stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 (edited) Morning everyone! OK so a few days have passed since my Stagg arrived and its going well to be honest, as I still have a really bad wrist recovering from a surgical repair I am doing much better than I thought I would, a few songs from our set are almost gig ready, Love Cats, a few Paloma Faith songs, Valerie, 9-5, Moves Like Jagger etc which are just the songs I thought could work on the upright and I think they sound pretty good tbf. So from there I have started reading practice at the same time which I only got started on less than 2 years ago anyway so I am a novice at both! I have a TC Polytune and its brilliant for checking to see how well you are hitting the notes as its so fast and accurate it can swap around even when playing fairly fast pizz. Sometimes I am right in the zone and playing something like Lay Down Sally across all four strings and the polytune is just firing them out then as I get tired it starts to slip Anyway I am rambling again, what I want to know is how near to the fingerboard I should take the nut slots down to make fingering the first semitones from the nut easier? My Stagg does not appear to be as bad as others have mentioned and mainly its the A string that is sitting up a bit higher than the rest, by the time I am up to the next semi tones F#- B-E-A its not too bad and really just my lack of time playing Db that are holding me back which I am working on. I have my set of files at the ready and the wife is at work all day so any advice would be more than welcome Edited December 24, 2012 by stingrayPete1977 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monckyman Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 You need to consult MDP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 (edited) Is this this guy that ruins stuff on eBay or something (Edit- MDP bass works portland? ) Here is a pic the best I can get it Edited December 24, 2012 by stingrayPete1977 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarah thomas Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 There's a lot of useful stuff here: http://dennishavlena.com/bassetup.htm with links to pictures too. Happy Christmas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 Thanks for that I will have a peek after lunch, Thanks and a Merry Christmas to you too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRev Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 The nut slots on my Eminence are about the depth/thickness of a business card - I think that's about as low as it can go before you get loads of buzzing. Bear in mind that your fingerboard will have to have the right profile lengthwise to get the setup as low as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisnameistaken Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 [quote name='TheRev' timestamp='1356349817' post='1909357'] The nut slots on my Eminence are about the depth/thickness of a business card - I think that's about as low as it can go before you get loads of buzzing. Bear in mind that your fingerboard will have to have the right profile lengthwise to get the setup as low as possible. [/quote] This is worth bearing in mind. If the board is set up for a nut at that height it might not go any lower without buzzing. I would have a professional do the job if I were you - at least they can shoot the fingerboard at the same time if they need to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 A they have a painted board I guess you can't really re profile the board? I have took them to about 1mm and all is good so I will leave it at that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLoydElgar Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Hey Pete, Work more on shaping your hand 1--23-4 in the lower register of the bass as people saying that it's an even gap between 1-23-4 is wrong from a intonation point. PLaying with the polytune is great, however please use your ear first and check against the open strings or harmonics then to check everything with the tuner... i.e Gstring - 0G 1A 4B... (the numbers are the fingers...) 1A check against 0D 4B against Dstr 1E ( really stretch that first finger!) goodluck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 The clip I was watching suggested 1st finger then 2nd finger and 3&4 together, would you advise against that then? As I still have only maybe 25% of the movement in my wrist at the moment I am trying not to worry too much and at the same time not get in to any bad habits (hard I know), once I feel I can move it a lot better I will have a few lessons which are already lined up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLoydElgar Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Link me the clip please! I'm suggesting what I have been told and have for practiced for many hours... which has paid off with very good lower left hand technique. So... I am passing on what I am told... I still practice it every day... as I'd rather not worry about the intonation and just play the music... Iam not perfect but work very hard on it all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 Well this is one clip where he suggests not using the 3rd finger at all then contradicts himself by elastic banding it to the 2nd after a while? [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZ4ctFAe7r0"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZ4ctFAe7r0[/url] I will go with what your saying but I cant really bend my wrist round enough yet so getting the stretches is harder than it would of been before damaging my wrist, its a bit of a double edge sword as learning now might make me develop bad habits that I can't avoid but at the same time its probably getting my mobility back faster than watching TV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 I cant find the guy who said to use the 3rd & 4th together now, probably for the best! