are there any super bands with poor bass players?

[mbellishment]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1356684104' post='1912303']
Its like the story of the drum clinic where the guy just played a straight solid beat for 15 minutes or something and told everyone to learn how to do that and they will be able to have a career in the business
[/quote]
I think that was Stuart Copeland from The Police.

I don't get why simple = poor? I like to riff and get busy, but I'm currently in a band that doesn't allow that, and to be honest it's quite tricky just staying in the pocket without putting runs in at every available opportunity. Cliff Williams is class!
I think a poor bass player is a player who has no perspective for the song he/she's playing. One example, for anyone who likes a bit metal, is Opeth. They have a great bass player now, but on their first 2 albums they had this other guy who obviously had a lot of say in what went on. A lot of the quieter, more atmospheric moments of those albums are ruined by badly played slap bass and noodling which is also production wise, way up in the mix.
Being busy and solid is great... being an egotistical fret w*nker is not... and that's what constitutes a poor player to me.

Edited December 28, 2012 by mbellishment

[Dingus]

[quote name='mbellishment' timestamp='1356737331' post='1913181']
I think that was Stuart Copeland from The Police.

I don't get why simple = poor? I like to riff and get busy, but I'm currently in a band that doesn't allow that, and to be honest it's quite tricky just staying in the pocket without putting runs in at every available opportunity. Cliff Williams is class!
I think a poor bass player is a player who has no perspective for the song he/she's playing. One example, for anyone who likes a bit metal, is Opeth. They have a great bass player now, but on their first 2 albums they had this other guy who obviously had a lot of say in what went on. A lot of the quieter, more atmospheric moments of those albums are ruined by badly played slap bass and noodling which is also production wise, way up in the mix.
Being busy and solid is great... being an egotistical fret w*nker is not... and that's what constitutes a poor player to me.
[/quote]

I totally agree that being a solid and uncomplicated player is just as important a skill as being an agile and flamboyant player on the bass guitar , probably more so , in fact . It is wrong however to equate all simplicity with virtue . Some bass players are straightforward , simple and brilliant like Cliff Williams - who as others have pointed out , is a big part of why that band have rocked so hard for so long- whereas some are not so much simple as just plain dull and idle . Having a career does not make you a good bass player , merely an employed one . You do not listen to someones career , you listen to their playing . Just because someone has a successful career as a bass player it does not mean in any way that they are neccesarilly a capable player .

Edited December 29, 2012 by Dingus

[pobrien_ie]

I think it's important to establish the difference between a "basic" player who serves the band/song. IMO a bad bass player is one who doesn't end up on the recorded track and is only in the band because of their look (Sid Vicious) or because bass doesn't matter to the band (Guigsy). Either way each to their own.

Generally those "basic" players are the ones I prefer to listen to in bands. They play in the studio and live. I can't think of any band that I really like that has a "virtuoso" player, and they're all the better because of it.

[NancyJohnson]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1356708740' post='1912744']
+1 on this comment on Michael Anthony of Van Halen . He's a superb hard rock bass player who is no slouch when the mood takes him . Listen to the first VH album and Michael plays some clever stuff throughout without ever cramping EVHs style or getting in the way . An underrated player in my estimation , and not poor by any stretch of the imagination .
[/quote]

I loved early (Roth era) VH, but never really thought that Michael Anthony fit the band. He was certainly the the worst musician in there by a country mile, although I do concur that his BVs were pretty extraordinary. I recently bought the Guitar World VH interview collection ([url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Guitar-World-Halen-Great-American/dp/1618930273/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1356779757&sr=8-1"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Guitar-World-Halen-Great-American/dp/1618930273/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1356779757&sr=8-1[/url]) and the guy really comes across as unlikeable, ignorant and somewhat of a bigger arse than I originally thought. Irrespective of how he feels about DLR now, VH would simply have been another LA rock band without DLRs bravado, charisma and showmanship as the primary focal points. Despite what he was doing before (and after) it just reinforced my opinion and that he was simply in the right place at the right time.

[alstocko]

[quote name='Kiwi' timestamp='1356667034' post='1912257']
Motley Crue?

