing. JPJ and Bonham were instrumental in pushing what were at the time the contemporary styles of black music to the fore in Zeppelins music throughout their career , be it the nod of the head to Jamerson on The Lemon Song or the grooves on The Crunge and Trampled Underfoot , for example. There are also many more subtle examples that I won't bother going into here. Here is a video on Youtube of Zeppelin rehearsing with Jason Bonham for the 1988 Atlantic Records reunion and in between songs JPJ is jamming I Was Made To love Her;

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEJP5Fc49ss[/media]

I am sure JPJ would be the first to acknowledge Jamersons' influence- he's obviously a fan. None of this takes away from JPJ's own achievement in any way, though. Of course he enjoyed Jamersons' playing just like we all do, but he still forged his own unique identity on the bass and is in his own right one of the all-time greats on the instrument.

Edited August 21, 2012 by Dingus

[norvegicusbass]

[quote name='miles'tone' timestamp='1345504086' post='1778396']
Something worth considering is that when you hear the lemon song it is JPJ playing with complete freedom of thought and expression as Zep were there own bosses so to speak.
With Jamerson, all those basslines we adore and love were created within a more restrictive environment; the 'hit factory'. It was his day job. The funk brothers were pretty much told what they would be playing (arrangement wise) and of course they got their freak on within that set up but they weren't calling the creative shots really.
jamerson famously would not allow the motown stuff to be played at home complaining that he had to spend all day at work listening to that Sh*t. Jamerson was a jazz cat at heart and would play exactly that during his down time.
I guess what I'm trying to get at in a long winded way is that Jamerson has blown us all away with his talent and yet we may never have actually heard him really being himself, creating what HE really wanted to...

I also agree that music is not a competition by the way. Both these guys are killer talents.


[/quote]
Wow I never knew this. I wish I could have heard his stuff when he was really letting his hair down. Its amazing he called his Motown stuff sh*t it begs the question what he called great.
Of course music isn't a competition but there isn't a soul on this site who hasn't at one time or other expressed an opinion on who was the best bassist. Well maybe one or two.

[Looper]

Can't pretend to be qualified enough to say who I think was better. I'm a big fan of JPJ but would always have huge respect for those who have gone before. On the Dusty Springfield topic though the bassline in "Son of a Preacher man" is mighty, well worth a listen. Someone mentioned Noel Reading earlier, I'd just have to say that I think Billy Cox was the only bassist who did Hendrix justice (apart from himself of course). Billy Cox wasn't too fancy but any Hendrix tune with him behind it has the funk it needs.