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beer of the Bass Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 The 1-2-4 fingering (with the 4th finger supported by the 3rd) is from the Simandl method, one of the older standard texts. I was taught to use this fingering when I started playing, and I still do it. IIRC Ray Brown's book was based around this fingering system too, so it definitely has its adherents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 Nothing is simple is it! For a beginner what would be the easiest method to give me a reasonable grounding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLoydElgar Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 @ 3mins 26 is the shape I'm talking about 1--23-4, however, when he mentions the distance between 1-2-4 being the same is not true in the half position. hence why I use 1--23-4... Now you can follow 1-2-4 but you'll never have precision. Now if you want to experience this (pick up our tuner then pick up the double bass) find Gsharp using 1st finger on the G string then use 2nd finger for A (a semitone away) then 4th finger for Bb then look at your hand... I will bet you my bryant, the distance between finger 1-2-4 are not the same. You have to stretch finger one more than 2-4 for Perfect intonation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 I will probably struggle to stretch that far at the moment, I will give it a try. I am already using my pinky on its own so I will continue to try and do the 1 23 4 method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLoydElgar Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 Its more the space between the 1st and 2nd which requires the stretch, your 3rd finger is redundant so you can stretch it to the 4th but it naturally sits next to the 2nd... You only have to practice this for 1 min x5 times a hours (worth of practice) 3 times a day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLoydElgar Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 To follow my last comment, buy this DVD, this will answer all of your bass questions! - http://www.amazon.co.uk/DVD-Double-Bass-Techniques-Number/dp/B007HWGKXA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1356438303&sr=8-1 He is my favorite soloist/tutor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLoydElgar Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 Merry Christmas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Martin Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 Just saw this and thought i might be able to help. The main thing to remember about the top nut is that as soon as you put your finger on the string to make a note the height of the top nut becomes irrelevant so the height of the nut only affects the open strings. I find in most instances that all players like it as low as you can go. In fact some people have it so low that when they play an open string it can buzz a little but it makes pushing the strings down really comfortable and almost effortless when you play the bass. The other two factors are the height of the bridge as if this is very low then if you really lower the top nut you might get a buzz on the open strings, the other thing to take into account is the tension of the strings you are using. I have found oftern that i have to raise or lower the top nut if i change strings on basses as low tension ones will move more when played so are more likely to hit the board causing a buzz. With high tension arco strings i put the top nut litrally just a hair off the board on the G string moving up towards 1mm on the E side. Hope this helps. All the best George Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 25, 2012 Author Share Posted December 25, 2012 (edited) Thanks George that sounds sensible, I have set the bridge to about the same as people are saying in the string height thread, 8mm on the E falling to 6mm on the G, I have filed the nut down on each string to about a mm and its pretty good, easier to play and only has a rattle on the G about the same as it was before filing anyway which is probably a case of skimming the board really but very minor for my ability! Good point about strings too, I will leave it as is until I have new strings in the new year as no one knows what tension these are Edited December 25, 2012 by stingrayPete1977 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted December 25, 2012 Author Share Posted December 25, 2012 [quote name='FLoydElgar' timestamp='1356438356' post='1910207'] To follow my last comment, buy this DVD, this will answer all of your bass questions! - http://www.amazon.co.uk/DVD-Double-Bass-Techniques-Number/dp/B007HWGKXA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1356438303&sr=8-1 He is my favorite soloist/tutor! [/quote] Thanks Floyd, I have lots of books and dvds to look into buying next year I will check that one out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLoydElgar Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 It's nice to see a professional Luthier take the time to help people out on this forum! regards to that DVD... I own it and its very well thought out and each part of the DVD follows onto the next... Rather than someone who is well known saying play this exercise and increase speed to unlock the realms of virtuosity... Its simple and direct, gain some better understandings of the double bass and then conjure up some double bass questions for lessons with professionals in the future... Even try Thomas Martin's online Skype lessons that are now on offer, I posted it a pages ago and I believe someone had a lesson or two from there so... Might be worth it... As Tom is one of the best! anyways Good luck and Merry Christmas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisnameistaken Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 [quote name='George Martin' timestamp='1356453770' post='1910318'] Just saw this and thought i might be able to help. The main thing to remember about the top nut is that as soon as you put your finger on the string to make a note the height of the top nut becomes irrelevant so the height of the nut only affects the open strings. [/quote] I guess a high nut could also affect your intonation to some extent but it would have to be pretty high to have a big effect. I've only ever had that problem on a cheap soprano uke though, not a double bass... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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