Stingray electronic recommendations?

[throwoff]

Hey everyone,

I am sure many of you are familliar with my love/hate relationship with my Ray, I love the neck, the weight and the balance but the sound just never fits right.

I love my CIJ' P bass with a duncan 1/4 pounder and I loved my Corvette with 3 band active MEC.

Give me some suggestions for easy replacement EQ's!

[bartelby]

John East is the obvious suggestion

[throwoff]

I always see bc'ers with John Easts. will they give me that modern tone I love in my P and Corvette though?

[bremen]

A Seymour Duncan pickup, passive?

[throwoff]

Thought about it but I did love the active on the Corvette!

[Lfalex v1.1]

Get a Sterling instead?

[throwoff]

haha, tried it, don't like the necks!

[mcnach]

[quote name='bartelby' timestamp='1351256506' post='1849327']
John East is the obvious suggestion
[/quote]

+100

Big fan of the 3-band MMSR (classic 2-band plus a midsweep module). Got three of those!

[stingrayPete1977]

I think anything along the lines of a John East or any Musicman replacement preamp or pickup is just going to give you more of the same? Mcnach loves Rays like me so a Ray with added Ray is a good thing but if you dont like the sound more might actually be less? Even Passive modded Rays sound quite Ray like to my ears even cheap copies have that sound in some way probably the pickup position more than anything?

Get a P bass pup installed in the P bass position and a scratchplate made to fit and then fit something like a John East P bass preamp, its all reversable other than the body route that will be covered by the pick guard should you wish to sell it, we have seen them before in the FS already done

[drTStingray]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1351338857' post='1850257']
Even Passive modded Rays sound quite Ray like to my ears even cheap copies have that sound in some way probably the pickup position more than anything?[/quote]

The body construction has a lot to do with it (bridge etc) - if you press your ear against the upper horn of a Ray or SBMM etc, the acoustic sound gives that overall characteristic sound - passive Sub Rays also sound similar. No doubt the pick up and circuit contributes but the underlying sound is the instrument itself.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1351338857' post='1850257']
Get a P bass pup installed in the P bass position and a scratchplate made to fit and then fit something like a John East P bass preamp, its all reversable other than the body route that will be covered by the pick guard should you wish to sell it, we have seen them before in the FS already done
[/quote]

I think the problem with a P pick up is it's designed to give more treble on the D and G strings by positioning - something you don't need on a Ray - the first prototype had a reversed P style pick up (D and G section closer to the neck) presumably to counter the effect.

As it sounds like you want a Fender but with the playability of a Musicman, another route could be to buy an after market series wound pick up (as per the Sterling) - in series form the sound is more Fender-ish than the parallel version - it boosts the mids quite a bit. Other than this, you are probably already aware that the Stingray is very responsive to changes in playing style and EQ settings - it's entirely possible to get P bass thump by playing towards the neck with significant muting of the strings (less if you use flats) - you don't even need to alter the EQ setting as the treble helps to define the thump created by your playing.

Other than that, if you really favour the Fender and Warwick, it maybe better to stick with them.

Edited October 27, 2012 by drTStingray

[Dingus]

A Musicman Stingray is a very distinctive sounding bass that people tend to love or hate , and their isn't much you can do change it without changing the fundamental sound of the bass by completely changing the pickup/electronics , which would completely undermine the fact that it is a Stingray and ruin the resale value in the process. The biggest factor in making that bass sound so unique is the design of that pickup and , most significantly, its parrallel wiring. My advice would be to let a Stingray sound like a Stingray and use any upgrade money towards another bass to give some of the different sounds that you crave. Changing to one of the aftermarket preamps and/or pickups such as the Seymour Duncan or Nordstrand will leave your bass sounding fairly similar to how it does now as they are designed to enhance the typical Musicman sound rather than fundamentally change it

[mcnach]

[quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1351350521' post='1850445']
The body construction has a lot to do with it (bridge etc) - if you press your ear against the upper horn of a Ray or SBMM etc, the acoustic sound gives that overall characteristic sound - passive Sub Rays also sound similar. No doubt the pick up and circuit contributes but the underlying sound is the instrument itself.
[/quote]

I would very respectfully disagree.
There isn't anything very special about the body or the bridge etc. In fact, take that big MM humbucker and move it an inch towards the bridge, and you lose the Stingray. Move it an inch towards the neck, and you get a lovely meaty bassy mighty thump from it, but it does not sound like a Stingray. You will not hear a difference "acoustically".

I'd say a Stingray is by far mostly defined by that prticular pickup at that particular location. The preamp contributes to the variety of tonalities you can get, but as you say, even a passive 'Ray sounds like a 'Ray.

To the OP:
if you really don't like the Stingray sound at all... then something more drastic than a preamp is needed. Probably best to get another bass. Or if you really love how it feels etc... then go the route StingrayPete1977 suggested, and try different pickups at other positions (you can hide the routing with a custom made pickguard).
If you like it but don't love it... then I'd still suggest trying a 3-band John East preamp. Because of the midsweep control, the range of tones to get out of it is simply amazing. It may help you find *that* sound you have in your head. But only if it's somehow Stingrayish, of course.

[Beedster]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1351362643' post='1850592']
If you like it but don't love it... then I'd still suggest trying a 3-band John East preamp. Because of the midsweep control, the range of tones to get out of it is simply amazing. It may help you find *that* sound you have in your head.
[/quote]

+1

[BassPimp66]

[quote name='bartelby' timestamp='1351256506' post='1849327']
John East is the obvious suggestion
[/quote]

+1

[Musicman20]

The main reason I love Ernie Ball Musicman basses comes down to tone. If you don't love the Ray tone, I'd leave it be.

