Prime_BASS Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Recently got the Genz-Benz Focus LT 410T, and I'm pretty much liking it for what it is. I'm finding however during rehearsals and the one gig I've done, unless it is higher, around the height of what a 8x10 would be thus closer to my ear it's a bit boomy in the lows, probably some dispersion thing aswell as as coupling. I'm not looking at changing EQ as I already cut the bass eq on the amp to help cut some boom and not be overly loud in the lows(although when it's raised the bass is set at 12 o'clock. and lowering the low mids is a bit out of the question too since I really want the high mids boosted and the amp doesn't really allow for both to happen. I would rather be able to raise it with something that I can take with me to gigs incase a table or a big and stable enough beer crate isn't available. I thought about something like the gramma pad but even if it does rid the boom, I don't think it'll be anywhere nearly high enough. What else is out there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertbass Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Flight case. Protect your cab in transit and stand the cab on top off it to gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 [quote name='bertbass' timestamp='1359584474' post='1957226'] Flight case. Protect your cab in transit and stand the cab on top off it to gig. [/quote]+1, though anything that will lift it 30 odd inches will do. Lifting it that high introduces a floor bounce reflection that counteracts boom in the midbass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepbass5 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 too high could play havock with the vocal mics and piss band mates off I use a dolly board 3" for wheeling gear in and always put my cabs on it. just de couples the floor so i always get the same sound to EQ. Carpets are the pits sucks the sound away, and hollow stages boom. But always get used to putting it on something, the same thing every gig helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark_Bass Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Would the Auralex help? http://bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/Auralex_Isolation_Risers.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 [quote name='deepbass5' timestamp='1359587622' post='1957314'] too high could play havock with the vocal mics and piss band mates off [/quote]Why? It's no higher than an 8x10, let alone a stack. [quote]Would the Auralex help?[/quote]Not unless it's 30 inches or so high. The claims that Auralex makes for what it can do are as phony as a three dollar bill, or your equivalent thereof. Stages don't boom because the cab is touching them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted January 31, 2013 Author Share Posted January 31, 2013 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1359591911' post='1957384'] Why? It's no higher than an 8x10, let alone a stack. Not unless it's 30 inches or so high. The claims that Auralex makes for what it can do are as phony as a three dollar bill, or your equivalent thereof. Stages don't boom because the cab is touching them. [/quote] I've always been sceptical about those gramma pads. I used to play every show with 2 2x10's vertical to get it as high as a 8x10, and it was never a problem for mics etc, as you say. It did get some boom from the stage/floor at rehearsals, wasn't so bad on at gigs, but now I have a 4x10 it's definitely a problem. I thought about a flightcase. However my current knowledge of them suggests they are big and cumbersome and expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertbass Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 Flight cases are not a lot bigger than the cab that goes inside them and as they have wheels and decent handles, they're not that cumbersome. Can't argue your third point though unless you can get a used one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 Gramma pads do have an affect on wooden stages, but if you're getting boom on a solid floor, then it ain't gonna help. How about a portable workbench? Something like this... http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-Series-09788-Fold-Down-Workbench/dp/B003D0K50Y Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nottswarwick Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1359591911' post='1957384'] The claims that Auralex makes for what it can do are as phony as a three dollar bill, or your equivalent thereof. Stages don't boom because the cab is touching them. [/quote] Really?. I use one and have never A B tested n the same stage....so I just always assumed it must work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 A decent 410 shouldn't be boomy, IME... but an amp with a semi paramtric EQ stage is good for notching problematic rooms... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 [quote name='nottswarwick' timestamp='1359664158' post='1958559'] Really?. I use one and have never A B tested n the same stage....so I just always assumed it must work [/quote]It does work, but not the way they claim. The cab contacting a stage does not cause it to vibrate; that would be the tail wagging the dog. The sound coming from the cab can cause a resonant stage to vibrate, which in turn can cause the cab to vibrate atop it. You may want to isolate the cab to stop it from vibrating. You can use a fifty quid gizmo, but rubber feet are all you need. Isolating the cab won't stop boom because the cab contacting the stage doesn't cause boom. It's the resonance of the stage and/or other reflection issues in the room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1359669257' post='1958677'] A decent 410 shouldn't be boomy, IME... but an amp with a semi paramtric EQ stage is good for notching problematic rooms... [/quote] This is your answer. Without knowing where the boom is coming from and what frequency is causing it you are working in the dark. A separate parametric equalizer is your best bet. It will also enable you to sort your midrange problem out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molan Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 [quote name='nottswarwick' timestamp='1359664158' post='1958559'] Really?. I use one and have never A B tested n the same stage....so I just always assumed it must work [/quote] I had a pair of cabs that were quite boomy on some stages. Bought an Auralex and they stopped booming. I've also loaned mine to a friend and he said it really helped with boom at one venue where he'd always had issues before. That's good enough for me to recommend them. Mind you - it does look like you could make one that did the same job for a lot less. Too much hassle for me though, lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delberthot Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 I've also thought about sitting a cab on top of its flightcase. Would the fact that the cab is sitting on top of a near enough sealed empty box with wheels have an effect on the sound? If not then I'm going to build myself a lightweight one when I change cabs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 With a fair amount of suspicion that