Sandberg VM4 or Precision or....(UPDATE...Yamaha as it turned out)

[BluRay]

This is definately one of those daft questions to which the answer is to "go try one..."

I play in a punky rock band with plenty of bass going on. I joined the band in the summer, and I’m not sure that my Ray is quite sitting right in this context. There’s something about that inherent “sproing” sound that is jarring a bit. Actually that’s a bit unfair. I just think I may need slightly more of a conventional P sound, and have new-bass GAS.

I’ve been eyeing up the Sandberg California VM4 – which I think looks fantsastic and (theoretically) should be just the job – P/MM blend (I'm thinking mostly P), active/passive etc (I'm thinking active). Some good threads here recently. And I love the configurator thing on their site – which is great fun – and I always come back to the same config too, which is promising. But all the clips/ youtube demos I can find involve some pretty uninspiring jazzy solo noodling (nice!….er not really ) and don’t really give a sense of what this bass might be capable off. Will I be able to get a great big beefy snarly punchy sound out of said bass, or should I stop faffing about and get a P bass?

.….and yes I will go try one (!) I’m just collecting some opinions first. Any thoughts....

Edited November 25, 2012 by BluRay

[Ghost_Bass]

I'm loving my VM-5, it's not really a P or a MM, i would call it a mix of a super P with a super J, you can hear it's sound on my topic:
[url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/189796-nbd-sandberg-california-vm-5/page__st__20"]http://basschat.co.uk/topic/189796-nbd-sandberg-california-vm-5/page__st__20[/url]
you find the videos on the last posts.

Cheers

[BluRay]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1352466016' post='1863432']
I'm loving my VM-5, it's not really a P or a MM, i would call it a mix of a super P with a super J, you can hear it's sound on my topic:
[url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/189796-nbd-sandberg-california-vm-5/page__st__20"]http://basschat.co.u...-5/page__st__20[/url]
you find the videos on the last posts.

Cheers
[/quote]

Thanks - yes it was your thread that spiked my interest! Bass sounds great in that vid, And it looks a stunner. But I'm wondering if it would be a bit (....gropes for words...) polished for what I'm looking for which requires a more (...gropes for words again...) snarley bitey sound?

[Musicman20]

IMO, you can't beat the following for a good punk/hardcore bass tone:

Fender P Bass - no frills, just a good P bass. The new American Standards are great. Add some snarl from your amp or a pedal, (just a hair) and you are away.

Musicman Ray - Sounds more aggressive, cuts through like a knife, and really snarls. Personally, I think it works really well in a punk band. If you play fingerstyle, whack some flats on, drop the treble on the bass, bump the mids a fair bit and you've got a much more old school mid punch but with less snarl.

[dave_bass5]

There was a Squier CVP on here with a P-Reto in it going for £300 a week or so ago (it was withdrawn due ot no interest so i assume still available on request).

Being the owner of the same set up i can tell you that this combo will get all the tone you world need, and for a lot, lot less than even a second hand MIA.

[Mudpup]

I recently went thru a similar GAS scenario. Play a Spector Euro normally in a rocky punky covers band (Foos', Clash, Leon, Pistols sort of stuff) and thought i needed something a bit more traditional and precisiony sounding to suit the mix a bit better.

Decided i would need some sort of Precision bass.

Sat in PMT Romford for 2 hrs a few weeks ago (thanks Bob for your patience!) trying all sorts of Fender/Squier/Precision/Jazzy type basses from £200 to £800. The Squier CV's were almost there and i quite liked a Modern Player Jazz too. The MIM Precisions were ok but didnt feel they were hundreds of pounds better than the CV's.

The one that was absolutely head and shoulders better than all of them was a Yamaha BB424X. I wasnt even going to try it because i was sure i needed a Fender of some sort but i'm bloody glad i did.

Bought it on the spot and the guys in the band can,t believe how good it sounds for a £400 bass. It has a real resonance about it, the p pickup is pure grunty precision and the j pickup has a real honk to it. Mix the two and you have massive punch. The only downs so far are that the fret ends are a little sharp but thats easily sorted. Neck is somewhere inbetween a jazz and precision feel. Has a bit of meat about it but easy to grab hold of and hammer away on.

