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Almost had everything, where to go next?


Shockwave
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I'd say to try a Spector, but issue is the spacing is narrow and they are mostly 35" scale length.
Your search for "the one", or at least a style of bass you feel 100% with sounds much like my journey until I got my ESP LTD F-series 5-string...If only they made 6ers. :-(

Other that Spector, it sounds like a custom jobby for you. Either by a luthier or you could build from parts? Get a maple body blank, shape it as you like.
As for the neck, either get someone who's good with em to make you one or places like Warmoth are good, again in maple. (I did read it right you like all maple?)
Can't fault low, lazy action. Only have one pair of hands, after all. :-D

Until you find what you really like it's a pain constantly buying, only to know you will need to sell it again.

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[quote name='Shockwave' timestamp='1350132849' post='1834942']
The one thing that does not change is my want to cut through the mix like a knife.
[/quote]

Rob, if you can't do this with the equipment you've already had, then I don't think the problem is with the equipment.

Also, you talk of 'the mix' like it's immutable. It isn't. 'Cutting through the mix' is a much overused and meaningless phrase. You can do that by adding volume.

You don't say whether this is your live or recorded mix, but I imagine you mean in rehearsal and on stage. If you want to be audible, there has to be a frequency range available in 'the mix' that is not as heavily occupied as others, and where your bass frequencies can sit. You say you can't rely on guitarists. They are possibly inexperienced and don't know how to EQ for a balanced live band sound, they may have EQed on their own at home and don't understand the concept that their amazing soloed tones are not suitable in a band setting. IME amateur guitarists can be guilty of adding far too much low mid, especially in overdrive tones. Then you have drums and keys to deal with. All this can render most of your bass playing near inaudible.

Let me tell you, maple/maple, maple/mahogany, ebony/maple, maple/alder, maple/rosewood/bubinga, hi-mass bridge, bent tin bridge, Wizard pups, bolt on, neck through, and all that sh*t is not going to help you in the slightest. It's the band you need to sort out.

You know what I think your real problem is? Your shyness. Playing with the people you do currently, you need to have the confidence to approach them and suggest they give your bass some room. If you can't do that, or if they won't accede to your request, then yet another bass is a waste of cost time and effort. Spend your money on a short course that teaches you assertiveness and diplomacy instead.

EDIT: I have just read you are not in a band. So whose 'mix' are you trying to 'cut through' ?

Edited by silddx
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[quote name='Shockwave' timestamp='1350132849' post='1834942']

One of my issues apart from serial GAS, is that I love playing lots of genres. I am not in a band because I get bored of playing one genre for too long. This affects my bass tastes and collection. The one thing that does not change is my want to cut through the mix like a knife.

I love Funk, Noise rock, doom, punk, death metal, gospel, prog etc.
[/quote]

Find a band or start one. Or two or three. You can play all the above genres with the same bass. I find I start thinking about chopping and changing basses when the band is on a break. GAS is musical boredom, I think.

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[quote name='silddx' timestamp='1350190088' post='1835570']
Rob, if you can't do this with the equipment you've already had, then I don't think the problem is with the equipment.

Also, you talk of 'the mix' like it's immutable. It isn't. 'Cutting through the mix' is a much overused and meaningless phrase. You can do that by adding volume.

You don't say whether this is your live or recorded mix, but I imagine you mean in rehearsal and on stage. If you want to be audible, there has to be a frequency range available in 'the mix' that is not as heavily occupied as others, and where your bass frequencies can sit. You say you can't rely on guitarists. They are possibly inexperienced and don't know how to EQ for a balanced live band sound, they may have EQed on their own at home and don't understand the concept that their amazing soloed tones are not suitable in a band setting. IME amateur guitarists can be guilty of adding far too much low mid, especially in overdrive tones. Then you have drums and keys to deal with. All this can render most of your bass playing near inaudible.

Let me tell you, maple/maple, maple/mahogany, ebony/maple, maple/alder, maple/rosewood/bubinga, hi-mass bridge, bent tin bridge, Wizard pups, bolt on, neck through, and all that sh*t is not going to help you in the slightest. It's the band you need to sort out.

