PRS are trying basses again.

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1359213830' post='1951685']
so why can't manufacturers with the wealth of experience and historical examples available to them get it right now?
[/quote]

Bet its hand shaped/sanded, so labour costs. I blame the unions.

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1359218171' post='1951781']
Bet its hand shaped/sanded, so labour costs. I blame the unions.
[/quote]

But it's a PRS signature model. It's already massively expensive. I doubt if there is any extra cost involved in making a good heelless neck joint over the lumpy monstrosity it already has will alter the price significantly.

[DiMarco]

Those look like 4 string guitars, not basses imho.

[louisthebass]

It's a lovely looking and sounding bass, especially in the hands of Gary Grainger. I would imagine the tonal possibilities are quite wide on that bass.

[Chris2112]

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1359130595' post='1950407']
But then you still wouldn't have a PRS... and two basses that wouldn't have the resale value of a PRS.
[/quote]

I've never known their basses to command a great price at resale. Mainly because they've never been that great in the past and sold very poorly. I doubt these will be a huge seller either. They'll be priced in line with the rest of the PRS range, and with that, I doubt they'll sell a great deal. Bassists looking to spend that sort of money are spoilt for choice now, with the best luthiers in the world ready to take their money. I doubt they will turn to PRS. Whereas PRS have a well established fanbase for their guitars, hence why they don't struggle to sell them.

[nobodysprefect]

PRS changed their neck heel to what Ed Roman used to call heel from hell back in 1994, when they put up a new production facility. In PRSi circles the earlier guitars are called 'pre-factory' when in fact PRS already had a production facility that was, for all in tents and porpoises, a factory before that. But the production methods DID change, and the wonderful set-neck heel was changed - at least in the Custom 24 models which I suppose were [i]the[/i] model to get back then. AFAIK it's do to with cutting out as much labour costs as poss. Ed Roman's site had (has?) pretty good comparison shots of the neck heels...

Me, I wouldn't go for a guitar with such a blocky heel. Bass? Nah, I'll keep my MTDs.

[EBS_freak]

[quote name='Chris2112' timestamp='1359335961' post='1953329']
I've never known their basses to command a great price at resale. Mainly because they've never been that great in the past and sold very poorly. I doubt these will be a huge seller either. They'll be priced in line with the rest of the PRS range, and with that, I doubt they'll sell a great deal. Bassists looking to spend that sort of money are spoilt for choice now, with the best luthiers in the world ready to take their money. I doubt they will turn to PRS. Whereas PRS have a well established fanbase for their guitars, hence why they don't struggle to sell them.
[/quote]

Whether they are great basses or not, resale being high or not, you'll always get those buyers who will pay a premium because they must have "PRS" on the headstock. Simple as. Doesn't matter what else is out there, better or not, only a PRS says PRS on the headstock (unless you get a fake of course).

[The Burpster]

As I own 7 PRS basses I feel probably the best qualified to assassinate the new basses....?

I have picked up and payed a GG 5 and it was truly a fantastic instrument as with any Private Stock I have had the privilege to be near.

To address some of your queries/points.

Set necks in a deep pocket is a firm belief that Paul has that, this area of a guitar is critical to its tone. I would struggle to argue that point, however I also prefer bolt on necks and have avoided some of the earlier PRS basses because of that design characteristic.

Why not paint the neck...? Purely choice I guess however, there is a point to his finish, in some players like a high gloss finish others prefer a matted finish, with his finish you can (light gauge) wire wool the finish and get that non shiny feel without fooking up a paint finish.

Price...? Your guess is as good as mine but I have recently seen PS GG4s going for £3.5 in the US so who knows. The last bass that was available (the EB IV and my fave) was retail US$2600 and UK £2400 so if any come over here I guess that would be about right.

Are they any good? This one is an undoubted yes, but they won't float everyone's boat for sure. Paul learned a lot from making basses in at they do not sell in large numbers and that bass players are fussy buggers......(indeed I include myself in hat comment).

