cheddatom Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1348136717' post='1809734'] When I'm writing those three things are so intrinsically linked that they all develop at the same time. [/quote] that happens to me but I guess I just prefer the stuff which starts with beats. I end up with weird time signiatures which I hardly ever imagine with a melody at the same time... no idea why! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Rich Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='DaveFry' timestamp='1348134563' post='1809695'] ( Retired piano player learning bass here ; ) I guess it is one of those things that get easier the more you do it . One handy trick is to imagine " louder " ( in your head , that is ) , and to make that imagination so compelling that the fingers have to follow ; [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_7DgCrziI8[/media] [/quote] Wow, have spend half the morning watching all the Hal Galper videos on that channel. There's some really interesting concepts on there, I'm off to scratch my head, regroup and come up with a better plan for approaching the bass. Many thanks for posting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Am I the only person who zones out then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Rich Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1348145281' post='1809957'] Am I the only person who zones out then? [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Stu Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='Highfox' timestamp='1348128699' post='1809564']I'd love it if all my bass lines were 100% how I wanted them to be/sound.. but guess that's the Holy Grail of bass playing, at least it seems to be to me [/quote] And then when you achieved that, is usually the point where you realise it wasn't one you've just created in a sweep of inspiration, but the line to a song you played & really liked on a CD two or three months previously & left lying next to the hi-fi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1348145281' post='1809957'] Am I the only person who zones out then? [/quote] No, I do it all the time whenever I'm jamming - I record everything, always, because otherwise I have no idea what I played a lot of the time, and more often than not I find that on listening back a large part of what I'm producing is really nice stuff that, were I to sit down and try and just come up with something, I wouldn't think of in a million years. There comes a point when I'm improvising, usually about 5 minutes in, where I can hear myself (on the recording) just letting go of the imposed 'come up with something to play right now!', where i am effectively trying too hard, and instead I stop thinking and instead I start to play off everything else (drums, guitar, air-con, whatever). About 5 or minutes after that good stuff starts to happen. Unfortunately thats the point where I can no longer remember what I just did - and I never stop gurning like a baboon when I'm playing either (whats that about???) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFry Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Zoning out ? It seems the part of the brain responsible for monitoring what we are playing shuts down when we improvise , whilst the part responsible for dreaming becomes more active . So we do zone out , in a way , yes . ( Scientists have found a way to fit a small keyboard inside an fMRI scanner and have measured the brain activity of jazz musicians performing different tasks ; ) [url="http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2008-02/niod-iji022608.php"]http://www.eurekaler...d-iji022608.php[/url] Maybe the ability to play what we imagine does indeed require us to bypass our habitual self-conscious patterns and tap directly into an intuitive , non-rational part of ourselves . Maybe . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Yay I'm not a complete freak then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted September 20, 2012 Author Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='DaveFry' timestamp='1348134563' post='1809695'] ( Retired piano player learning bass here ; ) I guess it is one of those things that get easier the more you do it . One handy trick is to imagine " louder " ( in your head , that is ) , and to make that imagination so compelling that the fingers have to follow ; [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_7DgCrziI8[/media] [/quote] Oh lord! What a fantastic video! I'll be looking at that site for a while! Dave, thanks so much for this, I have been looking for something like this for ages. What he says is so true. I hadn't really managed to conceptualise that at all, but that's how it is. When I play a bass line, I can only play it well if I get those dynamics in my head, those colours. I can give myself the shivers thinking about how it's going to sound, the power, the subtleties, the nuances, and when I pick up the bass, my playing is so real, so ME. If I'm unsure about what I'm playing (usually because I don't like it), it's like the man said, it's pale and it sucks arse. This also happens when I know I'm being vain and trying to play something 'impressive', that always sucks even bigger arse and I very rarely succumb to those puerile desires anymore. What a wonderful video! That's really inspired me to get my mojo on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I'm completely puerile.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted September 20, 2012 Author Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1348149710' post='1810037'] I'm completely puerile.... [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 More interestingly can you play what I imagine? Telepathic bass lines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Great video! Cat wait to get back from work and have a little lesson later! Truckstop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highfox Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='Big_Stu' timestamp='1348148657' post='1810019'] And then when you achieved that, is usually the point where you realise it wasn't one you've just created in a sweep of inspiration, but the line to a song you played & really liked on a CD two or three months previously & left lying next to the hi-fi. [/quote] That's a for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lojo Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Surely you can't play anything unless it goes through your imagination first? