What power lead for an amp?

[BILL POSTERS]

It wouldnt be all that difficult to change to a euro standard if it was done slowly.

Dont seem so long ago that there were 5 or 6 different types in common use here. There was even a multiplug that you could alter to fit them all. and dozens of different adaptors.13A fused ones werent everywhere even in the 70s. Older houses still had old wiring and fittings for ages.

The beauty of British ones, even the old round pin ones, is that the earth is always longer, so first to connect and last to disconnect.

Edited August 23, 2012 by BRANCINI

[KingBollock]

Sticking something into the Earth socket of a UK socket isn't going to do any harm. And the Live and Neutral have little covers in them that prevent access unless something is plugged into the Earth socket which has a little doobry that uncovers the them.

The whole UK plug and socket system is designed around safety. Like the minimum distance between the edge of the plug and the pins so that you don't accidentally touch the pins while plugging/unplugging it. And how some of the length of the Live and Neutral pins is wrapped in plastic for the same reason. Even the placement of the pins in the plug, the Live wire is the shortest so that if the cable is pulled out of the plug while it's plugged in the Live is the first to be disconnected and the Earth, being the longest, is the last.

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='KingBollock' timestamp='1345766556' post='1781455']
The whole UK plug and socket system is designed around safety. Like the minimum distance between the edge of the plug and the pins so that you don't accidentally touch the pins while plugging/unplugging it. And how some of the length of the Live and Neutral pins is wrapped in plastic for the same reason. Even the placement of the pins in the plug, the Live wire is the shortest so that if the cable is pulled out of the plug while it's plugged in the Live is the first to be disconnected and the Earth, being the longest, is the last.
[/quote]

This makes me proud to be British.

When I read it, Pomp and Circumstance played on my internal jukebox.

[BigRedX]

[quote name='EddyGlee' timestamp='1345654202' post='1780112']
Don't wanna spoil your fun mate .. but you really need to look at the ancient socket on the kettle you posted!!
[/quote]

And even if it had been the more modern style connection the lead that you use to plug your amp into the mains still wouldn't have fitted.

Kettles require a higher rated cable and connectors to withstand the extra current drawn and also the heat generated by the kettle itself. To prevent you from using a standard equipment power lead which won't be adequately rated, the socket on the kettle is slightly different so that it won't fit. You can however use the lead that came with your kettle to plug in your amp, just not the other way around.

[Musky]

[quote name='KingBollock' timestamp='1345766556' post='1781455']
Even the placement of the pins in the plug, the Live wire is the shortest so that if the cable is pulled out of the plug while it's plugged in the Live is the first to be disconnected and the Earth, being the longest, is the last.
[/quote]
That's not a safety feature, it's a design fault.

The cable lengths should be trimmed so that if the cable is pulled there is equal strain on all of the cables. However most people don't bother, which means it is the earth which will take the strain. Failure to wire plugs properly is the reason why new equipment is now fitted with plugs as standard.

[Oopsdabassist]

So...back on topic, Lozz are you sorted now mate, if not I have several spares and I could drop one off if ya want.

[thebrig]

Every amp that I have purchased in the last few years, have always come with [u]both[/u] UK and European leads, it's unusual that yours didn't Lozz.

On the subject of power leads, I got a 5 metre lead from Maplins, because it is useful for connecting to those far-away sockets, but it is quite a thin cable, and I was wondering, would this affect the sound in any way, compared to the heavier duty ones that come supplied with the amp?

Sorry if this a daft question, but I'm not very clued up of the tech side of things.

[BILL POSTERS]

[quote name='thebrig' timestamp='1345793368' post='1781513']
Every amp that I have purchased in the last few years, have always come with [u]both[/u] UK and European leads, it's unusual that yours didn't Lozz.

On the subject of power leads, I got a 5 metre lead from Maplins, because it is useful for connecting to those far-away sockets, but it is quite a thin cable, and I was wondering, would this affect the sound in any way, compared to the heavier duty ones that come supplied with the amp?

