Roundwounds In - Flatwounds Out

[Hobbayne]

When I started playing bass circa 1982, round wound strings were the industry standard. However, in the 50,s and 60,s flats were the standard. This got me thinking "When did rounds become the main bass string?" Listening to music in the early 70,s flats were still king, but circa 1976, 1977 it was mainly rounds in the charts (JJB, Bruce Foxton etc) So when did flats get replaced? My guess in 1975. The disco era was kicking in, and those twangy octave leaps cut through the mix better. Only a guess though. Any thoughts?

[risingson]

Anthony Jackson always cites Jack Casady as bringing roundwounds into fashion, at least partially. Guess Entwhistle will have helped eventually when he did the old switcharoo as well. Most bass players and producers were too worried about them sounding too much like guitars.

Edited January 31, 2013 by risingson

[Cat Burrito]

[quote name='Hobbayne' timestamp='1359671324' post='1958739'] "When did rounds become the main bass string?"
[/quote]
Whatcha talkin bout willis?!

[xgsjx]

I think one of the main factors rounds became more popular is that they're @ 1/2 the price of flatwounds.
If they were both about the same, then I think you'd see a lot more flatwound players (when was the last time you tried a bass in a shop that came with flats?).

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1359673299' post='1958787']
I think one of the main factors rounds became more popular is that they're @ 1/2 the price of flatwounds.
If they were both about the same, then I think you'd see a lot more flatwound players (when was the last time you tried a bass in a shop that came with flats?).
[/quote] I always presumed that that was because string makers will make less money off of flats as they will get replaced less regularly!

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1359673299' post='1958787']
I think one of the main factors rounds became more popular is that they're @ 1/2 the price of flatwounds.
If they were both about the same, then I think you'd see a lot more flatwound players (when was the last time you tried a bass in a shop that came with flats?).
[/quote]

Lakland flats. Twenty quid. As good as you'll get....

[Happy Jack]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1359674205' post='1958802']
Lakland flats. Twenty quid. As good as you'll get....
[/quote]

True that, though harder to get hold of.

But as already pointed out, flats last damned near forever. If you buy rounds because they're cheaper, you haven't done your sums right.

[Les]

I tried flats not long ago, did a bit of research on here and threw some money at the Thomastik ones, about 45 quid if I recall. They were very good but I eventually went back to rounds.

[discreet]

John Paul Jones early on, and Entwistle for sure - Woodstock 1969. Then huge chart exposure for the roundwound 'boing' from Chris Squire on Yes's 'Roundabout' in 1972. But Roto rounds were first produced in 1962.

Edited February 1, 2013 by discreet

[xgsjx]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1359673703' post='1958791']
I always presumed that that was because string makers will make less money off of flats as they will get replaced less regularly!
[/quote]

Good point. It might well be a mix of both. Stick a cheapish set of rounds on in the factory & the player will bond with that type of string & have a fear of trying flats as the MD can tell everyone that they're very dull sounding & have no top end, which some folk take as being "you can't hear anything above the 7th fret"!

[Hobbayne]

I did try flats out of curiosity and didn't like them, and the black nylon ones, but soon went back to rounds. I didn't like the feel of them. I suppose I have just been conditioned, (a bit like the North Koreans), and play what im told!

[icastle]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1359673299' post='1958787']
I think one of the main factors rounds became more popular is that they're @ 1/2 the price of flatwounds.
If they were both about the same, then I think you'd see a lot more flatwound players (when was the last time you tried a bass in a shop that came with flats?).
[/quote]

I think that's more of a 'chicken and egg' scenario.

If more people used flats then you'd see the price come down and a greater selection of them in your local music store.

[jezzaboy]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1359703668' post='1958937']
Good point. It might well be a mix of both. Stick a cheapish set of rounds on in the factory & the player will bond with that type of string & have a fear of trying flats as the MD can tell everyone that they're very dull sounding & have no top end, which some folk take as being "you can't hear anything above the 7th fret"!
[/quote]

Above the 7th fret!!!! Are you insane?????

There is [i]nothing [/i]above the 7th fret. The world will end there.

I have Status flats (damm good value, about £20 delivered) on a P and D`addario on the Yam and Ibby so get the best of both worlds. I agree with the earlier posts regarding flats. Mine have been on a few different basses, are about 18 months old and they sound the same as when I bought them so what`s in it for the manufacturers?

