What did I say wrong?

[xgsjx]

You should count yourself lucky to get a response! Most of the ads that I replied to I got nothing back.

I suppose it didn't help that some of the ads they were looking for a guitarist & I replied with "I can teach your bassist how to play guitar & then you'll get me as an awesome bassist".

[TimR]

I assume he didn't see the bass bit and just saw the Cajon bit. How is your profile setup? What does it look like to other people?

[Dom in Dorset]

There is a school of thought amongst certain people that "professionalism" equates to being rude/pushy/up-tight/egotistical/self centred/self important and so bloody great they can get away with all the aforementioned unpleasantness.
Thankfully this band are only "semi-pro" , best avoided just in case (after a lifetime in the business) they turn pro.

[Commando Jack]

I think you may find that they're the type of band that will either a) never really get off the ground, b ) burn through members as their 'professionalism' gets a bit too much, or c) both.


FWIW I tend to say the minimum just in case the person typing the ad is an oddball who takes themselves or 'the business' too bloody seriously. I usually just register interest and ask for an audition.

Edit:pwned by smilies

Edited February 21, 2013 by Commando Jack

[solo4652]

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1361477656' post='1986440']
I assume he didn't see the bass bit and just saw the Cajon bit. How is your profile setup? What does it look like to other people?
[/quote]

Well the title of my reply to him was "Bass player here" and the opening phrase was "I play bass..."

Edited February 21, 2013 by solo4652

[Dom in Dorset]

Your reply should have been:
"I've been in the business all my life, i have good gear , good image, pro attitude and I'll happily bend over backwards to accommodate whatever demands are placed upon me by your band , I agree to do this without knowing anything about your band's repertoire, location, etc, yours sincerely, your bitch."

[Big_Stu]

[quote name='Dom in Somerset' timestamp='1361478522' post='1986465']
There is a school of thought amongst certain people that "professionalism" equates to being rude/pushy/up-tight/egotistical/self centred/self important and so bloody great they can get away with all the aforementioned unpleasantness.[/quote]

IME the reverse is true & it's those acting on their behalf who are the snotty ones; usually s**t-scared that someone will come along & remove them from their elite little perch, get past - or more likely, ignore them, - and the pros are generally OK, not always - but generally.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='Jack' timestamp='1361467982' post='1986203']
People saying they're pro is like gear that's advertised as pro. As in not.
[/quote] good way of putting it there.



One of my pet hates is people wanting to be "professional" - super serious folk, trying their hardest to get into "the industry" with their crappy little band and bad attitude - not realising that they are now to old to make it in the "industry" they are aiming at and refusing to beleive that the highly derivative durge they put out was never good enough in quality or songwriting skill even 10 years ago when it still sound contemporary. Who seem to think art is all about yourself rather than the viewer*.
I like the kinda professional that just gets their head down and works on what they want to do, cruise ships, theatres, teaching - making their living out of their musical skill. I like that kinda thing.
Or other folk you see in bands- where they all have jobs in other things, and they all treat the music in a professional manner - but know that it's all about having fun. And you go see them and that rubs off on you, cos it IS fun and you enjoy it and it hopefully wipes the memory of the pretentious w*****ers who played first that evening.


*or listener

[EssentialTension]

'Semi-pro' is very often a euphemism for 'can't make a living out of it'.

[Judo Chop]

http://www.joinmyband.co.uk/classifieds/voacalist-needs-band-massive-range-and-power-t470521.html

The bit about Frankie Valli made me laugh

[megallica]

[quote name='brensabre79' timestamp='1361469696' post='1986247']
Don't sweat it. It wasn't meant to be.
Think of it this way, you could have got an audition and maybe even as far as a few gigs, having learned the whole repertoire, to find out then that they are a bunch of curts. At least this way the band argument has already happened and you didn't waste any time
[/quote]

I agree with this - whoever replied to your email was a rude jerk and I personally wouldn't want to spend my time in his company.
You had a narrow escape I reckon.

[fumps]

In your next response you should have tell them you can moon walk & you own a frizbee. NOw for being grumpy pants you can not see or play with either.

Being serious though they are not being very approachable so sod em, move on life is is meant to be more fun than they realise

[steve-bbb]

[quote name='Dom in Somerset' timestamp='1361478522' post='1986465']
There is a school of thought amongst certain people that "professionalism" equates to being rude/pushy/up-tight/egotistical/self centred/self important and so bloody great they can get away with all the aforementioned unpleasantness.
[/quote]

so you've dealt with "dont call me dave's" manager then?

