Just ordered my first EUB total noob what have I done?!

[stingrayPete1977]

I have read a few posts and got some good advice from them already but most were more should I go for a DB or an EUB? threads or ended up that way anyway. I certainly have not got the room for a DB so thats easy and I drive a '57 Morris Minor saloon not traveller anyway. Over time who knows but for now EUB and not too much outlay so I'm afraid its a Stagg rather than a NS but I am happy to buy a better one if I can get a tune out of this one.

So where do I start?

And I mean literally, I have no idea!

[Clarky]

First thing first. Get a lesson booked. There's bound to be a BCer that teaches DB in your area. It will be invaluable in getting your hand/arm positions correct and make it a lot easier from that point on. The larger left hand stretches will be a challenge but you will quickly adapt. Have fun!

[stingrayPete1977]

pm already sent to Doddy Thanks Clarky, do you think the Stagg will be any good to learn on or will it either put me off or having me gassing for either a better eub or even a DB?

[Clarky]

I had a Stagg briefly. Its actually a very good EUB but its not 'the real deal'. If you have a hankering for a big old DB at some point (as I did) this will be just a (very useful) stop on the way. If you just want to stick to EUB then its obviously not up to the quality of a NS or similar but it is a remarkably good value-for-money instrument and you can do all your learning on it. If it works out and you love it, I bet you will look to upgrade but that would be the GAS monster as much as anything else!

Edited December 15, 2012 by Clarky

[stingrayPete1977]

I guess what I want to know, and it sounds promising then, is if I learn to play the Stagg would I then be able to transfer the skill to a real DB or a better EUB and play it with some kind of conviction?

[Clarky]

Short answer: yes. Double basses obviously are physically more challenging and the body/neck join demands different technique past E on the G string but the basic right hand technique will be identical and the hand stretches with the left hand in the lower positions will be near-identical (depending on how chunky the DB neck is)

[stingrayPete1977]

Thats great then

I fancy reading more too so obviously that will be good to go hand in hand, I am a novice reader so can you or anyone else suggest any books or pieces worth getting hold of? something nice and steady and fairly simple to follow or at least be able to simplify for now.

A lot of people are talking about changing the cheap strings on them straight away, again I have no idea! Like no idea at all, after playing bass for 25 years nearly you would think I would of learnt something but this is a new thing alltogether, might aswell be asking about surfing or darts!

Edited December 15, 2012 by stingrayPete1977

[TPJ]

Congrats on the EUB, great stuff. Like Clarky mentioned, getting lessons will help you a great deal and your tutor might also be able to look the instrument up and down to make sure it's in good shape and they might also recommend some better strings. Depends on the tone you're after. Good luck and have fun.

[stingrayPete1977]

Thanks TPJ, I have no idea what I like but I guess I will start listening much more now! I'm not really a jazz cat but would likt to have a dabble, I'm not really a rockabilly fan either but again I will give it ago although I know eubs are not known for being much use for that, on the other hand I was listening to some Gary Karr clips on you tube, made me want a bow! Is their a budget bow worth buying?

So many questions, sorry

[4-string-thing]

I had a Stagg for a while, really enjoyed it. I was like you, had no idea at all, but I bought mine from Normans in Burton Upon Trent and was able to have a good play before I bought. I got on ok, enjoyed it and bought it. I reckon a couple of informal lessons with a BC'er would be a great idea, wish I had done it.

Out of interest, I found the stock strings to be ok (at least for the time I owned the bass) I never had any problems with the battery usage or the rattling end pin either! I was in PMT in Birmingham the other day and they had an Eastwood (same bass, different name on headstock) and it looked nowhere near as well set up as the Stagg.

Sadly, I didn't use my bass much and sold it on BC after about 18 months. I was toying with buying another one, but ended up buying a bargain DB from 4stringfortress a few weeks ago and am now going through the learning process all over again.

[stingrayPete1977]

Sounds ideal then, how are you getting on with the proper db?

[apa]

Im realy pleased with mine but you do have to do a bit of setting up to get them going.

1. Cut the nut so the strings are nice and low on the board. This will make it much easier to play straight since they are big tough old birds to grapple with.

2. I had to cut the D and A notches in the bridge so the contour matched the board.

3. I also wrapped some padding around the post to stop a rattle.

4. The power problem with the pre was cured a long time ago on the early ones so dont worry about that.

5. I swapped the strings straight off. The stock were bent and lumpy so useless.

6. It takes a bit of EQ to get a good sound out of it. Boost lower mids and upper treble. Cut the lower bass. Dont bother with the 'Bass boost'.

