Alembic

[White Cloud]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1356380895' post='1909816']
If it's any consolation , I think I have seen Orions secondhand in the Gallery in London for not much over a grand , if I remember correctly . At those prices you could take a risk on one and if you didn't like it you will always get your money back out of it . There are plenty floating around that people brought in from the States before the crash when you could get two dollars to the pound so used Alembics could be brought over from shops or ebay sellers in the States for silly prices . If you want to try an Alembic I wouldn't despair . When it comes to basses , it's ultimately a buyers market by virtue of the sheer quantity of used gear out there .
[/quote]

Good advice here. This is just what I did, i.e. paid just over a grand for a used Spoiler to put my toe into the water so to speak. This combined with my experience with my friends Series 1 left me somewhat disapointed...it burst the bubble of 30 yrs of Alembic GAS.

I am also of the opinion that the mega high price ATTRACTS a certain type of buyer. Its almost like a placebo type affect....."I have paid out for the most expensive bass that money can buy, therefore I have the worlds greatest bass, therefore I have become great too!" lol.

In fact in the aftermath of my personal Alembic experience I spent the next few years (after moving it on) only playing passive Fenders and Laklands.

Edited December 24, 2012 by White Cloud

[Black Coffee]

[quote name='White Cloud' timestamp='1356381397' post='1909826']
Good advice here. This is just what I did, i.e. paid just over a grand for a used Spoiler to put my toe into the water so to speak. This combined with my experience with my friends Series 1 left me somewhat disapointed...it burst the bubble of 30 yrs of Alembic GAS.

In fact in the aftermath of my personal Alembic experience I spent the next few years (after moving it on) playing passive Fenders and Laklands.
[/quote]

I had a bad experience with Rickenbackers. I had bought and sold three in the space of a year. Total money out was in excess of £4,800.00 and I was left with a very sour taste in the mouth and not all the money came back the way it went out so I am very skeptical of VERY expensive basses. The Ric bass ideal I had adored all my youth was a disappointment. My playing style clashed miserably with a Laredo, a 4003 and a 4003FL. The neck profile/shape and the U bend on the 4003 was the reason.
I bought a mid range Dingwall (ABZ) before lashing out on a dear one and they are worth every dime - but again it's not everyone likes them and that's their right. I love the playability, string tension on the B and the look on peoples faces as they try to figure out what's different on the fretboard. I will continue to try to climb the Dingwall model tree until I reach the top.
Perhaps time will heal my gripe with this. Either that or the good Lord will deliver an opportunity to test drive new basses for some luthier somewhere as a full time job.

[risingson]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1356374445' post='1909721']
Or buy something more affordable. I just don't like the look of them. Or Fedoras. Or Ken Smiths.
I fully realise this makes me crass and shallow, but there it is.
[/quote]

I'm pretty much the same.

Personally I don't have a problem with the price of any bass, it's worth as much as you're willing to pay for it. Fodera, KS, Alembic or whatever. I will say though that the Alembic looks have definitely not aged well to my eyes.

[risingson]

[quote name='bassman344' timestamp='1356376418' post='1909745']
I bow to a lot of knowledge here and I respect that Alembic did it all and laid the groundwork for more, so hats off to them. No complaints or dispute.
But why spend so much hard saved money to have a delicate bass with a likely to be problematic truss rod system and electronics that NASA would be happy to orbit the earth with.
[/quote]

They can probably trade a lot on their name, it's no different to Fender in this respect is the assertion of QC issues is true.

[White Cloud]

[quote name='bassman344' timestamp='1356382266' post='1909844']
I had a bad experience with Rickenbackers. I had bought and sold three in the space of a year. Total money out was in excess of £4,800.00 and I was left with a very sour taste in the mouth and not all the money came back the way it went out so I am very skeptical of VERY expensive basses. The Ric bass ideal I had adored all my youth was a disappointment. My playing style clashed miserably with a Laredo, a 4003 and a 4003FL. The neck profile/shape and the U bend on the 4003 was the reason.
I bought a mid range Dingwall (ABZ) before lashing out on a dear one and they are worth every dime - but again it's not everyone likes them and that's their right. I love the playability, string tension on the B and the look on peoples faces as they try to figure out what's different on the fretboard. I will continue to try to climb the Dingwall model tree until I reach the top.
Perhaps time will heal my gripe with this. Either that or the good Lord will deliver an opportunity to test drive new basses for some luthier somewhere as a full time job.

