Calling all GB Streamliner & BF Super Twelve users!

[thebrig]

Ok, I have had the Genz Benz Streamliner 9.0, and Barefaced Super twelve for just over a month now, and I know that individually, they are both superb pieces of kit.

But together, I am having problems getting the sound I require, it sounds very warm and pleasing, but I just want to tighten things up a bit, and overcome the boomyness.

I've read that most other users are very pleased with their tones they get from this combination, so I was wondering if you might share, or give me some insight into what settings you are using on the amp.

At the moment I have not gigged with them yet, but have had a few quite loud rehearsals with the rig (maybe it's enclosed room causing the problems?)

We play a lot of Dr Feelgood numbers, some classic rock (not metal), southern rock, and some blues

Any ideas tips would be most welcome.

Thanks.


Edit: [b][i]I am using an American Standard Precision bass through the rig.[/i][/b]

Edited December 17, 2012 by thebrig

[Musicman20]

Hi there!

I do not have a BF cab, sorry, but I do have a Streamliner 900.

My persepctive of the Streamliner is this - its a very classic bass tone, lots of rich low end, and a fanstastic treble control, (I don't play much slap but when I did with this amp the top end was perfect). The mids are slightly scooped, (as is the same with a lot of amps eg GK) when everything is a 12.

Roll the bass back a smidge, and boost the mids to 1/2, and you are pretty much at flat. But, it doesn't really matter with this amp where you put the controls, especially the mids and treble, as it sounds nice even at extremes.

Am I right in thinking that the Super Twelve has a fair bit of mid punch as it is?

If so, it should ying yang well with this amp.

I used the Streamliner 900 with a 5 string Ray HS for this first time last night, and the B sounded stunning. Clear, thick, punchy, and balanced. No mud. I did have the bass at 12, and the mids boosted on the middle setting to about 2. The onboard EQ was all at 12...no boost or cut.

I was tempted to try something new and sell the Streamliner, but then I realised how good it sounds, how great it looks, the low weight, and the excellent DI/headphone/aux in, etc. It is a total hammer of a head. As they say on the marketing, it actually does sound like a high end studio pre.

[Paul S]

Streamliner 600 into Barefaced Compact plus Midget.

Pre-valve change on the GB - I had everything on the amp set at 12 o'clock except the mid level, which is 9 o'clock. That is with the mid selector at 600. Whatever that means. Post valve change I think the gain is going to be different but nothing else.

For most stuff I play - classic heavy rock - when using a SBMM SB-14 I have the on-board 3 band eq bass and treble *just* the + side of the indent and the mids *just* below except for one or two tracks where I fiddle about.

So you have guessed I prefer a mid scoop sound. From reading on here about boosting mids to cut through I always used to assume it was a foible of mine and no-one in the audience would hear me but I've had a few people say nice things about the bass sound (but not the playing) when set up in this way.

[thebrig]

Thanks for the replies so far guys/gals.

I recorded yesterdays rehearsal, and whilst I had concerns in the room at the time, on playing the recording back, the bass really cut through ok, and sounded quite sweet to me.

So it will probably sound fine out front in a live situation.

[4 Strings]

Use mine pretty much flat with a Compact or a Midget, perhaps a little bass off to reduce boominess, for mid I use it at 200Hz and boost it a little to add a little punch.

[wateroftyne]

I couldn't get a sound I liked with the Streamliner. Too big down low, to unfocusedd in the mids.

[hamfist]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1357109477' post='1917508']
I couldn't get a sound I liked with the Streamliner. Too big down low, to unfocusedd in the mids.
[/quote]

Me too, after several months of trying. It defo has a certain tonal, pillowy, mid-scooped, signature that no amount of EQ fiddling will remove. If you boost one mid frequency area, another will be lacking.
Clearly some folks love the tones it gives, and it is a fine product. However, it is what it is, and you cannot escape it's characteristic tone without a shedload of external EQ.
If anyone is struggling at all to get the tones they want with the amp I would personally suggest trying elsewhere.

[Muzz]

I use mine with a Schroeder 1515L, and the Schroeder's natural low-mid bump and shyness in the lows seems to suit the Streamliner - I actually boost the lows on the head and it rounds out the cab better than most amps I've had. I sold my Mesa (and my Spyder 550) once I'd had a good play with the Streamliner, which just goes to show how individual our tonal tastes/requirements are.

To the OP, I'd wait until you've heard the combination in some different rooms/positions before pronouncing on it - have you tried cab positioning/isolation in the rehearsal room? I use isolating foam more often than not these days to reduce boom at gigs - I've never seen the need for a Gramma Pad - as good as I'm sure they are - because a couple of sheets of foam do the job for me.