[brensabre79]

There's no money past the 7th fret.
I'm putting flats on one of my basses at the moment, i dont like them, but I'm doing a few unplugged gigs with my Artcore and it just sounds wrong with two acoustic guitars when I'm growling away at the back shaking the room with sustained notes
Some music suits flats, some rounds, but rounds definitely suit more rock music, and you can mute them too

[BigRedX]

Surely only a blinkered bassist sees it as an either/or situation. Sometimes you are going to need to rounds and sometimes you are going to need flats. A truly versatile bassist has basses with flats and basses with rounds to cover all eventualities.

[quote name='brensabre79' timestamp='1359713707' post='1959077']
There's no money past the 7th fret.
[/quote]

What a dumb quote! Who said that originally? I need to ridicule them.

[discreet]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1359714300' post='1959090']
I need to ridicule them.
[/quote]

Yes, you do.

[brensabre79]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1359714300' post='1959090']
Surely only a blinkered bassist sees it as an either/or situation. Sometimes you are going to need to rounds and sometimes you are going to need flats. A truly versatile bassist has basses with flats and basses with rounds to cover all eventualities.

What a dumb quote! Who said that originally? I need to ridicule them.
[/quote]

Actually I think it was the 5th fret, and it was Tommy Tedesco. Although I heard that the bass player who was told this replied "Yeah but it's a hell of a party up there!"

[alstocko]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1359674205' post='1958802']


Lakland flats. Twenty quid. As good as you'll get....
[/quote]
+ f***ing 1

Best strings that I've ever played, and I'm a fusion player...

[alstocko]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1359714300' post='1959090']
What a dumb quote! Who said that originally? I need to ridicule them.
[/quote]

Victor Bailey's dad said to him that there's no money past the 5th fret. Does that make you even angrier?

Edited February 1, 2013 by alstocko

[xgsjx]

I have TI flats which I got 2 years ago & love them. They was @ £35, but considering I replaced the rounds every 6 or less months at @ £20 a set, I consider that a bargain.
Whomever did say that flats lack top end had maybe been playing with rubber strings.

I don't miss the zing from rounds & the flats don't lack clarity when going up into the double figure frets.

[Dingus]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1359673299' post='1958787']
I think one of the main factors rounds became more popular is that they're @ 1/2 the price of flatwounds.
If they were both about the same, then I think you'd see a lot more flatwound players (when was the last time you tried a bass in a shop that came with flats?).
[/quote]

This wasn't always the case . I remember 30 + years ago when most brands of flats cost approximately the same as rounds , give or take a quid or two .

[jezzaboy]

Re 5th fret.

I seem to recall that a punk/ska bandmember whose name escapes me for now, turned up at Aston "famly man" Barrett house for a bass lesson. He opened his front door and said to the guy "nothing above the 5th fret!" and promptly shut the door.

And here endeth the lesson Grasshopper.

Apologies for the thread diversion.

[Dingus]

[quote name='risingson' timestamp='1359671858' post='1958753']
Anthony Jackson always cites Jack Casady as bringing roundwounds into fashion, at least partially. Guess Entwhistle will have helped eventually when he did the old switcharoo as well. Most bass players and producers were too worried about them sounding too much like guitars.
[/quote]

If I remember correctly , Jack Cassidy was using Pyramid Flatwounds on his basses in his influential Jefferson Airplane days . Rick Turner and the crew at Alembic ( who were maintaining and modifying Cassidys' equipment in those days ) proffered these strings because of their bright sound and defined attack compared to other popular brands of flats at the time . Anthony Jackson credits Jack Cassidy with being instrumental in developing a guitaristic approach to playing the bass guitar , particulaly with a pick , but in those days it was still on flatwound strings . Anthony was also heavily under the influence of John Entwistle during this era , and was enamoured of his sound with roundwounds on a Fender bass with the Who , and it was that sound that encouraged AJ to make the move to rounds , despite the fact that his other mentor was James Jamerson who was very much in the flatwound camp .

Edited February 1, 2013 by Dingus

[lojo]

I've struggled with the which strings, in my very small covers world, as I love flats, but a lot of songs call for rounds, so I now use a mute on the rounds for some songs and then I remove it when I want a bright sustained sound, it seems to work.

[Dingus]

A significant reason why people started making the move to flats by the late 70s was that in most situations they were easier to hear . Modern high tech bass amps are able to offer high power , high volume and levels of clarity with roundwound strings that have give them a new burst of popularity in recent years . Back in the 70s most bass players had amps that were nowhere near as good as the ones we take for granted nowadays ( unless thety were lucky enough and rich enough to have an Ampeg SVT - most people wern't ) With the common amps of the time flatwound strings were much harder to get a good audible working tone in a band situation than roundwounds that gave much more cut . Even nowadays it can be much harder to be heard with flats in a lot of situations , in my experience .

Edited February 1, 2013 by Dingus