Non 4 string social stigma?

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1356786300' post='1913569']


I would LOVE to!
[/quote]
Good because you guessed it, he is music teacher and classical guru! Reads like a mother too

[BigRedX]

To the OP what sorts of music are the bands you are auditioning for playing?

As someone who's played 5-strings almost exclusively since the late 80s I've never encountered this problem. Admittedly I've mostly played in bands where the weirder the better has been the ethos and I've spent a lot of time trying to convince my fellow musicians to get something a bit more visually exciting to use on stage than their bog standard Gibsons and Fenders.

I do think that the visual side is important especially if you are in a gigging band, but unless you are playing in a tribute band or strictly 50s/60s/70s music with an appropriate overall image to go with it then the number of string on your bass would be low down for concern.

[Dingus]

I haven't encountered this situation myself - I have never owned a five string for a start - but I have met plenty of musos who see the five string bass as being emblematic of what they don't want in a bass guitarist i.e modern and adventurous and likely to play too much . Most musicians are traditionalists - their music harks back to a previous era , and unless that era is late 80s to turn of the millenium mainstream pop music then a five string is out of keeping with what they associate with the original music . I am not at all surprised , given the current trends towards retrospection and simplicity , that other musicians are looking askance at the five string bass , rightly or wrongly . Lots of pro gigs with signed bands nowadays would demand a four string , and probably a traditional - style one at that . I am not at all surprised that the o.p is encountering some degree of prejudice if he is turning up for auditions with a five string , I would be surprised if he wasn't . I have got a couple of friends who are successful pro players and they have worked with artists who not only dictated what kind of bass they use but also how high they adjust their strap - too high isn't rock and roll enough apparently . Plenty of gigs dictate what clothes you wear , so I would see dictating what bass you use merely as an extension of that kind of "styling" .

Edited December 29, 2012 by Dingus

[risingson]

I've never had a problem with it. Equally I don't mind playing 4 either, I'm not exclusively a 5 string player and the kind of people who would ask me to change back to my 4 are going to be the people that I won't be working with, I've just got better things to be doing. Luckily no one I work with has ever mentioned anything, I'd like to think they trust me to know what I think works best in any given situation. For example I'm off to Sweden next week to play with a symphony orchestra to do some rare later Beatles numbers, I won't be taking the Stingray 5 along as it won't work for me.

It's different if it's an image or a sonic thing and that's what I've my P-Bass 4 for.

[mbellishment]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1356787054' post='1913579']
To the OP what sorts of music are the bands you are auditioning for playing?

As someone who's played 5-strings almost exclusively since the late 80s I've never encountered this problem. Admittedly I've mostly played in bands where the weirder the better has been the ethos and I've spent a lot of time trying to convince my fellow musicians to get something a bit more visually exciting to use on stage than their bog standard Gibsons and Fenders.

I do think that the visual side is important especially if you are in a gigging band, but unless you are playing in a tribute band or strictly 50s/60s/70s music with an appropriate overall image to go with it then the number of string on your bass would be low down for concern.
[/quote]

I've always said I'll join any type of band as long as it's good and I get a kick out of it. I'm not exclusive to any particular genre. I've played in several twee indie bands, a metal band, a folk rock band, a punk band and a power pop style band, and never had any issues really.

We used to have a musicians forum up in the north east that a lot of musicians from the local originals bands posted in regularly. Some of the people who used to get it in the neck on there were multi stringed bass players... bands who were too 'tight'... bands who used amps bigger than those you can fit in a rucksack... bands that didn't sound like Maximo Park, The Futureheads, Elbow or Belle & Sebastian!
I thought it was ridiculous, but these fashion statements or whatever, eventually spread out to nearly everyone using the forum and almost overnight I found it increasingly difficult to find a band because everybody knew I played a 5. The forum is no longer there, but that stigma seems to have embedded itself in a lot of folks minds.

A few people on here from the area have said I'm just unlucky, but I think it might be more a case that you guys are lucky to not have been persecuted this way, because like I say I know a few musicians this has affected.

[JTUK]

Why would you waste your time with people like this..... I think they are doing you a favour by putting this upfront at an early stage..
Saves so much hassle not getting involved

[Dingus]

[quote name='mbellishment' timestamp='1356801500' post='1913782']
I've always said I'll join any type of band as long as it's good and I get a kick out of it. I'm not exclusive to any particular genre. I've played in several twee indie bands, a metal band, a folk rock band, a punk band and a power pop style band, and never had any issues really.

We used to have a musicians forum up in the north east that a lot of musicians from the local originals bands posted in regularly. Some of the people who used to get it in the neck on there were multi stringed bass players... bands who were too 'tight'... bands who used amps bigger than those you can fit in a rucksack... bands that didn't sound like Maximo Park, The Futureheads, Elbow or Belle & Sebastian!
I thought it was ridiculous, but these fashion statements or whatever, eventually spread out to nearly everyone using the forum and almost overnight I found it increasingly difficult to find a band because everybody knew I played a 5. The forum is no longer there, but that stigma seems to have embedded itself in a lot of folks minds.

