how long should I wait before I start asking for moderator help?

[mcnach]

[quote name='tedmanzie' timestamp='1359661347' post='1958507']
it seems to be the norm for sellers to request paypal gift or BACS on basschat, or ask the buyer to pay extra to cover fees. i didn't realise the 'gift' had no comeback via paypal so maybe the mods should put some advice as a sticky? personally i think if you take paypal payment you should take the fees as the seller, not the buyer.
[/quote]

they are all private transactions, there are no "shoulds".
Both parties agree to whatever they want to, and that's what you do.
In addition, it's certainly YOUR responsibility to know what you are doing. If you use Paypal, find out what it is that you are doing and the rules involved, fees etc.
I'm not against having a sticky bringing these issues to the attention of people easily.... but I do not understand how anybody would start sending payments etc without having read the conditions first
If they do something wrong because they did not bother... that's only their fault.

Edited February 1, 2013 by mcnach

[mcnach]

[quote name='uncle psychosis' timestamp='1359673343' post='1958788']
I don't really see why thats a problem. You buy something, its yours. A seller can ask for as much as they want for something---its buyers who will decide if that price is appropriate or not.

Is selling a 50s precision bass for a lot more than its original purchase price a no-no?
[/quote]


I agree.

Anybody can ask for anything they want to. I always have the option of not being interested in their price, and move on.
Some people are more motivated than others to make a profit. So what? I don't have to buy from anybody. If I find something I like, for a price I agree with, I don't care whether the seller is going to make a profit of £20 or £200... all I know is the price is ok for me.

To expect that others should price things the way I want them to... is, quite frankly, a little arrogant.

[garythebass]

I bought an item on here and I know the seller made a bit of a profit.

I have no problem with that at all.

He bought well and I was prepared to pay the asking price because I thought it was a fair deal.

In fact, I had earlier missed out on a similar item that was more expensive because I wasn't quick enough.

[karlfer]

OK, so I'm in the wrong about flipping, I have a choice not to buy, I'm not going to get an original 53 P for the £150 or whatever it cost in 1953.
My bugbear is somebody buying a P on FEEBay for £665 and putting it on here the next day at £1000. His 7th such move in a year.
That is tantamount to trading and sorry, I find it a bloody insult.
I certainly don't ask for mates rates. If it's just above what I think something is worth, I will offer a little below. If it's what i would be happy to pay, I will pay that.
Thank Christ at long last I am almost GAS free (I need to get back to 4 basses before she twigs my world didn't end at three)
Mean while, back at how long would you wait?

[Conan]

[quote name='karlfer' timestamp='1359751846' post='1959983']
My bugbear is somebody buying a P on FEEBay for £665 and putting it on here the next day at £1000.
[/quote]

Yes, I can see how that would be irritating - and it is certainly a bit cheeky - but he is within his rights to try to do it. Guys like yourself will always spot this type of thing and either bring it to the attention of others or offer him what you deem to be a "fair" price knowing what he paid. That is also fair!

But yes, back on topic....

[Hutton]

[quote name='karlfer' timestamp='1359751846' post='1959983']
OK, so I'm in the wrong about flipping, I have a choice not to buy, I'm not going to get an original 53 P for the £150 or whatever it cost in 1953.
My bugbear is somebody buying a P on FEEBay for £665 and putting it on here the next day at £1000. His 7th such move in a year.
That is tantamount to trading and sorry, I find it a bloody insult.
I certainly don't ask for mates rates. If it's just above what I think something is worth, I will offer a little below. If it's what i would be happy to pay, I will pay that.
Thank Christ at long last I am almost GAS free (I need to get back to 4 basses before she twigs my world didn't end at three)
Mean while, back at how long would you wait?
[/quote]

I'm with you on this. I don't think BC is a place for traders which is what it is if someone passes a bass on in a matter of days for a siginificant profit.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='karlfer' timestamp='1359751846' post='1959983']
OK, so I'm in the wrong about flipping, I have a choice not to buy, I'm not going to get an original 53 P for the £150 or whatever it cost in 1953.
My bugbear is somebody buying a P on FEEBay for £665 and putting it on here the next day at £1000. His 7th such move in a year.
That is tantamount to trading and sorry, I find it a bloody insult.
I certainly don't ask for mates rates. If it's just above what I think something is worth, I will offer a little below. If it's what i would be happy to pay, I will pay that.
Thank Christ at long last I am almost GAS free (I need to get back to 4 basses before she twigs my world didn't end at three)
Mean while, back at how long would you wait?
[/quote]
What if someone buys a bass on here for £665 and sells it on FEEBay for £1000 the next day. Is that o.k?

