Chris2112 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Afternoon, I brought my bass and amp down to the front room this afternoon, having previously had it upstairs in my spare room. I thought I would probably play it more if I could sit down at my laptop with it and jam along to music again, something I haven't done a great deal of since I moved house late last year. Having just sat down with the bass and had a play, it sounds pretty crap. I'm using a Warwick Thumb 5 string, an Ashdown MK500 amp, with the amp positioned directly behind me and my laptop speakers in front of me. The bass sounds very boomy. It didn't have enough definition when I started playing it, so I tweaked the amp to cut some of the bass from the mix and boosted the mids slightly. There was little room between getting a satisfactory low end that wasn't booming round the room and having a bass that didn't sound honky and harsh in the mids. I managed to get a sound that I was happy to play along with, though I was still dissatisfied as the Thumb usually sounds great and is a joy to listen to. The same setup sounds fantastic in my spare room. My front room is pretty big (it runs the length of the house), and it has a laminate wood flooring over a solid concrete floor. The walls are paint on plaster over plasterboard. There are no curtains, just blinds and the only soft furnishing in the room is the sofa. In my spare bedroom, the amp sits on a carpeted floor in a smaller room with a double bed in it to soak up some of the boom. I hasten to add that I've played live in venues just using my amp for sound before, and found a similar problem that was sorted by some high volume mixing. But I don't really want to crank the amp and piss off the neighbours, I am wondering if there is a solution for my problem as it is now. Would something like an Auralex Grammar pad help or not? I don't think it's the floor that is causing the problem, as it should be an excellent launching pad for a good, tight bass sound. I think it's due to the size of the room and the lack of soft furnishings that are causing me problems. I like a really 'tight' sound like you might get from close-mic'ing an amp in a small studio room, and I'm just not getting that in my front room. Any ideas? Obviously I can't carpet the walls, as much as I would like to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Carpet the walls. I take it that the spare room is significantly smaller than your living room? And pretty much square in floor shape? Have you tried sitting the combo on a square of carpet or foam or something like that? Is it at ear height or on the floor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterfire666 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 You could always move house. my front room is just like that too, very difficult to fix without upsetting the wife. so i got the loft converted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Acoustics biting you on the arse? Only solution is to sort out the acoustics, any other solution provided in this thread is not really going to sort it out and leave the bass sound unscathed. You would do well to get some more (plenty more) absorption in the room. Basstraping too if you can find a way. However if you have parallel opposite walls and ceiling/floor, and the dimensions of the room are conducive to bass frequencies ringing longer than you would like then this is going to be an uphill battle. As you have already found out eqing doesnt solve the issue, because the physical space you are in is causing certain frequencies to ring too long (the energy in those frequencies is bouncing around for longer than you want). However as much as this can be (is normally, ie almost always and completely) caused by the room itself, it can also be exacerbated by the position of the sound source in the room. Try moving the amp around all over the place int he room and see if the issue lessens anywhere. Then try moving you around and see if you can find a place where the nulls and peaks and you and the amp can be so aligned as to give the impression that its all ok or at least significantly better. Give youself a few hours to try and figure this one out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Have you thought about practising through headphones - Korg Pandora ect ? Easy to plug in your bass and computer together and balance the sound to do playalongs ect . Not the same as playing through an amp , I know , but very convenient nevertheless . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 You mentioned Ashdown?......runs for cover Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Rock Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Move the laptop into the spare room? Obviously you'll have thought of this and have your reasons why you've not done it, but it may be the way with best results and least hassle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lettsguitars Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Try moving the amp around and hang some rugs up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tedmanzie Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 is the amp playing out through the laptop speakers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-bbb Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1359564939' post='1956746'] You mentioned Ashdown?......runs for cover [/quote] You mentioned Warwick too .... (Ducks to avoid flying ashtrays) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted January 30, 2013 Author Share Posted January 30, 2013 Regarding the above points: 1) The spare room where I usually keep my amp is about half the size of my front room. The amp sits at ground level and faces me and the bed. It sounds very 'tight' and articulate. My Warwick sounds like a sledgehammer there, very direct and articulate. 2) Sadly, I can't dress up my front room by hanging rugs, waffle boxes or foam on the walls. 3) Someone took a snipe at Ashdown above. I make no secret of the fact that most of their amps do nothing for me. But this is the Mark King amp. It's very crisp and clean sounding, with a strong bottom end. It's a bloody good amp, but the problem here seems to be the room. I doubt even Jonas Hellborg's EBS head and some Bergantino cabs would solve the problem... 