thunderider Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 im amounting amps!!!,the amp i always end up back to my 80s solidstate laney dp 150,it seems to be the only amp i can get down to half!! with a clean audiable sound,this amp only ever goes up to one on the gain 2/3 master at gigs...as im always being told this is too loud amp!!!i dont need big amps really as im not fighting against a drummer as we used drum midis we ha PA but we have a small rehersal room.. wich we cant go to loud in as the vocal feeds back...so hears my beef,i was using a 100w marshall all valve 100w...sounded quite crap as i couldnt drive the valves,then i bought a marshall mb450 wich is hybrid,valve in it,turn it down to our studio level same...fuzzy distored and no real volume,then i got a hartke 350w,great amp turned up....but same thing as it got a valve in turn it to half same,fuzzy sound,so my conclusion...anything with a valve cant be turned down low enough,like half?but my question can all solid state amps go down this low with a clear sound? as i may get 300w ss,im after cleaner head room,or was gonna go after a peavey nitro,or something around 200w,but i dont want to fall in the trap of buying another amp and its not going to go down low enough.so do all 80's ss amps of between 150-400w go low and clean in practice/bedroom situation?? im using 215s... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Sounds like your problem isn't valves, its Marshalls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salt on your Bass? Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Not sure why youd need 215s for bedroom practice? A lot of higher wattage rated hybrid amps seem to have quite steep volume slopes. Sounds like you could do with a headphone out or small cab for home? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderider Posted December 26, 2012 Author Share Posted December 26, 2012 no the 215s are what i reherse with at our studio and use to play live.....for bedroom practice iv only got 212s!!,think u might be right bout marshalls!!,i was thinking bigger the power the higher the vol curve....so smaller 150/200 watts may go to lower volumes as less powerfull? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Not if they are designed right. Marshalls have the reliance on distortion to sound good thing going on hence the guitard thing where they have to be too loud all of the time. Proper volume controls give you control of your volume, its only power valve breakup that you should miss without turning up loads, which sounds great, but sounding bad without it is a bad sounding amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umph Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 You say you're after low and clean? Why are you cranking up the preamp gain to make it fuzzy then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassmachine2112 Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 Hi-mb 450 has gain and volume on the classic pre amp Gain trims the signal to the valve,more gain the more signal to the valve allowing it to break up Volume trims the signal to the power stage of the amp. master volume adjusts the overall volume. It,a a balancing act make sure the boost button is off check out sticky on gain,volume,volume a confusing menage a trois. I have marshall and hartke amps and they can go clean to dirty and everywhere inbetween. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomBassmonkey Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 Distortion comes from the pre-amp, people prefer valves for this as they distort warmly rather than solid state, which can do some nasty things when distorted (though I've never had any problems with my 2001RB that sounds beautiful when overdriven.) If you have a full valve amp, the power section will be valve too, some people prefer this as it can change the tone in a way they like. For me, the preamp is for tone shaping and the power amp is mainly for amplifying the signal. In your case, is there any reason you can't crank the pre-amp and turn down the power section on your hybrid amps? A solid state amp should sound similar at any volume. If you're using distortion, maybe you like the sound of your speakers distorted, though you won't be able to replicate that at lower volumes whatever you do with the speakers you have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey R Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 (edited) It sounds like youre trying to get a warm, slightly driven tone whilst being able to control the volume level. A less expensive way to get this might be to experiment with pedals rather than with amps. Something like one of the Sans Amp character pedals would warm up your old Laney, you can then use the Laneys master volume to set the level to suit either your practice room or the gig. If the Laney is still too loud, one option might be to just replace it with a smaller amp. Since your tone is coming from the Sans Amp, a simple cheap practice combo around 80 watts or so