A few people on here from the area have said I'm just unlucky, but I think it might be more a case that you guys are lucky to not have been persecuted this way, because like I say I know a few musicians this has affected.
[/quote]

I don't think it's a NE thing . Everywhere in the country the prevailing mood is anti- muso ( just like it nearly always was ) yet at the same time depressingly conformist and predictable . Indie / alternative rock music is the new pop music : even function bands play Kings Of Leon and Strokes numbers nowadays . It's always important to bear in mind that a lot of self - styled " band leaders " have only chosen playing an instrument and being in a band as a vehicle for their "talents" rather than because they love to play and love learning how to play . If I had a pound for every would-be self-styled Pete Docherty wannabe I have encountered in the last ten years I would probably have enough money to pay the real Pete Docherty's bail next time he gets busted . Image is an important part of most bands , but as others have said , if you are wedded to the idea of playing a five string then you were never going to suit those bands anyway . For what its worth , I think some fives would look fine in an indie setting ie Music Man , Fender ect , but no doubt they would be looking for someone with a vintage Gibson Thunderbird bass that they got from a Scope shop in Camden slung round their knees .

Edited December 29, 2012 by Dingus

[Mog]

Unfortunately there's idiots everywhere. IME comments like that usually come from people who played in a band briefly and were convinced by their mates that they were fantastic. (those same mates usually make up 99% of the punters they've ever played for).

For a working musician the correct bass to use is the one he/she finds most useful with respect to versatility, comfort and totality.
For me that's a 6 string because I have to be able to cover everything from Pop to Traditional Irish at most sessions. To suggest that a specific style, brand or range (scale wise) of instrument is suited or unsuited to particular genre is nothing short of moronic.

[Antiloco]

You should see Sweden then...you won't get a gig if you don't show up with a fender. Just look at the market here, there are beautiful non fender basses for sale at really low prices, nobody wants them. Last year I bough a Warwick for something like 300£ and it had been for sale for a year or so. More strings shure but then it has to be your own band.
I've never experienced a place were contacts, looks and gear mattered so much more than skills than here. Maybe because we are so few? Who knows. Strange mentality.

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Mog' timestamp='1356861559' post='1914305']
Unfortunately there's idiots everywhere. IME comments like that usually come from people who played in a band briefly and were convinced by their mates that they were fantastic. (those same mates usually make up 99% of the punters they've ever played for).

For a working musician the correct bass to use is the one he/she finds most useful with respect to versatility, comfort and totality.
For me that's a 6 string because I have to be able to cover everything from Pop to Traditional Irish at most sessions. To suggest that a specific style, brand or range (scale wise) of instrument is suited or unsuited to particular genre is nothing short of moronic.
[/quote]

As has been suggested elsewhere, there's nothing idiotic or moronic about it.

[Mog]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1356863942' post='1914334']


As has been suggested elsewhere, there's nothing idiotic or moronic about it.
[/quote]

The Northeast?

[ezbass]

[quote name='Inti' timestamp='1356863886' post='1914332']
You should see Sweden then...you won't get a gig if you don't show up with a fender.
[/quote]
Not just Sweden, I've seen this in local jams right here. I remember when I first started playing bass around 2000 and thought the best way to get myself out there was turning up to jams where I'd previously played guitar. My first bass was a cheap, but pretty good quality Yamaha RBX and I overheard disparaging comments from the resident P playing bassist about 'modern' basses. I didn't get to play that night.

[Antiloco]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1356863942' post='1914334']


As has been suggested elsewhere, there's nothing idiotic or moronic about it.
[/quote]
In my world it's totally idiotic and moronic to be limited by looks in a sounding art form. People who favor looks over sound and claim to be musicians are certainly more entertainers than artists.

Is it so much to ask to take music seriously?....clearly it is.

[Antiloco]

[quote name='ezbass' timestamp='1356864277' post='1914339']

Not just Sweden, I've seen this in local jams right here. I remember when I first started playing bass around 2000 and thought the best way to get myself out there was turning up to jams where I'd previously played guitar. My first bass was a cheap, but pretty good quality Yamaha RBX and I overheard disparaging comments from the resident P playing bassist about 'modern' basses. I didn't get to play that night.
[/quote]
Of course you didn't get to play! You hadn't seen the light you know...

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Mog' timestamp='1356864220' post='1914338']
The Northeast?
[/quote]
Not specifically, no - unless the folks who have posted on this thread that they understand why it happens are all from the North East, which I don't think they are.

[quote name='Inti' timestamp='1356864281' post='1914341']
[b]In my world[/b] it's totally idiotic and moronic to be limited by looks in a sounding art form. People who favor looks over sound and claim to be musicians are certainly more entertainers than artists.