[shizznit]

After a lengthy conversation with Jon Shuker during my order of my Uberhorn that is currently being built I asked him to recommend a pre-amp that gets as close to a MM tone as possible. He thinks that Seymour Duncan pre-amps are the closest he has heard and then some, so we went for that in the end (the bass will also have a single MM Delano pup in the same position as a Stingray). I obviously haven't received the bass yet, so I can't give any feedback about how that's going to work out, but I trust his experience and knowledge and hope the package will be spot on.

I have owned a Stingray and its my fav bass tone, but the only reason why I don't still play one is because they feel clumsy in my hands. I have a lot of friends that are bass players and some of them are not into the MM tone either. It's quite a focussed tone and quite unique. When you play it next to basses with J or P pups loaded you can hear a very distinct difference. Maybe the MM tone is not for you and your ears are becoming more refined to what you want.

[drTStingray]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1351362643' post='1850592']
I would very respectfully disagree.
There isn't anything very special about the body or the bridge etc.
[/quote]

I was quoting Sterling Ball on this - he has commented on the contribution the bridge design makes - those bolts go some way into the body.

Try the acoustic sound in the way I said - you'll be quite surprised. The other thing notable is the 'snap' of the strings when popping and slapping acoustically - it is stronger than say a P bass - thus contributing to that awesome slap/pop tone.


[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1351362643' post='1850592']
In fact, take that big MM humbucker and move it an inch towards the bridge, and you lose the Stingray. Move it an inch towards the neck, and you get a lovely meaty bassy mighty thump from it, but it does not sound like a Stingray. You will not hear a difference "acoustically".

I'd say a Stingray is by far mostly defined by that prticular pickup at that particular location. The preamp contributes to the variety of tonalities you can get, but as you say, even a passive 'Ray sounds like a 'Ray.
[/quote]

You are right regarding the pick up position - anyone who has used an HH or HS Stingray will be aware that the different coils make significantly different sounds simply from their position relative to the string length.

My real point was the Ray sound is the sum of a number of fundamental parts.

[Lfalex v1.1]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1351379714' post='1850751']
The main reason I love Ernie Ball Musicman basses comes down to tone. If you don't love the Ray tone, I'd leave it be.
[/quote]

There are alternatives, though;

Sandberg Ken Taylor
Warwick Fortress Masterman (sadly discontinued except as a custom order)

Plus other two pickup designs that aren't a million miles off, notably G&L, Warwick $$ and so on.

[throwoff]

I think I will go for an East when I get paid.

The bass has so much sentimental value and like I say has by far and away the best ergonomics of any bass I own it is worth trying a new Pre to maybe find the tone I want from it.

[EBS_freak]

Oh jeez.

[charic]

I wonder what EMG circuitry would do to a Musicman?

or Glockenlang... The Dingwall Super J uses Glockenlang iirc and it sounded mahooosive!

[throwoff]

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1351592037' post='1852903']
Oh jeez.
[/quote]

??

[Dingus]

When you say that you want to change the sound of the bass, how fundamentally do you want to change it? I suppose that different people have a different idea of what is the defining characteristic if the Stingray tone , but for me it is that springy, zingy upper -mid / lower treble coupled with a very noticable scoop in some of the low mids. Add in the big bottom and slicing treble available and you've got the sound of a Stingray. Musicman Stingrays have got a very peculiar frequency response ; that's why they sound a bit wierd compared to most other basses . Adding an East preamp ( be my guest) may offer some extra tone shaping options or a slightly different flavour to the sound, but my bet is that it will still leave your bass sounding like a Stingray. If you want your bass to sound like another type of bass i.e a Fender or Warwick or a Ken Smith then I fear that you will be dissappointed.

[EBS_freak]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1351607073' post='1853183']
When you say that you want to change the sound of the bass, how fundamentally do you want to change it? I suppose that different people have a different idea of what is the defining characteristic if the Stingray tone , but for me it is that springy, zingy upper -mid / lower treble coupled with a very noticable scoop in some of the low mids. Add in the big bottom and slicing treble available and you've got the sound of a Stingray. Musicman Stingrays have got a very peculiar frequency response ; that's why they sound a bit wierd compared to most other basses . Adding an East preamp ( be my guest) may offer some extra tone shaping options or a slightly different flavour to the sound, but my bet is that it will still leave your bass sounding like a Stingray. If you want your bass to sound like another type of bass i.e a Fender or Warwick or a Ken Smith then I fear that you will be dissappointed.
[/quote]

This.

Once a Stingray. Always a Stingray. You can dress it up with off the shelf electronics but the pickup type, position and construction means it's always going to be fundamentally Stingray. If you don't like that sound, then the Stingray is not for you. Modding is an option, like stated above - like putting in a P bass... but then you are in dodgy ground - butchering an instrument... and then it may not even give you what you want!

[shizznit]

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1351610582' post='1853229']
This.

Once a Stingray. Always a Stingray. You can dress it up with off the shelf electronics but the pickup type, position and construction means it's always going to be fundamentally Stingray. If you don't like that sound, then the Stingray is not for you. Modding is an option, like stated above - like putting in a P bass... but then you are in dodgy ground - butchering an instrument... and then it may not even give you what you want!
[/quote]

That's a very valid point. I have ruined a few basses by modding them and thus wasting a lot of money trying to get the bass to sound or even play differently with unsatisfying results. Sometimes you just need to buy the real McCoy if thats what you want. Or...order an instrument built to your specs.