4) The amp is not playing through the laptop speakers. But getting some headphone and a Pandora may be the best solution yet. I can't take my laptop up to the spare room, simply because down here it is hooked up to my mouse, keyboard and desktop speakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfalex v1.1 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 [quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1359564400' post='1956738'] Have you thought about practising through headphones - Korg Pandora ect ? Easy to plug in your bass and computer together and balance the sound to do playalongs ect . Not the same as playing through an amp , I know , but very convenient nevertheless . [/quote] I use a Pandora and Sennheiser HD 415 mk1 headphones. Job done. Better bandwidth, response.... In fact, everything, than an amp/cab in a domestic environment. And you can plug an external source into it. As mine uses batteries, it's viable in a power cut/ your garden/work canteen and so on! Downside? More finger/ string noise until you learn to tame it. That, and the sudden re-appearance of room- induced sonic artifacts like reverb and various resonances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_5 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 +1 to moving your amp around the room - or sit in a different place relative to your amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted January 30, 2013 Author Share Posted January 30, 2013 [quote name='Lfalex v1.1' timestamp='1359566875' post='1956795'] I use a Pandora and Sennheiser HD 415 mk1 headphones. Job done. Better bandwidth, response.... In fact, everything, than an amp/cab in a domestic environment. And you can plug an external source into it. As mine uses batteries, it's viable in a power cut/ your garden/work canteen and so on! Downside? More finger/ string noise until you learn to tame it. That, and the sudden re-appearance of room- induced sonic artifacts like reverb and various resonances. [/quote] So, this Pandora thing, can I just have that on it's own with some good headphones? I won't need to have my amp downstairs at all? I could just keep the amp for playing live or trips to the studio etc etc...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brensabre79 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Its probably the bed and the smaller room dimensions that is helping it sound tighter in the bedroom. big open space with hard surfaces = bass for bass! If you're not prepared to carpet the lounge and hang some thick velvet drapes and flock wallpaper, the either headphones or move back to the spare room, but repurpose it... After much negotiation with Mrs Sabre79 she finally bowed to the logic of commom sense - at the price of a small amount of convenience for our sparodic overnight visitors. I converted the spare room into a studio and we bought a very nice sofabed for the lounge. Now those guests who come once a year to visit can sleep in the lounge, and the spare room gets used every day. The added bonus is that guests rarely outstay their welcome as the cat gets bitey in the night if he can't sleep on the sofa, so I can get back to my studio making music Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfalex v1.1 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Yep. The Pandora is the size of a big box of matches. It takes 4x AAA batteries or a 4.5v power adaptor. It has a 1/4" instrument input, 3.5mm stereo aux in jack and 1/4" stereo headphone output. It has onboard fx, a tuner, tone controls, and plenty of other stuff that I don't even use. You can change the gain/master structure as it has controls for both. What you don't want, you can disable, so it doesn't clutter your sound. I like mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Stu Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Tried sitting the amp on the sofa with it firing towards (not against) the backrest? Just curious really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tedmanzie Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 imo you are most likely getting a standing wave problem due to the dimensions and shape of your new room, emphasised by the materials - concrete floor, lack of furnishings. the dimensions will decide the resonant frequencies, the shape is probably square or rectangular parallel walls reinforcing the frequencies. the concrete floor is not helping, its probably making things worse as it bounces the waves straight back, again making the standing waves more fierce. if you move around the room while playing you'll probably find some places emphasise frequencies more than others, and in other places the frequencies dip. in your other room the bass frequencies would pass through the floor which i expect reduced a great deal of the problem, and your double bed is acting like a giant bass trap nicely taming the low frequencies rebounding around the room. perhaps also the spare room has better dimensions, but i bet its mostly the bed and the floor. even though the problems in the new room are in the bass end, the frequencies multiply (i think) so the problem is audible in the mids and upper end. i'm not an expert on this by any means, but i have exactly this problem in my studio which also has a concrete floor and not a lot in it to soak up the bass frequencies - so i have been reading up on it and taking advice. carpet on the walls won't do anything really, even if you could do it. to tame those bass frequencies you need BIG things like beds and sofas - in other words bass traps. bass traps need to be substantial, so you're not really going to be able to do much aside from finding a different listening position and maybe trying a smaller speaker that doesn't produce so much bass? by far the easiest solution is to practice in the spare room where it sounded good originally! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monckyman Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Knell. As above, Headphones. Your neighbours will thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mykesbass Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Or turn the laptop speakers down and play along unplugged (or am I just weird)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 [quote name='Chris2112' timestamp='1359567483' post='1956810'] So, this Pandora thing, can I just have that on it's own with some good headphones? I won't need to have my amp downstairs at all? I could just keep the amp for playing live or trips to the studio etc etc...? [/quote] The Pandora is all you need . I got one on a whim , and now my amp I practise through at home needs servicing because I have hardly used it for two years ! The Pandora is so handy , and it is easy to record yourself onto your computer with it too . You will need some headphones with good bass response that are relatively easy to drive ie pretty low ohm rating and relatively high sensitivity . I use Sennheiser HD485 , but these are now discontinued , as are the HD415 , I believe . There's plenty of other models that will be fine though . Give me a shout of need help choosing some . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted February 2, 2013 Author Share Posted February 2, 2013 Funny, a mate of mine who loves his hi-fi gear has found a pair of Sennheiser HD410's which he's giving me. I'll need to collect them from his place, but for free gear, that's pretty cool of him! I'll order a Pandora when I have the cash to spare (car needs new tyres and insurance next month). Until then, bass in the bedroom it is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 [quote name='Chris2112' timestamp='1359836999' post='1961068'] Funny, a mate of mine who loves his hi-fi gear has found a pair of Sennheiser HD410's which he's giving me. I'll need to collect them from his place, but for free gear, that's pretty cool of him! I'll order a Pandora when I have the cash to spare (car needs new tyres and insurance next month). Until then, bass in the bedroom it is! [/quote] Free is good ! The 410s will get you going , and if you find you get a lot of use out of the Pandora you could always upgrade to better headphones at a later date . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3below Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Cheap 10 or 31 band graphic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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