I also remember some band somewhere that had to re-record all the bass parts laid down by the original bass player because they were so bad. I think it might have been a Trevor Horn produced track...was it Frankie Goes To Hollywood?
[/quote]
This was Blondie.
I talked to Trevor about it a couple of years ago as he is a FOAF, he said it was a bit awkward...

[leroydiamond]

[quote name='NancyJohnson' timestamp='1356780193' post='1913457']
I loved early (Roth era) VH, but never really thought that Michael Anthony fit the band. He was certainly the the worst musician in there by a country mile, although I do concur that his BVs were pretty extraordinary. I recently bought the Guitar World VH interview collection ([url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Guitar-World-Halen-Great-American/dp/1618930273/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1356779757&sr=8-1"]http://www.amazon.co...56779757&sr=8-1[/url]) and the guy really comes across as unlikeable, ignorant and somewhat of a bigger arse than I originally thought. Irrespective of how he feels about DLR now, VH would simply have been another LA rock band without DLRs bravado, charisma and showmanship as the primary focal points. Despite what he was doing before (and after) it just reinforced my opinion and that he was simply in the right place at the right time.
[/quote]
The right man in the right place at the right time IMO

[alstocko]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1356708401' post='1912737']
It's a difficult call because I wouldn't call either them super bands in terms of their artistic achievement ( or lack thereof ) but special mention must firstly be given to the bass player out of Coldplay . He is desperately bad , and I think even he knows it . He looks like he is completly out of his depth and expects to be exposed as a fraud at any moment . The other notables are whoever occupied the bass chair in Oasis ( Giggsy and Andy Bell I suppose ) who similaly never played a worthwhile note , and didn't seem to care either . I always thought the bass player out of Pulp was awful too .

[/quote]
I agree with Oasis and Pulp, but I do Like for of Guy Berryman's (Coldplay bassist) playing. The bassline to Shiver from their first album is good, and Paradise has an earth-shattering line. He may be one of the least technically gifted players, but he holds his part well enough, and looks cool whilst doing it.

Andy Bell just cared about the cool bit, his notes are all over the shop, like Noel Redding.

[alstocko]

Bill Wyman is only going to be used for a "couple of songs" on the next Stones tour.

Do Keef and Jagger think he's poor?

Keef did record Sympathy's bassline whilst Bill played marracas...

[Cygnus x-1]

[quote name='Truckstop' timestamp='1356656400' post='1912218']
As far as I'm aware you only need to play the right notes at the right time to be a useful musician.

I'd hardly say that Roger Waters failed to do that! Just because he's not a natural bassplayer doesn't make him poor or bad at it, it just means that he lacks a certain showmanship on it. But imagine if Entwistle ended up playing for Pink Floyd! How different they would have been!

Truckstop

Ps, I also like U2 and I think that Adam Clayton is a great pop bassist. The rhythm in 'Still Haven't Found...' makes that song and, live, his playing really adds so much meat to the songs. Also, I never heard him make a mistake, and I've seen U2 six times!
[/quote]

I actually think this comment is bang on.

[Dingus]

[quote name='alstocko' timestamp='1356786221' post='1913568']
Bill Wyman is only going to be used for a "couple of songs" on the next Stones tour.

Do Keef and Jagger think he's poor?

Keef did record Sympathy's bassline whilst Bill played marracas...
[/quote]

Keef played quite a few bass parts on classic era Stones records , but I think that was mainly because of the erratic and often chaotic studio schedule the band had at the time - the band would be recording in the middle of the night when Bill wasn't there . Just as an aside , the beautiful sunburst Precision bass that Keith used on those tracks belongs to Dave Bronze now , given to him by Eric Clapton apparently .

[musophilr]

A fair bit of the material published about Camel Mk I suggests that Doug Ferguson was the weak link in the band, and indeed he's been on record as saying he felt better about being a double glazing salesman after leaving Camel, but IMO his bass lines really worked with the rest of the band and I liked what he played. That weak link stuff is being a bit harsh.

[thunderider]

i think its alot to do with personalities,with my band they could get a way better bass player than me but its not to say he fits with the band...