would probably do the trick. EDIT: Just thought, it might be a problem with EQ - how do you have the tone controls set? Did you start with them all at 12 o'clock, then adjust from there? Alot of people start with bass and treble full up and all the mids fully down (the evil smiley face), this tends to cause the bass guitar to disappear in the mix. Edited December 28, 2012 by Mikey R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 [quote name='ThomBassmonkey' timestamp='1356643697' post='1912051'] Distortion comes from the pre-amp, people prefer valves for this as they distort warmly rather than solid state, which can do some nasty things when distorted (though I've never had any problems with my 2001RB that sounds beautiful when overdriven.) If you have a full valve amp, the power section will be valve too, some people prefer this as it can change the tone in a way they like. For me, the preamp is for tone shaping and the power amp is mainly for amplifying the signal. In your case, is there any reason you can't crank the pre-amp and turn down the power section on your hybrid amps? A solid state amp should sound similar at any volume. If you're using distortion, maybe you like the sound of your speakers distorted, though you won't be able to replicate that at lower volumes whatever you do with the speakers you have. [/quote] Distortion can come from the preamp, or the power amp. All distortion pedals are preamp distortion. Power amps can also distort. Valve power sections tend toward sounding good when they distort, solid state ones tend to be too powerful to distort before the speakers, and tend to sound nasty anyway. Exceptions apply, but that is the general thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderider Posted December 28, 2012 Author Share Posted December 28, 2012 the laney is quite clean up to bout 1 n half,the 2 n over it starts ti distort,most of the time i dont turn up master,i dont really scoop but i have the 2 outer bass sliders up full also the 2 treble full the rest are set to compensate,the rehersal room is small.no drummer so we dont need it loud so im barley on a 1/4 on gain,so im begining to think that big amps dont go low? or maybe ss amps do? the mb450 has a horrible sound to my ears,i like subsonic bass,the marshall jmc 900 it distorts from about 4,but to get the volume of one on the laney the marshall valve needs to be 6!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umph Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 [quote name='thunderider' timestamp='1356735096' post='1913161'] the laney is quite clean up to bout 1 n half,the 2 n over it starts ti distort,most of the time i dont turn up master,i dont really scoop but i have the 2 outer bass sliders up full also the 2 treble full the rest are set to compensate,the rehersal room is small.no drummer so we dont need it loud so im barley on a 1/4 on gain,so im begining to think that big amps dont go low? or maybe ss amps do? the mb450 has a horrible sound to my ears,i like subsonic bass,the marshall jmc 900 it distorts from about 4,but to get the volume of one on the laney the marshall valve needs to be 6!! [/quote] If you want low bass, you need the cabs for it. Marshall amps aren't designed for low end either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 [quote name='thunderider' timestamp='1356735096' post='1913161'] i have the 2 outer bass sliders up full [/quote] This is all of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey R Posted December 29, 2012 Share Posted December 29, 2012 Seriously dude, 15dB of bass and treble boost is ALOT. Its probably the eq circuits and not the valve that is distorting, explaining the nasty fuzzy sound. I would expect any bass amp to kick out a fair amount of actual bass at low volumes, at least try running it with flat eq before buying another amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassmachine2112 Posted December 29, 2012 Share Posted December 29, 2012 Less is more,set it flat ie 12 oclock everything apart from master volume and go from there,might need to cut bass back a bit to get the mids in. Boosting bass n treble has the effect of overpowering the mids almost like scooping them-try cutting them instead of boosting it should be quieter so allowing you to turn up master volume. It sounds like the speakers are getting pushed very hard. Try putting the input on active which will cut your incoming signal,it will cut the volume.might help. MB 450-gain and volume 12 oclock zero the bass,treble and mid voice,introduce a bit of bass,then a bit of treble till your happy,start on voice 1 put a bit on ,try voice 2 if you want it more clanky voice 3. If it gets distorted pull back the gain a bit and turn up the channel volume a bit. A little EQ goes a long way. I use 2 2x10 cabs and have all the bottom end you could need,bass usually is about 10 0clock,treble 12 oclock,voice to suit bass usually about 9 oclock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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