7. Have a good read of the Stagg EUB Mega Thread on TB.

8. A few have been prone to the machine heads snapping if knocked. Mine have been fine and stock cheapos can be used to replace the ears and stems. Only the posts are bespoke.

9. Its an expensive hobby - Look at the price of strings just for starters so dont go getting too much GAS

I think thats covers what I did with it.

A

[Clarky]

On books and reading, the classic tutor book is SImandl which teaches the various left hand positions but also bores a lot of people (me included) to death. Lots recommend Rufus Reid's Evolving Bassist http://www.amazon.co.uk/Evolving-Bassist-Rufus-Reid/dp/0967601509/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1355593614&sr=1-1

The following link is to a good cheap book with melodies from well known jazz and big band songs transcribed for double bass, so it has the benefit that you are playing recognisable melodies rather than painful (albeit necessary) scale type stuff http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mckee-Andy-Jazz-Bass-Double/dp/1423489535

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='apa' timestamp='1355592633' post='1900363']
Im realy pleased with mine but you do have to do a bit of setting up to get them going.

1. Cut the nut so the strings are nice and low on the board. This will make it much easier to play straight since they are big tough old birds to grapple with.

2. I had to cut the D and A notches in the bridge so the contour matched the board.

3. I also wrapped some padding around the post to stop a rattle.

4. The power problem with the pre was cured a long time ago on the early ones so dont worry about that.

5. I swapped the strings straight off. The stock were bent and lumpy so useless.

6. It takes a bit of EQ to get a good sound out of it. Boost lower mids and upper treble. Cut the lower bass. Dont bother with the 'Bass boost'.

7. Have a good read of the Stagg EUB Mega Thread on TB.

8. A few have been prone to the machine heads snapping if knocked. Mine have been fine and stock cheapos can be used to replace the ears and stems. Only the posts are bespoke.

9. Its an expensive hobby - Look at the price of strings just for starters so dont go getting too much GAS

I think thats covers what I did with it.

A
[/quote]
Looks like I am going to be busy! Just how low should I get the strings to the board at the nut? I don't want to overdo it.
Hopefully I can get on with the strings for now until the pot looks a bit fuller, but what should I be putting on it?
Thanks

Edited December 15, 2012 by stingrayPete1977

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='Clarky' timestamp='1355593673' post='1900387']
On books and reading, the classic tutor book is SImandl which teaches the various left hand positions but also bores a lot of people (me included) to death. Lots recommend Rufus Reid's Evolving Bassist http://www.amazon.co.uk/Evolving-Bassist-Rufus-Reid/dp/0967601509/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1355593614&sr=1-1

The following link is to a good cheap book with melodies from well known jazz and big band songs transcribed for double bass, so it has the benefit that you are playing recognisable melodies rather than painful (albeit necessary) scale type stuff http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mckee-Andy-Jazz-Bass-Double/dp/1423489535
[/quote]
That evolving book looks worth having anyway, had a look inside and its very comprehensive, history types of bows and strings the lot.See what santa brings

[apa]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1355595023' post='1900423']
Looks like I am going to be busy! Just how low should I get the strings to the board at the nut? I don't want to overdo it.
Hopefully I can get on with the strings for now until the pot looks a bit fuller, but what should I be putting on it?
Thanks
[/quote]

Well Im no luither but I treated it like any other fretless. I eventually cut them to zero and it plays all the better for it. Strings are an each to his own thing of course but since this was all new to me I plumped for some TI Spirocore's. I figured they were the 'industry standard' so to speak. OK........... sitting down?..................... £130 to you squire

A

[stingrayPete1977]

Cool I will see what its like and file them down a bit at a time then, I have factored in about a ton for strings as and when so I'm not too far off. The next bass up looks like the ns nxt at about £800 which I could go to in a year or so if things are going well, I'm sure I could sell the stagg with the probable mods and proper strings on here to put towards it too.

[Clarky]

Don't rush to change the strings, they might be just fine. And if you do want to change them, check the DB for sale forum in BassChat first as there are bargains to be had

[stingrayPete1977]

My teacher should be able to tell me if they are ok or not, what about a bow then?

[philparker]

I've only been playing for about 10 weeks now, but I might be in a position to comment on a few things as a fellow-newbie to DB. After buying my acoustic DB I've spent a small fortune on music and assessories etc. but I am still loving every minute of it and looking back over the comparatively short period there's not much I would change.