Try one if you can.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='BluRay' timestamp='1352466596' post='1863438']
Thanks - yes it was your thread that spiked my interest! Bass sounds great in that vid, And it looks a stunner. But I'm wondering if it would be a bit (....gropes for words...) polished for what I'm looking for which requires a more (...gropes for words again...) snarley bitey sound?
[/quote]

Na... it's all about my sound, on "valerie" i was using the blend pushed more towards the neck pickup and on "long train running" i was using a lot of the bridge pickup but in both songs i was also boosting the lows. The EQ on the mixer gave the final touch of removing some mid and high bite. I'm currently using a Barefaced Midget T who has lots of mid and treble so i end up taking some of that off on my amps EQ. Let me see if i can get another video with more growl on the bass so you can compare...

[Ghost_Bass]

Here's one were the growl is more noticeable, please don't mind that part just before the solo where my guitar player completely forgot to enter...

[url="http://youtu.be/RjCJKCzaKz8"]http://youtu.be/RjCJKCzaKz8[/url]

[TRBboy]

I owned a California PM4 for a while, and (as with any Sandberg IME) one thing you don't need to worry about I'd it not being gutsy enough! Yes, they can be tamed for jazzy noodling if you so wish, but they do a monster rock sound just great! Snarl, grit, bite, punch whatever you want to call it, it's there. They need to be considered as a PJ on steroids really - you can get a great Duff kinda sound with a pick! The P on its own is perfectly authentic, and when you bypass the pre and use the passive tone control, there's plenty of traditional sounds on offer too.

Beats the pants off a USA precision IMO!

[BluRay]

[quote name='TRBboy' timestamp='1352545705' post='1864401']
I owned a California PM4 for a while, and (as with any Sandberg IME) one thing you don't need to worry about I'd it not being gutsy enough! Yes, they can be tamed for jazzy noodling if you so wish, but they do a monster rock sound just great! Snarl, grit, bite, punch whatever you want to call it, it's there. They need to be considered as a PJ on steroids really - you can get a great Duff kinda sound with a pick! The P on its own is perfectly authentic, and when you bypass the pre and use the passive tone control, there's plenty of traditional sounds on offer too.

Beats the pants off a USA precision IMO!
[/quote]

Bugger. I was hoping to be talked out of it. This isn't helping.
Its exactly the monster played-with-pick rock sound that I'm after. I'm pretty sure I'd get with a precision. But frankly, a Berg just seems that bit more interesting..

Goddamn GAS

Any disadvantages compared to a precision (apart from the price difference)??

Any any thoughts on the PJ vs PM options?

[TRBboy]

PM is better IMHO. It behaves like a PJ, but the bridge pickup just has a bit more muscle, and doesn't suffer the weaknesses thaa J bridge pup can.

What's not to like? Nicer neck, better playability, better build quality, better sound, etc, etc. And they're about the same price aren't they? (or is the 'berg a bit cheaper?). Really can't complain for a hand built bass of this quality.

[ezbass]

Yeah the MM pickup on a 'Berg acts more like a really beefy J pickup. The P tone is spot on but if you feel like you're getting lost in the mix a bit, add a little bridge MM and you're sorted.

[Lozz196]

Precision - just right for a punk band.

[Musicman20]

This is my idea of punk with a Stingray:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqNjU3TJbys&feature=relmfu

Precision:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9iTNNi8Gh0

I like Sandbergs and I still want one, but they won't ever take away a proper P or Ray for me....especially a Ray.

[BluRay]

Thanks - well I've already got a Ray HH and no complaints at all about that - I love the build, feel and the sound. Especially with the two mid coils selected - which darkens the sound a little for my pick playing (pulls the tone closer to a H ray fingerstyle) I'm just finding it a little [i]too [/i]"MM" for the band I'm in. Can't help feeling that a P bass would suit better - but I'm struggling to concede that I "only" need a passive P bass! Sandberg might be the compromise....(already spent an hour today playing with the configerator on their website!!)

[dave_bass5]

This is just a GAS thread isn't it ;-)

[BluRay]

[quote name='dave_bass5' timestamp='1352576229' post='1864863']
This is just a GAS thread isn't it ;-)
[/quote]
There's no "just" when it comes to GAS.

[Jon65]

I have a Blackburst Sandberg PM4 for for sale right now if you're interested?
You can see it in the For Sale forum.
Jon
0795 119 8659

[dave_bass5]

A Blackburst PM5 would be my dream bass. I almost had one a few years ago but it had issues.