[tedmanzie]

In my opinion there is absolutely nothing wrong with someone buying a bass on ebay for £665 and putting it on here for £1000.
'His 7th such move in the year' - so what?! So he's sold 7 basses, good luck to him, its hardly mugging old ladies.
Sorry for getting off topic here....

Edited February 1, 2013 by tedmanzie

[3below]

I have bought several basses from here. All have been at very fair prices, some £200+ below shop prices. Somehow seems wrong to buy here and then make a fast buck selling here at a profit. I know it is buyers choice and a free market. I guess I feel that if I have a bass from here at a good price, I should pass that good price back to others here. Yes I agree some kit will increase in value, yes I will add in what I might spend - new strings, setup etc. It is not simple.

[wateroftyne]

People can sell (try to) stuff for whatever price they like.

If they sell something on for more than they paid a few days ago, then... it's a bit cheeky, but c'est a vie.

[4 Strings]

I agree, he's providing a service as far as I can see, taking a risk on gear from ebay and passing to interested members here.

I think one of the great things about buying from anyone on here is that there is opportunity for people who know a bit to ask questions. About incorrect details on an old bass, spotting a poor neck joint, strings out of line etc. Its not the easiest place to advertise. Can't be too many incorrectly described basses sold on here. A lively for sale section is a good thing for the list, many on here are interested in gear and browse.

Too by from someone on the list and straight away sell on for more I do not think is in the spirit of the list where we're all friends looking out for others who are like minded. We're not to comment on prices but I would feel happier for someone to pm a message that confirm someone is aware they are underselling than simply grab it and run.

Edited February 1, 2013 by 4 Strings

[nottswarwick]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1359757560' post='1960100']
People can sell (try to) stuff for whatever price they like.

If they sell something on for more than they paid a few days ago, then... it's a bit cheeky, but c'est a vie.
[/quote]

Yep that's right. We are all grown adults and hopefully we take care to find out true value of items (completed sale research etc) before deciding to buy.

If its too expensive don't buy it.

[Lord Sausage]

I've bought a bass and sold two cabs on basschat and not once as gift been bought into it. It's always been straight paypal. So i think it's a little unfair to make it seem like gifts is prevalent. i am quite pissed now tho!

[mushers]

lets be thankfull there are no 5 to 4 string bass conversions for sale here from a certain individual who trades on ebay

[BetaFunk]

What i do find strange when selling on here is this. I have a bass for sale and two people have asked how much it would be to send it. I've told them it would be £10 insured. This seems more than reasonable to me and in fact is going to cost me more than that to send it by the courier i use.
Both are seemingly now not interested in buying it. I wonder why they even bothered to ask?

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='tedmanzie' timestamp='1359756959' post='1960083']
In my opinion there is absolutely nothing wrong with someone buying a bass on ebay for £665 and putting it on here for £1000.
'His 7th such move in the year' - so what?! So he's sold 7 basses, good luck to him, its hardly mugging old ladies.
Sorry for getting off topic here....
[/quote]
+1

[4 Strings]

[quote name='mushers' timestamp='1359758043' post='1960113']
lets be thankfull there are no 5 to 4 string bass conversions for sale here from a certain individual who trades on ebay
[/quote]

Leave our nuts out if this!

[Big_Stu]

[quote name='karlfer' timestamp='1359751846' post='1959983']My bugbear is somebody buying a P on FEEBay for £665 and putting it on here the next day at £1000. His 7th such move in a year.[/quote]

i see that as "fair-dos"; he got their first on Ebay, which is an open market to a trader as well as a player. Maybe knew a bargain when he saw one using his skill & judgement, everyone here has the same chance if they do the research & look hard enough. However, totally different ball-game doing the same stunt on BC Sales; which denies someone who genuinely did want the item getting it for a good price - that's more like profiteering to me.
(IMHO, YMMV etc etc.)

[mcnach]

[quote name='karlfer' timestamp='1359751846' post='1959983']
OK, so I'm in the wrong about flipping, I have a choice not to buy, I'm not going to get an original 53 P for the £150 or whatever it cost in 1953.
My bugbear is somebody buying a P on FEEBay for £665 and putting it on here the next day at £1000. His 7th such move in a year.
That is tantamount to trading and sorry, I find it a bloody insult.
[/quote]

Why is it insulting?

I don't know the person you are talking about, but if I noticed the pattern you mention, I would probably feel a bit less warmer towards him/her.
Why?
Because I like the "atmosphere" in this forum, and pure profit seeking activity without being a contributor in other ways is not what makes me feel warm about someone here. But I would not find it insulting. They are not doing anything wrong.