[quote]
The following link is to a good cheap book with melodies from well known jazz and big band songs transcribed for double bass, so it has the benefit that you are playing recognisable melodies rather than painful (albeit necessary) scale type stuff [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mckee-Andy-Jazz-Bass-Double/dp/1423489535"][color="#0f72da"]http://www.amazon.co...e/dp/1423489535[/color][/url]
[/quote]


I was a bit disappointed with this book as I prefer to practise what I will be eventually be playing - the bass line - so it doesn't get much of a look in - although I did enjoy playing [i]Autumn Leaves[/i]. The Evolving Bassist is an excellent book, but it is should also be taken as a long-term reference and study book and not a starter's book nor a beginner's progressive book as there is so much mnore music you have to learn and study in between the pieces and studies offered in this edition. It is a must buy, though!

I took lessons from Day one - to prevent be forming any bad habits - and I take lessons every two weeks and will continue to do so until I change musical direction, i.e. I currently learn with everything (lesson-wise) the bow and about 10 - 20% of my own stuff as pizz (things I might play in a band), but when I am competent enough that ratio will reverse. I am learning scales to ABRSM and the main books I am using for repertoire are the Keith Hartley [i]Double Bass Solos; [/i]Rodney Slatford [i]Time Pieces 1 & 2; [/i][i]Suzuki Bass School 3 [/i]and Angela Schofield's [i]Amazing Solos for Double Bass.[/i] I suppose I'm fortunate that I already read music and can concentrate on technique, but if you are learning to read music, most of these repertoire books are at the lower grades (1 -5) and a progressive study would also improve your music reading ability.

[stingrayPete1977]

Cheers the lower the better, how simple is grade 1? I have no idea what level I am at.

[apa]

[quote name='Clarky' timestamp='1355598572' post='1900500']
Don't rush to change the strings, they might be just fine. And if you do want to change them, check the DB for sale forum in BassChat first as there are bargains to be had
[/quote]
[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1355599775' post='1900519']
My teacher should be able to tell me if they are ok or not, what about a bow then?
[/quote]

Absolutely. I only changed mine since they literaly did have lumps in the winding. They still arent of a high quality but what do you expect.

A

[philparker]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1355601670' post='1900544']
Cheers the lower the better, how simple is grade 1? I have no idea what level I am at.
[/quote]

The good thing about using the grading system, in any discipline of music, is that it is gradually progressive and progression should become natural if you follow it and subsequently more efficient and will not leave any gaps in your ability - that I see so often in musicians who have tried to fast track to the top without getting the basics right: that follows not just for music but any other vocation in life!

If you are going to see "Doddy" for some lessons and advice then I would suggest waiting to see what he recommends in terms of music and direction etc. and stick to that without distraction - although I've not met him, the few posts of his that I have read mirror my own thoughts on learning, reading and study etc. and I would suggest you are making the right decision?!

[stingrayPete1977]

If money was no object I would go see him every week, its also a 45 minute drive away. I have had a few lessons off him on electric bass but mostly regarding reading, he didnt seam to think my playing was too bad which is nice as his is very good! I'm hoping I can follow a regime better with upright as its totally new and try and get better at reading/theory, after all the years playing and gigging electric bass its hard not to try and miss out the easy stuff.

I might look for a local class but I'm not sure anything useful exists, also I currently have a broken arm but the cast is coming off on monday! No point having a lesson until I have the strength to play it but hopefully in the new year I will be sorted.

I'm waiting for a reply from doddy, I bet he is working as this is his busy time with the shows so I won't badger him

[philparker]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1355606627' post='1900607']
If money was no object I would go see him every week, its also a 45 minute drive away.[/quote]

That's what happens when you get into a niche market...you have to be prepared to travel, but it is the same for everybody - even Scott Devine got on the plane to Spain to have bass lessons with Gary Willis, but that's takes when you've got determination and direction!

I spent 4 years travelling 45 minutes for a lesson with a concert guitar player and considered myself very lucky, but I would also say the more advanced you get the longer you can take in between lessons and reduce to fortnightly or monthly - even 6-monthly - depending upon what you want to achieve? However, it doesn't matter what level you are - we all need coaching...even the greatest players in the world whether that is music; tennis; golf; football - the world No. 1 always has a coach...and so should we all, as musicians!