His first commercially available basses beamed renowned as a 'one trick pony' and he smarted a bit at that. His second attempt (the EBIV) was by far his best and these are superb instruments and why I love them. Tonally they can be quite different depending on wood combinations but all are fantastically made.

I will make some enquiries with World Guitars as to the details of this new animal as I am very tempted, but I also agree that an SE model is way overdue and have emailed them to that effect several times.

My guess is that unless the GG basses sell well hey won't justify tooling up for an SE version.

Edited February 4, 2013 by The Burpster

[AndyTravis]

I've always liked the second version of the bass - Really wouldn't mind one.

This version appeals and looks a bit more versatile too. Thing is, everything I've seen on youtube is slaptastic, and some of it really not that good; I do play a bit of that stuff, but it's not really showing the versatility of the bass, which is a shame.

I'm hoping Jez at Headline can get one of these new ones on car stock so I can try one next time I see him.

And that bridge does look a bit parts bin for a bass retailing at the higher end of things.

[KevB]

Looks quite like a Schecter C4 I used to own, except for the price tag

[url="http://gearhounds.com/browseproducts/SCHECTER-C-4-BASS-GUITAR-ANTIQUE-AMBER.html"]http://gearhounds.com/browseproducts/SCHECTER-C-4-BASS-GUITAR-ANTIQUE-AMBER.html[/url]

[The Burpster]

Oh and the bit I forgot to add was that Paul's design brief for the 2nd incarnation of basses ( the EB IV on which this new one is heavily based) was that it should be an amalgamation of a Stingray and a Jazz but with PRS build quality and woods.

Certainly the EB IV hits those tags and, the new GG is pretty much the same instrument but with new electrics and for some reason a new bridge.

[AndyTravis]

The EB IV is something I covet. Have done since I used to see the adverts in Bass Player Mag years ago - No idea why.

[shizznit]

Hmmm...I am not convinced the resale value of these basses will follow the same suit as the guitars. I have sold two high end PRS Custom 24's recently and didn't lose much money on either despite being in 9/10 condition. They will always be revered as a great electric guitar company, but when they dipped their fingers into amps and acoustics their wheels fell off.

Their acoustics are pretty good, so are their amps, but there are other brands out there for less money that can do as good or better job. Hence the book depreciation on 2nd hand market for the acoustics and amps are not as good as the electrics. The guy I sold my 20th Anniversary CU24 to last year didn't even know that they make acoustics and amps and he has been playing PRS guitars for years! When I showed him the products on the PRS website he was chuffed...then I showed him the price list! Strange how he would spend thousands of his cash on their eclectic guitars, but not on anything else that they produce. I dunno if they entered those markets too late or simply just too expensive, but the only thing that still interests their customers are their electric guitars.

Their new basses might make waves at first, but I fear that they won't be able to build a profile big enough to tempt customers to buy their brand over 100's of luthiers and common popular brands already out there with a strong and loyal customer base that could build a better bass for the same price or lower. At their retail price range, bassists will commonly turn to a private build. Guitar players don't do that. They will fork out £2500 for a Gibson Black Beauty Custom just because it's a Gibson, even though there are thousands out there like it and even conscience that there are better guitars out there for less money. PRS fall into that category too, but the effect hasn't happened for their acoustics and amps yet and probably never will.

Maybe I am being pessimistic and I do hope that PRS will do a good job returning back to bass production because I am a fan of theirs, but they have been out that game for a while and didn't really give basses their full attention first time round. I hope they commit themselves to this in the long term.

Edited February 5, 2013 by shizznit

[The Burpster]

[quote name='shizznit' timestamp='1360023620' post='1963846']
Hmmm...I am not convinced the resale value of these basses will follow the same suit as the guitars. I have sold two high end PRS Custom 24's recently and didn't lose much money on either despite being in 9/10 condition. They will always be revered as a great electric guitar company, but when they dipped their fingers into amps and acoustics their wheels fell off.