[mcnach]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1359752343' post='1959993']
Yes, I can see how that would be irritating - and it is certainly a bit cheeky - but he is within his rights to try to do it. Guys like yourself will always spot this type of thing and either bring it to the attention of others or offer him what you deem to be a "fair" price knowing what he paid. That is also fair!
[/quote]

I disagree. I don't think it's fair.

If I advertised a... Boss OC2 for £100 when I paid £20 for it (making this up, I am not selling and I wish I had found one for £20), who are you or anybody else to interfere and start saying to others that I should price it lower?
If you don't like it, don't buy it. Full stop.
In fact, one of the rules in the Sales forum is precisely not to interfere with pricing etc.

[Musky]

Anyone remember the Fender CS that was sold on here several times, before finally being advertised for a far higher price? Caused something of stir at the time AFAIR.

Opinions on the matter seem to have shifted in the intervening years.

Edit: Although ebay wasn't involved in that instance. Not sure if that makes a difference?

Edited February 1, 2013 by Musky

[Lozz196]

This all works two ways for me:

1. If I buy something, or get something in a trade, if I move it on I do so at the same price. Last year I acquired a great Precision in a trade, and could have sold it (I`m sure) for more than the item I was trading, but I didn`t, in the interests of fair play.

2. But the flip side, if something is being sold at a price I`m happy to pay, I`m not fussed if the seller bought it for less.

I guess these two slightly opposing views account for the reason I`ll never be rich.

[MiltyG565]

Why would you make an offer based on what the seller had paid? just because you want the bargain he had? Sorry, nope. I know people who have made their living spotting a deal and jumping at it and selling it at full market price (maybe after a bit of work). Most car dealers do it, are you going to walk on to a forecourt and say "Yeah, i saw this one on gumtree last week for £500, so i'll offer you £500, instead of the £1000 you want". My response would be "Well why didn't you buy it then?".

The seller is perfectly within his right to stick whatever price they want on it. If it is too high, it likely won't sell, if it is too low, somebody will buy it in a heartbeat, and you will probably see it back on the market in a few days. The buyer is also in their rights to make an offer, but the seller doesn't have to accept.

C'mon guys, this is just getting silly. Does the OP have his stuff yet?

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='Musky' timestamp='1359761213' post='1960166']
Anyone remember the Fender CS that was sold on here several times, before finally being advertised for a far higher price? Caused something of stir at the time AFAIR.

Opinions on the matter seem to have shifted in the intervening years.
[/quote] too right- I've been reading this and wondering what has happened to this place in the last few years! Quite a change I think - I always thought there used to be a unwritten rule that you didn't try and make a profit out of buying and selling on here. Yes when ebay/inflation rates/or things generally going up in price get involved it gets more complex.

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1359718056' post='1959197']
I'm inclined to agree. Lots of people lose money on most basses they sell. If someone makes a bit of profit now and then I can't see what's wrong?
[/quote]

It used to be if barry sold me a bass for £700 and I didn't get on with it I would sell it for about £700 to someone else - even if the bass could have fetched a wee bit more elsewhere, sticking it up here for £1000 a month later... it's not 'wrong' as such but kinda against the spirit of the thing.

But then there are lots of different shades of it being right or wrong - like if I buy a bass and two years later everyone wants that bass so the value has gone up then aye you would stick the price up from what you paid. But if you bought something and 2 min later stuck it up... well the motivation for buying it seems to have been profit and not wanting to own a bass - that's when I think it can get a bit dubious for the forum. If it's about basses and there are small amount's of increase sometimes fine, if it's about folk trying to make a profit off each other then it all gets a bit crappy. (and if it is then shouldn't Basschat should be charging £5 per bass ad or something?)

Like I'm fairly good at photography and words - so I can make a bass look nice (which makes it easier to sell), you work in a bass shop so I'm sure could easily sell things through there at a higher price (even after comms) just cos we have the abilty to take something from someone in the community cheaply and turn it into profit through our skills.... it doesn't make it morally right does it?

Edited February 2, 2013 by LukeFRC

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1359765689' post='1960213']
Why would you make an offer based on what the seller had paid? just because you want the bargain he had? Sorry, nope. I know people who have made their living spotting a deal and jumping at it and selling it at full market price (maybe after a bit of work). Most car dealers do it, are you going to walk on to a forecourt and say "Yeah, i saw this one on gumtree last week for £500, so i'll offer you £500, instead of the £1000 you want". My response would be "Well why didn't you buy it then?".
[/quote]
a dealer will be paying tax and other costs, there will also be a guarantee of some kind based on their work. Folk are happy to pay for this.
their focus is speculating money on things in order to make a profit.

If folk want to do that on Basschat that's fine but I personally would prefer they did it in the affiliates forum like all the other dealers (bass gallery, bass direct, bass gear etc) would