Edited January 2, 2013 by Muzz

[Japhet]

I use a Streamliner 600 through a TechSoundsystems 2x12 which is a similar setup to yours. I've only had 'boom' issues on larger hollow stages but I have a foam rubber pad to go under the cab now which does the job. I'd also suggest using a long lead so you can get away from the cab for a listen at gigs - it usually sounds better than you think when you're up close.

[4 Strings]

'Scooped' is not a word I'd use to describe my Streamliner. Maybe using it through the BF cabs makes the difference.

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1357166325' post='1918667']
'Scooped' is not a word I'd use to describe my Streamliner. Maybe using it through the BF cabs makes the difference.
[/quote]

The HS210s I run are very even across the middle, and I could hear it. That said, I liked it far more than the other lightweights I've used.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='4 Strings' timestamp='1357166325' post='1918667']
'Scooped' is not a word I'd use to describe my Streamliner. Maybe using it through the BF cabs makes the difference.
[/quote]

Me neither. A lot of classic tube amps have a slight mid dip...and it can be rectified by moving two knobs ever so slightly on the Streamliner.

[skychaserhigh]

My streamliner and vanderkley rig is definitely not scooped , very full and punchy sound.
This rig just works so well in the band mix without breaking a sweat .

[Sibob]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1357109477' post='1917508']
I couldn't get a sound I liked with the Streamliner. Too big down low, to unfocusedd in the mids.
[/quote]

This for me too! Even with my Barefaced......my Markbass LMII does the trick no issue though

Si

[Musicman20]

I really like a tight low end. I'm not into boomy bass tones. I can't see, unless it bass specific, where the issue is with the bass control on the Streamliner. Simply roll it back to about 10 o'clock. Done. Mids at 1/2, done. That's pretty much flat. Plenty of scope to boost the mids to crazy amounts. The 'everything at 12' that Markbass seemed to make popular isn't really any different. I found that the low control on the LM3 was at too low a freq really, and the low mid wasn't setup for the 'meat' area of low mids.

It might be bass specific. None of my cabs seem to have a mid dip from my playing before having the Streamliner.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1357109477' post='1917508']
I couldn't get a sound I liked with the Streamliner. Too big down low, to unfocusedd in the mids.
[/quote]

Same here, even with my mid heavy cab.

Actually IIR it was your video that sold me on it in the first place lol. I quickly went back to MarkBass.

Edited January 3, 2013 by dave_bass5

[thebrig]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Thanks again for the replies so far guys/gals.[/font][/color]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I now have a [/font][/color][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Gramma Pad which I'm going to try at the next rehearsal, hopefully it will make some difference.[/font][/color]
[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]As we are a new band, we don't intend starting gigging until around March/April time, so I wont be in a situation to try it live until then.[/font][/color]

[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]If it is the Streamliner that's causing the problem, what head would work well with the Barefaced Super 12 in your opinions, baring in mind, I am using an American Standard Precision, and we play classic/southern rock, some Dr Feelgood/pub-rock and blues.[/font][/color]

[Sibob]

I'm also using passive Jazz/Precision combos and really didn't like the Streamliner (not even mentioning the 3 different volume knobs).

As someone also said, I quickly went back to my Markbass, which I pretty much run 'all at 12', apart from the VPF/VLE which get run about 8oclock or 9oclock

Si

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1357215165' post='1919121']
I really like a tight low end. I'm not into boomy bass tones. I can't see, unless it bass specific, where the issue is with the bass control on the Streamliner. Simply roll it back to about 10 o'clock. Done. Mids at 1/2, done. That's pretty much flat. Plenty of scope to boost the mids to crazy amounts. The 'everything at 12' that Markbass seemed to make popular isn't really any different. I found that the low control on the LM3 was at too low a freq really, and the low mid wasn't setup for the 'meat' area of low mids.

It might be bass specific. None of my cabs seem to have a mid dip from my playing before having the Streamliner.
[/quote]

My main problem with the Streamliner was how it holds together. I could hear it, but like the TC RH450 (albeit not as severely) at volume it seemed to lose its shape. Something to do with the power management, maybe? I spent a year on it, tweaking it at every gig. All boooooom, and no b*****ks.

In the meantime, plenty of other owners were posting about how much they liked it, so I just decided it wasn't to my taste.

I'm back in the bosom of the Walkabout, which (in brochure-speak, at least) has nowhere near the output, but holds itself together with such steely resolve I don't have to be loud to be felt and heard.