You know what I think your real problem is? Your shyness. Playing with the people you do currently, you need to have the confidence to approach them and suggest they give your bass some room. If you can't do that, or if they won't accede to your request, then yet another bass is a waste of cost time and effort. Spend your money on a short course that teaches you assertiveness and diplomacy instead.

EDIT: I have just read you are not in a band. So whose 'mix' are you trying to 'cut through' ?
[/quote]

Maybe it is an overused phrase. I guess I mean low mid growl?

As far is equipment is concerned, I hope the new Super 12T I will be recieving can help me out in that respect. It is the most aggresive cab out of Alex's range.

I am not the most assertive person, but since moving to London in every band I have spoken to and auditioned for I have told them about my previous experiences in bands where I just am not heard on recordings beforehand. (I am not being selfish in this, it's just true!) But giving advice to people on how to get a nice mix when I havent even joined the band, falls on deaf ears and labels me as a troublemaker trying to muck around with "Their" sound and I have to struggle through a 4 audition unable to hear. Which is a waste of time.

It may seem like that I am asking for advice that I probably wont follow, but thats not the case!

I am trying to start up my own band, with another Basschatter, where I might be able to have a bit more sonic space. So you never know!

I just want a bass which is nice to play, has more then 4 strings, look good and "Sounds right" to me. Something that says "Yup, that Shockwaves bass, no mistaking that". My green pedulla served me well in that respect, however lacked the sound and string spacing I wanted.

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[quote name='Kongo' timestamp='1350171531' post='1835519']
I'd say to try a Spector, but issue is the spacing is narrow and they are mostly 35" scale length.
Your search for "the one", or at least a style of bass you feel 100% with sounds much like my journey until I got my ESP LTD F-series 5-string...If only they made 6ers. :-(

Other that Spector, it sounds like a custom jobby for you. Either by a luthier or you could build from parts? Get a maple body blank, shape it as you like.
As for the neck, either get someone who's good with em to make you one or places like Warmoth are good, again in maple. (I did read it right you like all maple?)
Can't fault low, lazy action. Only have one pair of hands, after all. :-D

Until you find what you really like it's a pain constantly buying, only to know you will need to sell it again.
[/quote]

My Warmoth/Fender P-J I selected from parts and is probably one of the top 5 basses I have owned. Its fantastic, and half the reason is because I didnt build it! (Oli Foxen did) And that I chose all the parts. Sure there are niggles with it, but I like it.

I would love to try a Ken Smith. From what I have heard of other people playing them is that they have a natural growl tone to them which has little to do with the amp, it is cleaner then many passive growls I have heard, yet still is very much present in the mix. They probably play very nicely too!

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[quote name='Shockwave' timestamp='1350215061' post='1835794']


Ampeg PF-500, but mostly using it for the power section for my Sansamp VT Bass Deluxe.
[/quote]

FWIW, my age-long quest for authorative (as therefore clear) low-mids ended abruptly when I finally turned my back on class-D, assisted by shelving off everything below 50Hz.

IME, diet amps are like diet Coke. All new and exciting, until one day you try the full-fat version and you remember what you're missing.

...but that's a whole other thread.

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[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1350215750' post='1835803']
FWIW, my age-long quest for authorative (as therefore clear) low-mids ended abruptly when I finally turned my back on class-D, assisted by shelving off everything below 50Hz.

IME, diet amps are like diet Coke. All new and exciting, until one day you try the full-fat version and you remember what you're missing.

...but that's a whole other thread.
[/quote]

But considering I am using it just as a power section and have never had to turn it up above 1/3rd, I doubt it's anything to do with the fact its class D. Though I think ultimately its a combination of things. Maybe I have too much of a Mid thing going on? I have an all maple bass, with Dimarzio Willpower and Ultra jazz pups, going into a VT bass, eventually going into a Barefaced S12T. Note definition is going out the window to combat being heard.

One thing I took away from Bassbash was to get a decent compressor, which is next on the list, which may help me with sound issues.

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[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1350216720' post='1835817']
Ah, but I'm not talking about loudness - that's the whole point. I'm talking about how the signal reacts at volume.

I'm only sharing my experience, of course.
[/quote]

I guess I should now bring up the point is that I don't drive and don't intend to! So, lightweight is key, a limitation, but essential none the less.