[swanbrook]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1361470151' post='1986260']
If they (and fwiw others commenting in this thread) were so 'pro' I doubt anyone would be bothered about people being in other bands, all the best pro and semi pro bands (for want of a better term) I know have at least one stand in for every member of that function band, the best wedding bands have some bookings into 2015 with almost every weekend taken for this year, even 'pros' need a weekend off now and again
[/quote]

Weddings is what we do ! I fall in the bookings for 2015 Category. I have to say I love the " we are going to start a wedding band " thing it makes it sound so simple.

I have played in every situation I can think of over the years and the hardest gig i have done is a wedding gig. It's easy to get a pub rockin but to play a room that has just sat down and stuffed themselves of food and had a long day is a different matter.then do it so well that you have every weekend booked for the year and keep it that way for the years to follow. I am not saying it isn't a lot of fun but its not as easy as they might think.

Anyway, why bother with these guys. Find a band that is looking for a bass player and is already on the way to getting some gigs. I always found that the worst part of setting up a band is the first 6 months as finding five people who get on can be tricky and this is normally when you chop and change a few members to get the right crew. With a reply like theirs I would count myself lucky and move on.

Btw if anyone know of a good sound guy looking for a gig in the west of ireland give me a shout.

[redroque]

Lucky escape!
Most, no all, of the pro players I know are described as such as they make their living by playing. This happens in bands (several) sessions and teaching etc.
I have also been shot down for applying to interesting bands while being honest about my existing commitments. As long as you apply a strict first in the book rule, what's the problem?
The kind of 'max commitment and own transport' lines tend to point to stroppy teens

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Earbrass' timestamp='1361465922' post='1986156']


Lucky escape by the sound of it. Been in "the business" all their lives, but still only semi-pro? Probably a bit crap then as well as being t*sspots.
[/quote]

Wow, that was quick. I know for some its the standard BC answer but i would have thought a few good posts would have been before this.
At least Gust0o got in first with a decent post.

[steve-bbb]

[quote name='redroque' timestamp='1361524689' post='1986862']
The kind of 'max commitment and own transport' lines tend to point to stroppy teens
[/quote]

.... of all ages

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='swanbrook' timestamp='1361522306' post='1986824']


Weddings is what we do ! I fall in the bookings for 2015 Category. I have to say I love the " we are going to start a wedding band " thing it makes it sound so simple.

I have played in every situation I can think of over the years and the hardest gig i have done is a wedding gig. It's easy to get a pub rockin but to play a room that has just sat down and stuffed themselves of food and had a long day is a different matter.then do it so well that you have every weekend booked for the year and keep it that way for the years to follow. I am not saying it isn't a lot of fun but its not as easy as they might think.
6
Anyway, why bother with these guys. Find a band that is looking for a bass player and is already on the way to getting some gigs. I always found that the worst part of setting up a band is the first 6 months as finding five people who get on can be tricky and this is normally when you chop and change a few members to get the right crew. With a reply like theirs I would count myself lucky and move on.

Btw if anyone know of a good sound guy looking for a gig in the west of ireland give me a shout.
[/quote]
We are just starting a wedding band at the moment but to be fair we have all done it before, it is hard and we have decided to start off all legit from the off so we won't be able to do them for feck all like we have in the past. I know what you mean about tough audiences too, I hate those random week night ones, who wants to party until late on a wednesday when they need to be up early for work especially when they are in a bad mood after having to waste a holiday day on a wedding they did not want to go to!

[swanbrook]

Lol yup that's the dig deep gig right there. I have always gone in with the same price for the mid week weddings but for that we do have to give the same level of performance too. Got to make their night special even on a Wednesday 😀
Best of luck with band dude
D

[stingrayPete1977]

Cheers mate

[TimR]

[quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1361482848' post='1986543']
Well the title of my reply to him was "Bass player here" and the opening phrase was "I play bass..."
[/quote]

Yes but what you write and what people 'see' is very different.

I've had similar exeriences in bands where we've looked for a singer:
Yes I sing, I've got a PA, I've got my own transport, I also play rhythm guitar.

Translates to - I'll come along as a singer but once I've got my foot in the door I'll try to muscle my guitar onto stage with me, regardless of how many guitars the band already has, how the arrangements go, what's been practiced etc.
We even had a singer turn up to a gig with all his gear, "Just in case."

If they're after a bass player then don't muddy the waters - You're a bass player.