Sorry if this a daft question, but I'm not very clued up of the tech side of things.
[/quote]

Heavier leads are more robust, they sometimes live a hard life with a gigging amp, so you need to take more care it doesnt get damaged. its not going to affect your sound. Cant remember the details, but theres some regulation about the length of mains cable supplied with electrical equipment not being more than 1.5 Metres as its a trip hazard.

[EddyGlee]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1345791364' post='1781488']
And even if it had been the more modern style connection the lead that you use to plug your amp into the mains still wouldn't have fitted.

Kettles require a higher rated cable and connectors to withstand the extra current drawn and also the heat generated by the kettle itself. To prevent you from using a standard equipment power lead which won't be adequately rated, the socket on the kettle is slightly different so that it won't fit. You can however use the lead that came with your kettle to plug in your amp, just not the other way around.
[/quote]

Not sure if your quoting me in order to tell me this info!. .. but I already know mate. Its why i don't call them all "Kettle Leads" .. which is just a nickname anyway, but there you go.

I will also add.. that the info above is not definitive either! as there are lower watt rated kettles that will accept the leads that your amplifier uses.

Edited August 24, 2012 by EddyGlee

[Lozz196]

[quote name='Oopsdabassist' timestamp='1345792287' post='1781496']
So...back on topic, Lozz are you sorted now mate, if not I have several spares and I could drop one off if ya want.
[/quote]

Ordered one from Marshall, Russ, but thanks a lot anyway.

[Big_Stu]

[quote name='BRANCINI' timestamp='1345800822' post='1781648']
Heavier leads are more robust, they sometimes live a hard life with a gigging amp, so you need to take more care it doesnt get damaged. its not going to affect your sound. Cant remember the details, but theres some regulation about the length of mains cable supplied with electrical equipment not being more than 1.5 Metres as its a trip hazard.
[/quote]

For my Bulgin leads I bought a heavy duty rubber coated extension reel & cut it up. It's heavy enough to lie flat & has really thick rubber that protects it a lot.

[flyfisher]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1345765722' post='1781453']
I'm not trying to start an argument here but IMHO i often find very helpful the fact that i can plug to the same socket in two diferent positions but i have to agree that UK plgs look safer [b]due to the fact that the ground connection isn't sticking out of the socket so you can´t touch it...[/b]
[/quote]

That has nothing to do with safety at all. Every piece of exposed metalwork on a plugged-in appliance should be connected to the ground connection, so why would it matter if the ground pin was sticking out of the wall?

UK mains sockets are generally safer because the live/neutral connections are hidden behind a shutter that only opens with the longer ground pin is inserted into the socket. This not only protects the live/neutral terminals from inquisitive children but it also means that the ground pinis connected to the applicance before the live/neutral.

European sockets don't have the protective shutter and the live/neutral connections are made before he ground. This means that in the case of an appliance fault the casing could become live before the ground connection is made. Anyone holding such a faulty appliance could receive a nasty shock.

So, yes, UK mains plugs/sockets are safer, but not for the reason you described.

[KingBollock]

[quote name='Musky' timestamp='1345791632' post='1781491']
That's not a safety feature, it's a design fault.

The cable lengths should be trimmed so that if the cable is pulled there is equal strain on all of the cables. However most people don't bother, which means it is the earth which will take the strain. Failure to wire plugs properly is the reason why new equipment is now fitted with plugs as standard.
[/quote]
It was designed as a safety feature. A few weeks ago I was wondering why UK plugs are the design they are and looked it up, that's how I know.



[quote]Internal wiring.
Owing to the channel design (not shown), there is more slack in the neutral wire than the line, ensuring that if the lead is forcibly removed, the line wire will disconnect first. [/quote]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BS_1363#Design

The strain should be taken up by the cable grip where the cable enters the plug, not the wires.

[BILL POSTERS]

I was always taught to leave the earth lead a little bit longer than it needed to be, so that if the cables pulled out its the last to get disconnected.

In the UK, the earth is connected to the neutral at the substation, Not so in europe I dont think, so a shock between live and earth is theoretically less dangerous there.