[/quote]

I was an avid Rick player in the 80's...just loved them - then suddenly they felt wrong. I looked around & everybody seemed to be playing Jaydee's, Wal and Status. I switched to Wal so hey ho. Its horses for courses!

love Dingwall basses but havent owned one...yet lol.

[Black Coffee]

[quote name='White Cloud' timestamp='1356383412' post='1909860']
I looked around & everybody seemed to be playing Jaydee's, Wal and Status. I switched to Wal so hey ho. Its horses for courses!

love Dingwall basses but havent owned one...yet lol.
[/quote]

As I look around. . . ..

Not many people constantly playing Rics, or Alembics may I tentatively suggest.....? Everyone's playing different stuff apart from Lemmy whose spine is probably hewn from a Ric 4003. I love the guy and his music, always have and always will. Motorhead are all that never changed in my schooldays.

If Ric would do something about the awful topographical situation around the bridge pup and the U bend from hell it might tempt me back but until then I will admire how they look but despise how they play in my hands. Open Ric-heart surgery to adapt to a u-bend free version leaves a trough which is just a mess. See pic. Why not make the two pups the same as the neck pup and lose the drama.

[White Cloud]

[quote name='bassman344' timestamp='1356385833' post='1909891']
As I look around. . . ..

Not many people constantly playing Rics, or Alembics may I tentatively suggest.....? Everyone's playing different stuff apart from Lemmy whose spine is probably hewn from a Ric 4003. I love the guy and his music, always have and always will. Motorhead are all that never changed in my schooldays.

If Ric would do something about the awful topographical situation around the bridge pup and the U bend from hell it might tempt me back but until then I will admire how they look but despise how they play in my hands. Open Ric-heart surgery to adapt to a u-bend free version leaves a trough which is just a mess. See pic. Why not make the two pups the same as the neck pup and lose the drama.
[/quote]

Ricks?? Just look at the design...classic! For me seeing Geddy Lee and Chris Squire playing them blew my mind. I dreamt about them when I slept at night. I eventually owned two 4001's and just loved the twang they made with new Rotosounds fitted. After a while though I became annoyed when there was always something missing from my low end with them. Still love them though.

Lemmy is outstanding. The real deal and he really is walking the walk and always has. I couldnt imagine HIM playing an Alembic...EVER lol!

[Black Coffee]

If Lemmy played an Alembic he would do it with a brown paper bag over his head so nobody would recognise him. Probably shake it to pieces in three songs.

As for Geddy Lee, I recently consulted a CD cover and the photo in the inside of one of their hits albums shows him playing a Jetglo Ric 4003 and guess what I've just noticed - the U bend has gone......!!! I wasn't the only one who had an issue with it. I'm not Geddy Lee, not even worthy to tune his bass but if this is one thing I have in common with him I will go now and happily leave that thing alone.

Funny as we look around. Geddy now plays a Fender J

[Kiwi]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1356377327' post='1909753']
Alembics committment to the ultimate quality is beyond question , but my ( limited ) experience and knowledge of Alembics is that they need taking good care of in so mucjh as they are far more breakable than more robust Fender -style designs . The angled headstock is prone to breaking if they are dropped , the electrics are good quality but will eventually wear and need servicing and /or replacing , and some of the 70s Alembics are now having problems with the neck laminations shifting slightly apart , according to some reports . Most fancy custom basses do need care and consideration in how they are treated and maintained , I'm not just singling out Alembic . My Wal basses , for example , were also quite finnicky and needed periodic servicing by Electric Wood .

Used Alembics are indeed well worth considering if they "fit" you as a player , most certainly . Alembic basses have a special allure for me , and they are without question basses with a special sound , and I'm just sorry that I find the classic ones like I always wanted when I was a kid so uncomfortable.
[/quote]

Well, I'm a bit wary of Pre-CBS Fender snobs whipping up anti-Alembic sentiment too. Not to suggest you are the former at all but its always interesting to know where the information comes from. Can you cite any testimony from owners as evidence of more serious issues?