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wil Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 The only practising I ever really do these days is on guitar, and I'll sit down and try and let whatever tunes that pop into my head flow out without thinking too much about it. I've developed my relative pitch and interval awareness to where it is currently (enough to get by with, but certainly lots of room for improvement!) by trial and error - hearing the note, leaping for it, and leaping for it again and again if I miss it. I do the same with keys sometimes too, I really enjoy that, as you can add in any harmony notes you want with the left hand without being limited by handspan as you are on guitar. I tend to find that the skill is transferable between any instrument to an extent, once you get a feel for where the intervals sit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Sausage Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 (edited) [quote name='silddx' timestamp='1348094865' post='1809383'] Ears are more important than hands, or gear. [/quote] I struggle to play the strings with my ears, they're a bit too flappy and my neck starts hurting after a bit! Edited September 20, 2012 by Lord Sausage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skej21 Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 [quote name='silddx' timestamp='1348094865' post='1809383'] So I'm wondering if your fingers lead you, or if your musical mind does. And what you do to play THROUGH your bass rather than ON it. [/quote] Luckily, my tutors both made me sing what I played in lessons and it carried over into my own practice. It has helped me a lot in building my own style as I can play what's in my head pretty accurately, whether that's going with improvised bass parts or if I'm thinking about more formal playing (like sight reading a line or thinking more theoretically about bass lines for walking/soloing in jazz etc)... There's not much I can't get from my head to my fingers and I put that down to integrating singing whilst practicing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 This is a great thread and, for me, 4Strings has summed up this whole bass-playing malarkey perfectly: [quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1348131719' post='1809629'] It never gets easy but does get less hard. [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted September 21, 2012 Author Share Posted September 21, 2012 [quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1348144994' post='1809951'] Wow, have spend half the morning watching all the Hal Galper videos on that channel. There's some really interesting concepts on there, I'm off to scratch my head, regroup and come up with a better plan for approaching the bass. Many thanks for posting! [/quote] I looked through a few of his vids, they are really thought provoking and make so much sense, so very clever too. I also bought the Kindle edition of the book he mentions, Art of Piano Playing (A Scientific Approach) by George Kochevitsky (£2.28 on Amazon, £2.40 for the paperback), I have had a quick dip in and it's already looking fascinating! Kindle [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-of-Piano-Playing-ebook/dp/B004HFR5KC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348218446&sr=8-1"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-of-Piano-Playing-ebook/dp/B004HFR5KC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348218446&sr=8-1[/url] Paperback [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-Piano-Playing-George-Kochevitsky/dp/0874870682/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1348218446&sr=8-2"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-Piano-Playing-George-Kochevitsky/dp/0874870682/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1348218446&sr=8-2[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntLockyer Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 Just bought the kindle version too (because you made it easy for me). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted September 21, 2012 Author Share Posted September 21, 2012 [quote name='AntLockyer' timestamp='1348224222' post='1811021'] Just bought the kindle version too (because you made it easy for me). [/quote] I hope you enjoy it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Rich Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 [quote name='silddx' timestamp='1348218644' post='1810908'] I looked through a few of his vids, they are really thought provoking and make so much sense, so very clever too. I also bought the Kindle edition of the book he mentions, Art of Piano Playing (A Scientific Approach) by George Kochevitsky (£2.28 on Amazon, £2.40 for the paperback), I have had a quick dip in and it's already looking fascinating! Kindle [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-of-Piano-Playing-ebook/dp/B004HFR5KC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348218446&sr=8-1"]http://www.amazon.co...48218446&sr=8-1[/url] Paperback [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-Piano-Playing-George-Kochevitsky/dp/0874870682/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1348218446&sr=8-2"]http://www.amazon.co...48218446&sr=8-2[/url] [/quote] I liked the demonstration where they counted 1 and 3 only instead of 1,2,3,4 and the difference in feel it produced. Also playing the first 5 notes of a scale and only listening to the tone of the piano to determine the tempo. On a stringed instrument where we have so much control over the tone the possibilities are a bit mind blowing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted September 21, 2012 Author Share Posted September 21, 2012 [quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1348230172' post='1811142'] [b]I liked the demonstration where they counted 1 and 3 only instead of 1,2,3,4 and the difference in feel it produced.[/b] Also playing the first 5 notes of a scale and only listening to the tone of the piano to determine the tempo. On a stringed instrument where we have so much control over the tone the possibilities are a bit mind blowing [/quote] Yes! That was wickid! That was the minimising emotion one wasn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntLockyer Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 [quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1348230172' post='1811142'] I liked the demonstration where they counted 1 and 3 only instead of 1,2,3,4 [/quote] That's why Jazz swings, the 2 and 4 pulse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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