[Musky]

[quote name='KingBollock' timestamp='1345821234' post='1782038']
It was designed as a safety feature. A few weeks ago I was wondering why UK plugs are the design they are and looked it up, that's how I know.





[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BS_1363#Design"]http://en.wikipedia..../BS_1363#Design[/url]

The strain should be taken up by the cable grip where the cable enters the plug, not the wires.
[/quote]
That's what I said: a design fault.

If the cables are fitted properly it's not an issue, but unfortunately they're often not and that's when the extra distance to the earth pin becomes an issue.

[dincz]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1345765722' post='1781453']i often find very helpful the fact that i can plug to the same socket in two diferent positions[/quote]

Maybe I've missed something but that doesn't sound like a desirable feature. Equipment switches and fuses are on the active leg of the supply. If you reverse the plug, there's nothing to stop current flowing from active to earth in the event of a fault.

[jonsmith]

This thread has made me think of a problem I've encountered recently.

If anyone's like me, at some point (especially after moving house), you'll end up with a whole load of mains cables and not be certain what belongs to what. I started putting labels on my cables, but sometimes I got lazy, or the labels came off. In the 'old days', when you bought any kind of electrical item, the instruction manual told you what fuse was required in the plug. These days, this information doesn't seem to be in there, so I'm sometimes wondering whether the fuse in my mains cable is rated far higher than it should be for a given appliance (thus sort of defeating the point). I'm probably being really stupid here, but how can I be sure I'm using the correct fuse?

[BILL POSTERS]

Look at the label on the kit, usually states power consumption in watts - Not to be confused with the output if its an amp -

Divide the wattage by the mains voltage, should give you the consmption in amps. But easier to just say, up to 700W ish use a 3A,

up to about 1000W use a 5A, anything else use a 13A.

You can get other values like 1A, 2A, etc, but theyre not easy to get so I wouldnt bother. but if you have them use em for things like table lamps.

Edited August 25, 2012 by BRANCINI

[flyfisher]

[quote name='jonsmith' timestamp='1345897789' post='1782860']
I'm probably being really stupid here, but how can I be sure I'm using the correct fuse?
[/quote]

[size=4]The UK is almost unique in having fused plugs[/size], so most equipment that is fitted with a mains socket should be designed to be used with an unfused mains lead, depending on the country it is used in. In practice, this means that the equipment itself has it's own protective fuses.

Thus, it doesn't really matter what fuse is in a UK mains lead, although for the vast majority of equipment a 3 amp fuse should be adequate.

As for matching mains leads to particular bits of kit, it isn't really necessary. That's the whole point of IEC mains connectors.

[xgsjx]

Save money on fuses & just use a piece of 1/4" bolt. No fuses to blow!

Maybe I should pop that in the top tips section?

[flyfisher]

Interesting point. What's the difference between a UK mains lead with a bolt in place of the fuse and a European mains lead with no fuse at all?

[xgsjx]

None! Both will blow the trip if there's a short. The fuse is there as an added safety feature to protect both you and your device.

[KingBollock]

Actually the fuse is there to give elderly relatives an excuse to bug/bully you into going to their house to fix their lawnmower/kettle/other electrical device.

[flyfisher]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1346015627' post='1784203']
None! Both will blow the trip if there's a short. The fuse is there as an added safety feature to protect both you and your device.
[/quote]

It's interesting that most countries in the world don't feel the need to have the 'added safety feature' of a fused mains plug, so I have my doubts that it's particularly effective.

In fact, I'd suggest it's far safer to rely on the equipment manufacturers to fit the appropriate protective fuse (and/or other devices) INTERNALLY to their equipment rather than rely on a layman fitting the correct fuse.

[BILL POSTERS]

Not everything has an internal fuse. When did you last see one in a lawnmower or a vacuum cleaner or a kettle ?

The plug fuse will protect against a short if you damage the cable, old type round pin ( 5A or 15A) plugs were fed from the same 5A or 15A fuse in the consumer unit, as they are in europe. In the UK, 13A sockets on the ring main is usually fed from a 30A fuse or trip. Thats a lot of current for a 0.5mm mains flex which would probably glow red hot long before it blows the ring main fuse..