Their acoustics are pretty good, so are their amps, but there are other brands out there for less money that can do as good or better job. Hence the book depreciation on 2nd hand market for the acoustics and amps are not as good as the electrics. The guy I sold my 20th Anniversary CU24 to last year didn't even know that they make acoustics and amps and he has been playing PRS guitars for years! When I showed him the products on the PRS website he was chuffed...then I showed him the price list! Strange how he would spend thousands of his cash on their eclectic guitars, but not on anything else that they produce. I dunno if they entered those markets too late or simply just too expensive, but the only thing that still interests their customers are their electric guitars.

Their new basses might make waves at first, but I fear that they won't be able to build a profile big enough to tempt customers to buy their brand over 100's of luthiers and common popular brands already out there with a strong and loyal customer base that could build a better bass for the same price or lower. At their retail price range, bassists will commonly turn to a private build. Guitar players don't do that. They will fork out £2500 for a Gibson Black Beauty Custom just because it's a Gibson, even though there are thousands out there like it and even conscience that there are better guitars out there for less money. PRS fall into that category too, but the effect hasn't happened for their acoustics and amps yet and probably never will.

Maybe I am being pessimistic and I do hope that PRS will do a good job returning back to bass production because I am a fan of theirs, but they have been out that game for a while and didn't really give basses their full attention first time round. I hope they commit themselves to this in the long term.
[/quote]

Some good points here Shizz,

Firstly resale values, I see mine as £1k notes. Some of them I paid more than that for and some less but as to loosing any more value that's unlikely. As to the wheels falling off? not sure I can agree with you there.

Your points about the accoustics and amps are (IMO) being made way too soon to be that sure about the market. They simply dont produce the same numbers of these products as they do thier primary product range (guitars).
The guitars when they first came out where seen as very expensive and exotic and only for 'boutique' players.... It took nearly a decade for the guitar range to really establish itself as a viable alternative to others out there.
Both the accoustics and amps are up against really established market leaders that have their own established, and often devoted followers. I believe they are selling well just not in huge numbers. The 2ndhand value will settle down to what the guitar playing public are willing to pay.

As with the basses they were about £2.4k retail and now change hands for about £1k and they have for the last 5 years so an established value irrespective of what the 'guide' says. Guitars outsell basses 10-1, and a geetard not wanting to spend more than 3s6d on an amp is historic.

As to custom luthiers making as good, you are probably right, but speccing an instrument for a luthier to make is almost as difficult as making it in fact I would argue harder, because the luthier will make EXACTLY what you spec. Most players dont know what it is they want until they hear or feel it. That simply isnt possible when you are making a 'one off', besides you only have to look at the for sale section to see how many of these are for sale and mostly at a fraction of what was paid for them.

I hope as do lots of others that PRS will bring out an SE bass (maybe based upon the GG or EB IV), and I'm sure that they will sell hand over fist as do thier SE guitars. The GG bass isnt really a cheap option, they have just opened up the client bass by offering ready made instruments to those that dont want to pay the premium for a Private Stock, which was the only way you could get your hands on one of these instruments before.

I will seriously look at buying one os these GG basses but only after I have played one. Would I consider a PRS Amp..? yes I would but he doesnt do bass amps. As to accoustics my guitarist has tried one and it was by far the best he has ever played. His problem was the £6.5k price tag, simply more than he wanted to pay. He bought a Martin but hates how hard it is to play compared to the PRS....... He is now looking at the ne SE PRS accoustic.....

Writng on the wall..? I think so.

Edited February 6, 2013 by The Burpster

[rednose200]

Well it'll have to be really very special indeed to be a sales success over here at that price level. I'd be going down the luthier route, and then I really would get something special - oh, and also rather unique rather than an expensive production model. But good luck to them anyway

[mingsta]

The problem is, it just looks like a bass version of their guitars. Not my bag. But it does bring back fond memories of my first school band. Our guitarist was a virtuoso with rich parents and had a PRS, we used to wet our pants every time he took it out of the case.