I'm not aware of any Alembic owners mentioning neck laminations shifting apart from mistaken identity where the headstock laminations have been known to shrink at the joint with the neck producing a crack in the finish. This is nothing like a neck delaminating however. The bass continues to be perfectly robust and playable. I've had one like that.

On the subject of electronics, the pickups have been known to crap out after 30 years and funnily enough, this is not unusual on any bass (including Fenders). The magnets just lose their strength. Nothing that can be done about that unfortunately, regardless of the quality of the bass. My Alembic has had the pickups replaced. The preamp can be serviced but US Alembic owners tend to be fastidious...how much of that servicing has been to fix a specific fault and how much for normal stuff like pot cleaning just to keep the bass in tip top and noise free condition?

[Dingus]

[quote name='Kiwi' timestamp='1356407265' post='1910043']
Well, I'm a bit wary of Pre-CBS Fender snobs whipping up anti-Alembic sentiment too. Not to suggest you are the former at all but its always interesting to know where the information comes from. Can you cite any testimony from owners as evidence of more serious issues?

I'm not aware of any Alembic owners mentioning neck laminations shifting apart from mistaken identity where the headstock laminations have been known to shrink at the joint with the neck producing a crack in the finish. This is nothing like a neck delaminating however. The bass continues to be perfectly robust and playable. I've had one like that.

On the subject of electronics, the pickups have been known to crap out after 30 years and funnily enough, this is not unusual on any bass (including Fenders). The magnets just lose their strength. Nothing that can be done about that unfortunately, regardless of the quality of the bass. My Alembic has had the pickups replaced. The preamp can be serviced but Alembic owners tend to be fastidious...how much of that servicing has been to fix a specific fault and how much for normal stuff like pot cleaning just to keep the bass in tip top and noise free condition?
[/quote]

Come to think of it , the neck delamination thing [i]was [/i]something I read about on here during the heated debate about vintage Fenders , as you quite rightly point out . I certainly have no first hand experience of it myself , and I must have had my hands on at least a dozen 70s to early 80s Alembics with laminated necks in the last 20 years . Alembics are meticulously made basses , but thet are/ were also pioneering pieces of engineering , and so any long-term problems are not so much the fault of poor quality or shoddy workmanship , rather they would be as a result of a genuine lack of knowledge or forsight on what the long -term structural problems might be . Alembic might be master craftsmen , but expecting them to be able to see into the future might be a bit too much to ask . The shrinkage/cracking thing is certainly something I have encountered on other brands of basses with laminated necks and isn't exclusive to Alembic .

Regarding the electronics , all electrics need some attention sooner or later , but the complexity of filter - based Alembics means that ideally that work would be done by Alembic or someone with some expertise with that brand . I haven't encountered an Alembic with clapped out pickups myself , but almost all of the pre -70s vintage Fenders I have played in recent times , particulaly the Jazz Basses , have had pickups that were well past their best just as you describe - microphonic , lacking bottom end and just plain knackered . I would anticipate that replacing the pickups on an Alembic ( with some more Alembic pickups ' of course ) would be relatively straightforward , just like any other bass .

To me , Alembic is an truly iconic brand when it comes to basses , and I still get excited even just seeing one on t.v just like I did 30 odd years ago when I first became aware of them . I was crestfallen when I was forced to admit to myself that I would never be able to get along with one , short of getting a truly custom bass made to my specifications . I can still remember the first Alembics I ever saw in the flesh at the Bass Centre in Wapping in the mid 1980s , and playing a used Series 1 bass that had belonged to some famous player or other at one of the Shops on 38th Street when I first went to New York . Even if I don't own one , I'm glad basses like Alembic exist . I still might get one of the more modest modern models if the right deal came up . Even they sound great . I know Flea used the entry- level Epic on this track and it sounds ...like an Alembic !

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5zgHGUfMQo[/media]

Edited December 25, 2012 by Dingus

[risingson]

^^that's a Stingray if ever I heard one IMO, certainly for the slapped part. I think even Flea confirmed he'd used a Stingray on that, although I'm aware that he used an Epic the rest of the album, in fact I think he was still using his Wal as well after BSSM.