Edited January 3, 2013 by wateroftyne

[brensabre79]

I've never had this issue with my Shuttle / S12, quite the reverse actually, but the Shuttle does have a bit of LF rolloff built in - I'm not sure the Streamliner is the same in this regard. I run mine pretty much flat, but with the LF boost on.

FWIW a number of modern cabs actually have a low mid hump in the frequency response to get the on-stage sound nice and punchy. It makes the cab seem louder and clearer, but sacrifices true bottom end. Schroeder cabs have a particularly prominent mid hump. Wheras older, bigger cabs tend to be slightly scooped (e.g. Ampeg fridge). I think this is because the older valve amps actually have a lot of mid-range in them when driven, wheras the modern transistor amps don't so much. The BFB cabs are far more flat and even in response than most, so depending on what you're used to, it might take some adjusting. I think the Streamliers are aiming for that classic valve sound but are designed to be paired with modern cabs that have a bit of a low-mid hump, so you may find reducing the very low bass but boosting a bit of the lower midrange will get the sound you're after...

[dave_bass5]

I too use a Gramma pad, and it did help. When i was researching the Streamliner i came across a lot fo people saying they have the low knob at about 9-10 o'clock. I thought it was strange that so many people were backing the low end off but after getting mine i realised why they were doing it. Its very powerful. I expect paired with the right cab its just fine but i didnt find it to be as tight or focused as with my MB heads.
I had decided to go back to MB and was going to do a straight swap with Clarky for his MB F1. i took both out on a weekends worth of gigs, used one per set over two nights and decided the F1 was more adaptable in the venues we played. I could get the tone i wanted a lot quicker, almost by leaving the MB EQ set flat. What also surprised me was i liked the tone of the Streamliner as well so ended up keeping both for a while.
It took me a few more gigs to decided that while i liked the tone i could get from the Streamliner it was a lot of hard work in some of the venues we play, as they have horrible hollow stages and even the Gramma pad couldn't help the Streamliner much.

[Muzz]

Was this with your Schroeder? I have the bass on 2-3 o'clock with mine!

[dave_bass5]

Yes, my 1212L. As i said, its probably more to do with the stages we were playing on. I did a couple of Marquee gigs and did have to turn the low up past 12 o'clock for those but i also felt i was running out of clean tone as the clipping lights were flashing away.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1357218439' post='1919208']
My main problem with the Streamliner was how it holds together. I could hear it, but like the TC RH450 (albeit not as severely) at volume it seemed to lose its shape. Something to do with the power management, maybe? I spent a year on it, tweaking it at every gig. All boooooom, and no b*****ks.

In the meantime, plenty of other owners were posting about how much they liked it, so I just decided it wasn't to my taste.

I'm back in the bosom of the Walkabout, which (in brochure-speak, at least) has nowhere near the output, but holds itself together with such steely resolve I don't have to be loud to be felt and heard.
[/quote]

Hmm, not sure what it will be.. I've had the Genz INCREDIBLY loud, and then RH450 (when I had it) was used in a few rock bands. I've also had the Genz Smax blasting out with a punk band I was trying to get going in the summer. I've not noticed a problem with transients, or a 'fuller tone'. I think the amount of power on tap with the Streamliner is quite ridiculous. It is like an absolute HAMMER. I do tend to make sure I get a really healthy amount of input gain, but obviously if it needs to be clean, its a case of a little tweaking.

One explanation is obviously the Walkabout is perfect for you! Which it is for many. If Mesa ever decide to make a new version with speakons, a few more options on the DI, and perhaps upto 500W, then it would sell like CRAZY. Obviously they don't need to...as the Walkabout is a legendary amp.

Another thing, which I might not have experienced as I was usually using practice room cabs, (quite large ones) is that the power of the Streamliner was causing your cabs to start to compress as they couldn't take the full whack, which is totally understandable for any 2x10. I'm very cautious with the Streamliner as it really is a hammer.

Of course, you also might not like it, which again is why we have so much choice

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1357226366' post='1919377']
Another thing, which I might not have experienced as I was usually using practice room cabs, (quite large ones) is that the power of the Streamliner was causing your cabs to start to compress as they couldn't take the full whack, which is totally understandable for any 2x10.
[/quote]

It's not an issue with the cabs. I think it's more a power management thing - the architecture just doesn't ring my bell. Bear in mind I had about 100 gigs over a period of a year to refine it and 'get used' to it, and a similar amount with the wretched (IMO) TC. The Streamliner was marginally more successful.

It's a matter of taste, innit.