I was wandering into snake oil territory, I bought an Auralex pad a couple of years back. Best £50 I ever spent on my sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepbass5 Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 [quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' timestamp='1359670963' post='1958726'] It does work, but not the way they claim. The cab contacting a stage does not cause it to vibrate; that would be the tail wagging the dog. The sound coming from the cab can cause a resonant stage to vibrate, which in turn can cause the cab to vibrate atop it. You may want to isolate the cab to stop it from vibrating. You can use a fifty quid gizmo, but rubber feet are all you need. Isolating the cab won't stop boom because the cab contacting the stage doesn't cause boom. It's the resonance of the stage and/or other reflection issues in the room. [/quote] I think you’re gonna disappear up ya own arse one day Bill. Yes ok it is the propagation of whatever chooses to vibrate in sympathy with a given frequency. Possibly sometimes maybe the dimensions of the wooden box you are all set up on, just as likely to be the drummer setting it off. Basically something sounds Shttt. If raising your cab 1" or a foot off the deck on a beer crate, 4 paper cups or a very expensive thing that sounds like a throat sweet, and it works what the hell. I would just add don't play louder than the room will let you and you probably be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 The best cure for boom I've found is the GP12 pre amp in aTrace Elliot AH200 head. Cut the 30hz to the max, 40hz cut by half and and pop the mids to plus 3db, no more problems on boomy stages. I have a Gramma Pad and it works to a good degree but I was still having problems at a couple of venues. Not any more. Having the graphic eq has been a revelation, so much so that I'm collecting another Tracie Head tomorrow. Fingers crossed it works as well and sounds as nice as the one I've been borrowing for the last two months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deepbass5 Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 Tend to agree Kenny, Those heads with a good size graphic are largly missing from todays current choice. When you need to notch a troublesome frequency, you do not have the weapons to deal with it. I can understand why Mark King got Ashdown to produce one. We love these light weight amps with fat shelving EQs but there's a lot to be said for an old Peavey valve preamp and a 31 band graphic in a rack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 I guess I could look at a para or graphic EQ to add to my board for my overall 'sound' and use the head to EQ to room more. But at the same time I am after getting up off the floor to get it closer to my ears. So all the arguing about what causes boom and weather the Gramma pads or not doesn't really give me much to work from. I don't drive and usually beg and borrow lifts with my gear so having a flightcase is a bit out of the question. What else is there? I was thinking of DIY'ing a wooden 'hat' for the cab, it'll sit on top of the cab when in transit, then at gigs it'll stand on top of it. however it'll have to hold 25+ kgs of weight and I'm not sure another box under neath the cab is going to do any good to acoustics or what have you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 May well not be the cab. If it only booms on the notes on the E-string, try lowering the pickup on that side. I find that happens a lot on my Precisions (especially when playing a G), probably as I`m quite heavy handed, so I lower the pickup that side, and raise it the other side a bit, to compensate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted February 3, 2013 Author Share Posted February 3, 2013 Bass has just had a re-setup from changing strings so I doubt very much it's that, as the low mids effect every thing, and it's mainly in my practice space. If there is something I can use to take to gigs aswell as when at home that would be awesome. When it's at ear height I really dig pretty much any cab. I could just tilt it back with something to help the dispersion crap, but then I'd be stuck with that low-mid boom from all the coupling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 What about something like this http://www.gear4music.com/Woodwind-Brass-Strings/Ultimate-Support-AMP150-Guitar-Amp-Stand/HDV or this http://www.dv247.com/amplifiers/quik-lok-bs317-guitar-amplifier-combo-stand--3183 I can sympathise with you in not being able to hear your cab. I've always struggled with single 410's and low cabs in general. I'm using a 310 vertical stack on smaller gigs now and I can now hear everything very clearly. Although they get scorn poured on them I've also invested in a sealed 810 for the bigger rooms. I've never had to crank it and it's really nice just having it sat there ticking over and being able to hear every note as clear as day. Hope you get it sorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nottswarwick Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 [quote name='kennyrodg' timestamp='1359903028' post='1961794'] What about something like this http://www.gear4music.com/Woodwind-Brass-Strings/Ultimate-Support-AMP150-Guitar-Amp-Stand/HDV or this http://www.dv247.com/amplifiers/quik-lok-bs317-guitar-amplifier-combo-stand--3183 I can sympathise with you in not being able to hear your cab. I've always struggled with single 410's and low cabs in general. I'm using a 310 vertical stack on smaller gigs now and I can now hear everything very clearly. Although they get scorn poured on them I've also invested in a sealed 810 for the bigger rooms. I've never had to crank it and it's really nice just having it sat there ticking over and being able to hear every note as clear as day. Hope you get it sorted. [/quote] I,used to use the quik lok one with a markbass 410 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nottswarwick Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 [quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1359584301' post='1957218'] Recently got the Genz-Benz Focus LT 410T, and I'm pretty much liking it for what it is. I'm finding however during rehearsals and the one gig I've done, unless it is higher, around the height of what a 8x10 would be thus closer to my ear it's a bit boomy in the lows, probably some dispersion thing aswell as as coupling. I'm not looking at changing EQ as I already cut the bass eq on the amp to help cut some boom and not be overly loud in the lows(although when it's raised the bass is set at 12 o'clock. and lowering the low mids is a bit out of the question too since I really want the high mids boosted and the amp doesn't really allow for both to happen. I would rather be able to raise it with something that I can take with me to gigs incase a table or a big and stable enough beer crate isn't available. I thought about something like the gramma pad but even if it does rid the boom, I don't think it'll be anywhere nearly high enough. What else is out there? [/quote] Also, maybe the cab is errr not very good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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