[Dingus]

Funnilly enough , I thought it sounded very reminiscent of a Stingray when I posted it , but put it down to the mulled wine . Then I thought it must be an Alembic after all . I've just googled it and Flea says he thinks its a Stingray on the final track .

Edit: The intro and the solo are the Alembic , the slap line is , as you quite rightly point out , a Stingray .

Edited December 25, 2012 by Dingus

[Dingus]

This is definitely an Alembic :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZelNczldEo

[marcus bell]

Wow

[bubinga5]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1356360849' post='1909504']
Because the amount of time and skill involved in making them and the quality of the materials used .
[/quote]sorry but there is lots of skill involved in and rare materials used in lots of high end bass makers... alot of instrument manufacturers rely on there brand name and what famous players use there instruments.. fodera are the most obvious example... they seem to think they can charge twice as much as luthiers like Martin Peterson, Nordstrand, sadowsky... imo its a bit of a piss take.. A Sei or Nordstrand bass is easily as well made as an alembic, alleva, or fodera.. but strangely they seem to inflate there prices...

lets face it the market for electric basses is so over engineered its silly, what with zero frets, through body stringing etc...... its nothing to with how the audience will appreciate the sound, its more to do with the bassist that plays it.. dont get me wrong i love playing a well made instrument, but there is a limit (imo) to what you can pay, to get very well made instrument that will give you optimum performance.. when you get to prices like 4/5000 its just over priced.. but i guess you pays your money you take your choice

i would still love an Alembic Rouge 5 though.. incredible instrument

Edited December 25, 2012 by bubinga5

[Black Coffee]

Any bassist would love to get a grip on a top, top end bass.
But when you set your prices so high that only the very flush will get to buy one new it just makes a big gap in class. The haves. And the have nots.
One thing is for sure though. Owning a mad money bass doesn`t mean you can play it.
Bein serious if i was given an alembic new id probably sell it and buy 2 or 3 of somethin else.

[marcus bell]

If I had the money I'd have a series 2 alembic in the original body shape , but for now I'm gunna try getting one of these

Alembic series 1
Alembic mark king
Alembic distillate

Hopefully something will pop up

[White Cloud]

[quote name='marcus bell' timestamp='1356456849' post='1910338']
If I had the money I'd have a series 2 alembic in the original body shape , but for now I'm gunna try getting one of these

Alembic series 1
Alembic mark king
Alembic distillate

Hopefully something will pop up
[/quote]

I have first refusal on your Alembic this time next year when you are moving it on!

[marcus bell]

Okay doubtful though, as its for my dad and he never sells basses

[Chris2112]

[quote name='marcus bell' timestamp='1356350165' post='1909360']
All of a sudden fell in love with the sound and looks of the alembic!

Really want a series 1 or a mark king model in the original body shape!

Best start saving
[/quote]

You'd think you'd never bought that Kingbass.


I do love a good Alembic. Even in today's bass marketplace, there is nothing really like a proper Series II with the anniversary electronics. Fantastic instruments and fantastic used bargains!

[marcus bell]

It'll be a distillate model and its for my dad not me , I'm totally In love with the kingbass!

[Dingus]

That Kingbass is quite reminiscent of this :

[MB1]

MB1.
Over the years I've had several Alembics
They are exquisite superbly well built basses
and I've never had any problems with finish,electrics or any other issues for that matter.
I've never bought a new one as good examples do come up occasionally,
However due to the quality of workmanship and bespoke service they offer
they are reassuringly expensive...and rightly so.
Check out there website some of there creations are veritable works of art.

[Chris2112]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1356621238' post='1911710']
That Kingbass is quite reminiscent of this :


[/quote]

That was always my thinking. Especially when you consider that Mark King borrowed liberally from Stanley Clark in his early days (Dune Tune, anyone?). The Distillates are lovely basses though most seemed to stay in the US.

[Dread Bass]

I have am Alembic and i can see where the money goes. Its the little things that make the difference: The shielding in the cavity, the knobs etc. Each part of an Alembic is thought out. As for being unreliable; they are not. They require some setup knowledge but its like a performance car you have to have it serviced often to keep it working at its best.

They are very expensive but people are willing to pay it.

Edited December 27, 2012 by Dread Bass