[ashevans09]

If you're interested I recorded a kind of paramore-y/punk/rock kind of thing for one of my old bands using my sandberg VM5 if you're interested in tone. Pretty basic line wise, but in the verses (or just skip to 1:03 in the song) the bass is pretty prominent.

http://soundcloud.com/disclosureofficial/letting-go-disclosure

Was recorded through both channels on a Mesa 400+ with a sansamp GT2 on one of them, into an Ampeg 810 and mic'd.

Hope that's of some help . Personally I love these basses, think they're awesome.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='BluRay' timestamp='1352583869' post='1864967']
There's no "just" when it comes to GAS.
[/quote] doesn't your Westone Thunder 1A in your sig have a P pickup on it? doesn't that get close?

[BluRay]

[quote name='Jon65' timestamp='1352740803' post='1866844']
I have a Blackburst Sandberg PM4 for for sale right now if you're interested?
You can see it in the For Sale forum.
Jon
0795 119 8659
[/quote]
Thanks Jon - I'm planning a tour of bass shops over the next few weeks to do some "proper" try before I buy

[BluRay]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1352768936' post='1867338']
doesn't your Westone Thunder 1A in your sig have a P pickup on it? doesn't that get close?
[/quote]
Yes the 1a sounds fab. But I want even fabber.

[BluRay]

[quote name='ashevans09' timestamp='1352768114' post='1867332']
If you're interested I recorded a kind of paramore-y/punk/rock kind of thing for one of my old bands using my sandberg VM5 if you're interested in tone. Pretty basic line wise, but in the verses (or just skip to 1:03 in the song) the bass is pretty prominent.

[url="http://soundcloud.com/disclosureofficial/letting-go-disclosure"]http://soundcloud.co...g-go-disclosure[/url]

Was recorded through both channels on a Mesa 400+ with a sansamp GT2 on one of them, into an Ampeg 810 and mic'd.

Hope that's of some help . Personally I love these basses, think they're awesome.
[/quote]

Yeah that's really helpful thanks. Sounds great. I've got the Sandberg bug!

[BluRay]

UPDATE!
[color=#454545][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3]following a visit to to the lovely-but-evil Bass Direct yesterday I walked out with....wait for it.... a Yamaha 2024x!!! Jet black and cool as hell.[/size][/font][/color]

[color=#454545][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3]Well as planned I tried the VM4 first, already convinced I was going to place my custom order (the candy apple red one in the store wasn't the one for me, and I'd got hooked on the custom configurator on their site). Anyhow....wow. What a superb instrument, and everything I was expecting. I was especially impressed with the neck which was so comfortable and fast, but without feeling skinny. Slightly more comfy than the neck on my Ray. Juuuust right. Kinda felt more like moulded plastic rather than wood (but in a good way, if that makes sense). Nice mid weight, felt substantial without being hefty. Amazing range of tones - but not especially MM from the bridge as might be expected. Super low action - but maybe a bit too much string rattle. Some easy adjustment would sort that out. Lovely rich P tone. I absolutely loved it. I reckon the 5 month waiting list is justified. [/size][/font][/color]

[color=#454545][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3]But then I tried the yammy. I'd guessed Mark might spring that on me - so was sort of prepared. I've played one before, so knew it might sway me. In fairness, terms of finish and feel there really wasn't much in it. Both basses were fantastic. But after about an hour switching between them, I found I kept trying to make the sandberg sound like the yamaha. Seemed the 2024 was the sound in my head. It was a very tough call. I wanted both. Also - the Yammy is quite assertive and just knows its tone. You plug it in and there it is. Take it or leave it. The VM4 is clearly more versitile, but the downside of that is quite a lot of fiddling arround to find the sound I was looking for. Dare say I'd have it sussed given more time - so in no way a bad thing. But the yammy just grabbed me by the throat and that was that. [/size][/font][/color]

[color=#454545][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3]I'd done my homework before visiting the store and think I got a fair price from Mark (I actually don't think there would have been [i]too much [/i]in it price wise between the two - by the time I'd spec-ed the sandberg and got carried away with the extras), and great buying experience all round. Mark knows his products sell themselves - and customers just need a little time to come to their on conclusions, with just a little advice and gentle guidance.[/size][/font][/color]

[color=#454545][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3]My only slight uncertainty is around the level of buzz that the j pup introduces - very pronounced soloed, and also "there" with both pups together. That might just be my paranoia! We shall see.[/size][/font][/color]


[color=#454545][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=3]Anyway so far I'm very happy. And poor. Band practice tonight!!! Pics and discription to follow at some point.[/size][/font][/color]