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Some very interesting , insightful and informative views and comments here ......however and FWIW ...(.and you know how i suffer with GAS )...



The Guitar you most enjoy /play/love/ feel an affinity with.4 5 or string but fitted with .....a good midi system ...eg vbass .......( can be invisibly retro reversible and fitted to any old plank too ) ....

Pros ... can give allmost unlimited acces to tones /sounds effects ....really really helped me with balancing string volumes and to jump from a kinda P thump to a snarly grindy driven MM in the blink of an eye ....a real tonic and what put a little inspiration into my playing ..

cons .. hmm .. another lead and another box to carry ......

It wont and doesnt cure one of the need for more/other/different basses however .....it helps ..

easier cheaper & way more effective than swapping out eqs pickups parts but not as much fun as the for sale section :lol: ....

technology works .. technology delivers !


Gary
v8

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[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1350215750' post='1835803']
...IME, diet amps are like diet Coke. All new and exciting, until one day you try the full-fat version and you remember what you're missing...
[/quote]

sorry for the veer, but this is not my experience. I own a pre-hiwatt sound city 200 full tube amp, an acoustic image focus sa power amp, a custom 103 watts full tube poweramp and a few different tube and non tube preamps.
with a good cab (also tried different cabs) the feel and sound is close to the same with digital and tube power. maybe because mine is all high end stuff, but the sound comes from your fingers.
but probably I have silly ears - and fingers.

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[quote name='Shockwave' timestamp='1350216790' post='1835820']
I guess I should now bring up the point is that I don't drive and don't intend to! So, lightweight is key, a limitation, but essential none the less.
[/quote] I know you've said you don't like them, but wouldn't a 5 string (and early) streamer stage one do you?

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[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1350221278' post='1835886']
I know you've said you don't like them, but wouldn't a 5 string (and early) streamer stage one do you?
[/quote]

I have had a 5 String thumb very briefly, Fantastic sound, one of my faves. However I didnt like the ergonomics or the neck. Maybe a streamer will be a little different. But at this moment I am thinking of going custom more and more to get something that really fits me.

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Didn't you have a S2 Vigier Passion for a bit? IME they have a velvety growl that slices through the mix with a warmth that throws its arms around it, too.

Although playing style accounts for a lot, I don't think you can get any bass to sound like any bass.

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Pick a day when I'm minding the store at BassGear and you can play all day if you want :)

At the moment the interesting/different 5's in stock include:

A pair of Wals
Nordy VP5
Two very different Ritters
Two bolt-on Wood & Tronics
Laurus T900
Modulus Quantum
Pedulla Pentabuzz
Zon US Sonus
Alembic fretless
Fodera Anthony Jackson double cut bolt-on
F Bass BN5

Probably some more but these are the ones I can actually remember. Phil the owner has a pair of Shuker P5's and there's a few 'reference' 4's like vintage Fenders, a Ricky, couple of interesting Musicmen etc an there's also some 6's and a 7 in stock too.

You really would be welcome to play for as long as you like - if nothing else you might knock some brands off your list, lol.



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[quote name='Shockwave' timestamp='1350236957' post='1836147']
I have had a 5 String thumb very briefly, Fantastic sound, one of my faves. However I didnt like the ergonomics or the neck. Maybe a streamer will be a little different. But at this moment I am thinking of going custom more and more to get something that really fits me.
[/quote] streamer= very different to thumb - ergonomically utterly, sound wise lots, and neck depends on when it was built...

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[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1350249623' post='1836442']
streamer= very different to thumb - ergonomically utterly, sound wise lots, and neck depends on when it was built...
[/quote]

It was a 1987 Thumb. Lovely sound. Neck was too thin.

I have also owned a Warwick LX4 and a NT Thumb 4 mid 90's ones. Sound was lacking in those two.

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[quote name='Shockwave' timestamp='1350250190' post='1836454']
It was a 1987 Thumb. Lovely sound. Neck was too thin.

I have also owned a Warwick LX4 and a NT Thumb 4 mid 90's ones. Sound was lacking in those two.
[/quote] well... go custom. If it were me I would be speccing my dream ACG right now :)

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