[Kiwi]

[quote name='alstocko' timestamp='1356785293' post='1913553']
This was Blondie.
I talked to Trevor about it a couple of years ago as he is a FOAF, he said it was a bit awkward...
[/quote]
I think you might be right!

[thepurpleblob]

We seem to be mixing up "poor" with "virtuoso". Most of the people who are getting mentioned are playing reasonably tasteful notes that fit and playing them in time - at least. I would call 'poor' someone who noticeably can't play.

[JTUK]

[quote name='Kiwi' timestamp='1356804099' post='1913835']
I think you might be right!
[/quote]

Really..?? post Nigel Harrison...?? thought he was pretty solid ..??

[Dingus]

[quote name='thepurpleblob' timestamp='1356806644' post='1913875']
We seem to be mixing up "poor" with "virtuoso". Most of the people who are getting mentioned are playing reasonably tasteful notes that fit and playing them in time - at least. I would call 'poor' someone who noticeably can't play.
[/quote]

Coldplay = can't play .

[JTUK]

RE Michael Anthony..???

Anyone who thinks they can share a solo spot with EVH must have SERIOUS chops or a SERIOUS ego..
and the JD bass slot is just plain deluded

After DLR and EVH...did they really need that guy..??
Agree with right time, right place sentiment.

[Nibody]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1356684104' post='1912303']
The reason most AC/DC covers bands are sh*te is because they dont have a Cliff Williams! People think because they can slap and pop they are better (even people on here who have never left the shed) so many of those players cant play a 4 minute pop song and keep time, Its like the story of the drum clinic where the guy just played a straight solid beat for 15 minutes or something and told everyone to learn how to do that and they will be able to have a career in the business
[/quote]

+1. When you listen to his lines they do whats needed, and do it well.

[Nibody]

[quote name='mbellishment' timestamp='1356737331' post='1913181']
I think that was Stuart Copeland from The Police.

I don't get why simple = poor? I like to riff and get busy, but I'm currently in a band that doesn't allow that, and to be honest it's quite tricky just staying in the pocket without putting runs in at every available opportunity. Cliff Williams is class!
I think a poor bass player is a player who has no perspective for the song he/she's playing. One example, for anyone who likes a bit metal, is Opeth. They have a great bass player now, but on their first 2 albums they had this other guy who obviously had a lot of say in what went on. A lot of the quieter, more atmospheric moments of those albums are ruined by badly played slap bass and noodling which is also production wise, way up in the mix.
Being busy and solid is great... being an egotistical fret w*nker is not... and that's what constitutes a poor player to me.
[/quote]

That in a nutshell is what I wanted to say. Well put.

[arthurhenry]

Imagine coming home from every gig or recording session, knowing that you played exactly the right thing, with not a note out of place and made the band sound great. That's how Cliff Williams must feel.

[xgsjx]

I don't see how anyone could rate Adan Clayton as a poor bass player. OK he's not a soloist or slapper, but he's probably one of the most melodic bassists out there.

[steven gayle]

I think its a bit disrepectful to talk about 'poor bass players' in a supergroup. They do what they do and they are part of the band and the sound. Everyone has a part to play and everyone plays a part!

[Slatfatf]

so the answer is no



... probably

[mart]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1356809289' post='1913925']
I don't see how anyone could rate Adan Clayton as a poor bass player. OK he's not a soloist or slapper, but he's probably one of the most melodic bassists out there.
[/quote]
On another forum this same topic came up, and one member said he thought Clayton was bad because of the bassline to the song "40". Naively, I pointed out that it wasn't Clayton on the bass for that song, and the guy replied saying he knew that. So this genius had formed an opinion of a bassist on the basis (sorry!) of a line he didn't play.

[xgsjx]

[quote name='mart' timestamp='1356819483' post='1914080']
On another forum this same topic came up, and one member said he thought Clayton was bad because of the bassline to the song "40". Naively, I pointed out that it wasn't Clayton on the bass for that song, and the guy replied saying he knew that. So this genius had formed an opinion of a bassist on the basis (sorry!) of a line he didn't play.
[/quote]



Some songs only need a simple line.