Is it so much to ask to take music seriously?....clearly it is.
[/quote]

I've highlighted the important part of your quote.

[Antiloco]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1356864503' post='1914346']

Not specifically, no - unless the folks who have posted on this thread that they understand why it happens are all from the North East, which I don't think they are.



I've highlighted the important part of your quote.
[/quote]

Aaaaahhhh a limited entertainer! ...play for me slave! Play!

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Inti' timestamp='1356864578' post='1914348']
Aaaaahhhh a limited entertainer! ...play for me slave! Play!
[/quote]

I beg your pardon?

[ezbass]

[quote name='Inti' timestamp='1356864374' post='1914345']

Of course you didn't get to play! You hadn't seen the light you know...
[/quote]Either that or he was threatened by my burgeoning rookie talent

[Mog]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1356864503' post='1914346']

Not specifically, no - unless the folks who have posted on this thread that they understand why it happens are all from the North East, which I don't think they are.
[/quote]

Oh I understand why it happens. Many musicians are obviously more concerned with the image side of being in a band. Personally I play music for enjoyment but happen to be lucky enough to earn some cash too.
I just don't see the point of expecting someone to play instrument X when they wouldn't normally choose to and to be honest I don't see the point of being in a band if your thoughts and opinions aren't considered important/valid.

[Cat Burrito]

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1356779027' post='1913448']
It happens the other way around sometimes[/quote]

I agree, snobbery cuts all ways. I've been "advised" to play 5 string once but decided against joining that band.

I agree with the few posts that say that your kit *can* sometimes suggest whether you'd be right for the gig and I don't think this is overt snobbery. I've played everything from english folk to punk to metal to country and you need to know something about the genre. If it is obvious from speaking to you within a minute or so that despite your BC Rich Warlock you know something about folk music, I don't see the problem but equally pulling out a Hofner Beatle Bass and not knowing any Bolt Thrower songs for the thrash band you are auditioning may win you few allies!

[stingrayPete1977]

I actually went to five strings to join a band
Its more of a session arrangement (for peanuts) and the roll could only be done on a 5, it has got me into a much wider group of musicians, dep gigs and even a totally new band that is just taking off. I would not of done it if I had not wanted but I am glad I did, I guess the difference here is that my situation is more akin to session work where you would be told what to play and what to play it through rather than a band with everyone trying to have equal input, certainly in our covers band I take whichever bass I feel like!

[obbm]

[quote name='ezbass' timestamp='1356864277' post='1914339']
Not just Sweden, I've seen this in local jams right here. I remember when I first started playing bass around 2000 and thought the best way to get myself out there was turning up to jams where I'd previously played guitar. My first bass was a cheap, but pretty good quality Yamaha RBX and I overheard disparaging comments from the resident P playing bassist about 'modern' basses. I didn't get to play that night.
[/quote]

Please do tell which Jam this was.

[Roland Rock]

Funnily enough, I encountered some quite strong five string prejudice last night at the pub, just in conversation. A friend, who has always been quite strongly in the punk/alternative rock camp, commented that he'd seen a pic of me on Facebook, and that I was playing a bass which had "one too many strings". The others (one an alt rock drummer, and a Drum n Bass producer) all agreed that a five string is "not a proper bass".
I made some quite convincing arguments, where the reply was a mere "you're still not going to convince me". :-)

So, I'm now revising my opinion that people have preconceived ideas about which instrument should go with which genre. Some people are so into their chosen genre, that they think all genres should adhere to that aesthetic!

[chris_b]

Try to get a gig with a 4 string Fender in a Rock-a-Billy band!

People wear blinkers in every genre. It used to be worse in the session world in the US. Turn up with anything other than a Fender and you wouldn't be asked back.

A friend of mine went to a Gary Moore audition with his 6 string Warwick and was told if he got the gig he would have to play a 62 Precision. He didn't get it!

You just have to make your own decision. I would play any bass that I was asked to play if the money was good enough!

[pierreganseman]

Well, i gig almost exclusively with A brubaker 6 string lol...

I must admit that in most case it just goes great and I rarely get any bad comments.

I think bands sometimes have a really strict view of what/how they should look. Recently I got told "if you want that job, Precision bass sunburst would be the one. Altough I know my brubaker kicks ass to most other basses around, but I do not wanna be seen as the egotistical one who turns down jobs cuz it's not the "right bass". So in the end I got a P5 lol. Works great. In the end any bassist needs about 6 basses to cover anything really. One or two "classic looking" thing. And maybe then modern basses. Cause you never know what you will bump into, and I don't know many people who can afford to turn down work anyways... lol ...

Anyway, I still hate fenders... lol.. They are so many alternative these days to those classic design, to me and my taste, they don't make any sense anymore....