[The Burpster]

[quote name='mingsta' timestamp='1361492271' post='1986675']
The problem is, it just looks like a bass version of their guitars. Not my bag. But it does bring back fond memories of my first school band. Our guitarist was a virtuoso with rich parents and had a PRS, we used to wet our pants every time he took it out of the case.
[/quote]

I dont see that as a problem, its the exact reason I own them. My best mate and geetard sumed it up perfectly about his guitars, each one feels like it was made exactly for you.

If you like them or not is immaterial, no one can dispute the quality of them. Having owned CS Fenders and other supposed 'custom shop' basses, I'm afraid none of them stack up in QC or feel of quality to a Stevensville made instrument.

Taste is of course subjective, and some will not agree that they are worth every penny.

[Dingus]

I think these would be really nice basses , and I am sure that the neck joint / heel block wouldn't bother me in the slightest . I would be very interested to know the retail price - quite a lot of money , I expect .

[The Burpster]

For those interested (or looking for the justification of their " too costly and others can do better" opinion) I have checked with World Guitars and the GG basses will be over here from April.

Cost is £2579 for 4 string & £2679 for the 5 string.

I have already out my request in for a 5 string .......

:-)

[Dingus]

[quote name='The Burpster' timestamp='1361792077' post='1990766']
For those interested (or looking for the justification of their " too costly and others can do better" opinion) I have checked with World Guitars and the GG basses will be over here from April.

Cost is £2579 for 4 string & £2679 for the 5 string.

I have already out my request in for a 5 string .......

:-)
[/quote]

Is that the full retail or the cash / best deal price , may I ask ?

[The Burpster]

My guess is that, that is the retails price of world guitars. They are pretty competitive with other franchised PRS dealers so that I doubt very much that it will the best budget price, that being said the reply to my 2nd email hinted that they will be sent a few for stock and other than that if you want a particular combination you will have to order it......

[Budbear]

I had the opportunity to play both of these basses at NAMM this year. My assessment is that these are very well made and beautifully finished instruments, as one would expect from PRS, at a par with most higher end American-made basses and will be priced accordingly. The fretwork was flawless and the proprietary hardware of high quality. They were both set up for low, buzz-free action. The electronics are very flexible but, to my ears, have a built-in tone that was not to my personal taste. Very modern and hi-fi. Many players liked it, others didn't. I estimated the weights to be between 4 & 5 kilos, with the 5 string being noticeably heavier. If you like fat necks, then these basses are candidates for your currency. We Americans call these kind of necks 'baseball bats' (never having played cricket, I don't know how that would translate). I would compare them to Alembic necks, generally. These basses seem to be designed for a very specific kind of customer and my conversation with Paul led me to believe he doesn't really expect to set the bass world on its ear with their sales figures. I strongly recommend trying these basses before laying out the cash for them. By any measurement, they are not mainstream. They could just as easily be your Holy Grail as they could be your dust collecting case of buyer's regret. By the way, Gary Grainger is a really nice guy, as well as a hell of a player.

Edited February 28, 2013 by Budbear

[BB3000S]

Had the opportunity to try out a "private stock" GG the other day at Guitar Center San Diego, an increadibly nice bass - extremely well put together and played like a dream. Great sound to it as well, as far as playing in a music store goes. Amazing slap tone and punchy and clear played fingerstyle. Look at that spalted top, like an ancient map... Had a price tag to go with it though, but very kind of the GC guy helping me (Dan) to go pick this one out from the hi end dispay for me to try.

[Bolo]

That private stock bass looks pretty good, and that price is only in mickey mouse money
One string more and I'd be saving up for one!

[Spoombung]

That's a very poor ergonomic design from nearly every angle.