[basstheface]

Their reply was curt, unprofessional and unnecesary and you're better off out of it. Perhaps next time don't be so upfront about your current situation, your uncertainty about your current band could come out later in discussions if you get through to the auditions. As a rule I prefer honesty and openness but sometimes it's best to keep 'your powder dry' until the appropriate moment. Good luck in your hunt for a new band.

[BassTractor]

As most here have expressed, that reply tells you everything you need to know about the person who wrote it. May still be a nice band though, who just need to get rid of one asshole.

But trying to answer your question, here's what you wrote, and my notes to it - not that [b][i]I[/i][/b] am that critical against your mail, mind you, and I'm very much aware that I'm from a different culture than yours, but I just to try and find what they may have reacted negatively to - by using my own critical eyes.

[b]"Disclaimer":[/b]
[b]This isn't meant in any other way than answering your question seriously. I hope it contributes to something and that it will not be regarded as a sneer.[/b]


[quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1361465156' post='1986131']
I play bass (and, occasionally, cajon) and I live [locally]. I'm currently playing with this band: (website link) but I'm very uncertain about its future.

Could you tell me a little more about your band, please?

Do you have a setlist you could send me?
Where and when do you rehearse?
What sort of venues and gigs are you aiming at?
[/quote]


"I play bass (and, occasionally, cajon)"
As devil's advocate, I'd say:
Look at how much space these two elements each take, and how the bass gets no attention, while the cajon is highlighted by brackets, commas and a long word. Mind you, I understand this was not on purpose, but it still works that way. My immediate reaction to that sentence, long before reading their answer, was exactly that: the bass did not get any attention beyond being mentioned.


"I'm currently playing with this band: (website link) but I'm very uncertain about its future."
As devil's advocate, I'd say:
This offers no details, no enthusiasm and may be seen as poorly worded. You "play with" instead of "being the bassist". May come across as unengaged and uncommitted. The same goes for that band's future. It shouldn't have been mentioned in your very first mail.


That was two short sentences about you. The rest of your message is four sentences about them, and asking them to provide you with more info about them before you are going to supply them with more about you.
As devil's advocate, I'd say:
That may have patted them against the growing direction of their fur.


IME, these things are dynamical in the interaction: their original ad was uninformative and badly written. You then didn't offer too much extra either, and the result is what we know.

I suppose this was just a lucky escape for you in this case, but in another case in the future: how about something slightly more like:


"
Hey guys,
I'm much interested in your prospect.
As a bassist with [kind] of background, and [such and so] of playing experience, I'm used to cooperate with the drummer so as to create a firm foundation for the rest of the band.
I'm not a typical soloist, but I do try to create interesting parts for the rest of the band to listen to whilst at the same time trying to be clear and easy to respond to.
Though having played hundreds of functions, incidentally I've never done weddings. I do know the typical songs though, and am willing to dress in style with the occasion.

If this sounds remotely interesting, how about some words about you, your set list, gear and plans?
To save time, you could just call me on 01-23456789.
Thanks, and c-ya?
"


Again, I hope this contributes to something and is not regarded as a sneer. It isn't meant in any other way than answering your question in a serious manner.

best,
bert

Edited February 23, 2013 by BassTractor

[solo4652]

[quote name='BassTractor' timestamp='1361648131' post='1988853']
As most here have expressed, that reply tells you everything you need to know about the person who wrote it. May still be a nice band though, who need to get rid of one asshole.

But trying to answer your question, here's what you wrote and my notes to it - not that [b][i]I[/i][/b] am that critical against your mail, mind you, and I'm very much aware that I'm from a different culture than yours, but I just to try and find what they may have reacted negatively towards by using my own critical eyes.

[b]"Disclaimer":[/b]
[b]This isn't meant in any other way than answering your question seriously. I hope it contributes to something and that it will not be regarded as a sneer.[/b]





"I play bass (and, occasionally, cajon)"
As devil's advocate, I'd say:
Look at how much space these two elements each take, and how the bass gets no attention, while the cajon is highlighted by brackets, commas and a long word. Mind you, I understand this was not on prupose, but it works that way. My immediate reaction to that sentence, long before reading their answer was exactly that: the bass did not get any attention beyond being mentioned.


"I'm currently playing with this band: (website link) but I'm very uncertain about its future."
As devil's advocate, I'd say:
This offers no details, no enthusiasm and may be seen as poorly worded. You "play with" instead of "being the bassist". May come across as unengaged and uncommitted.


That was two short sentences about you. The rest of your message is four sentences about them, and asking them to provide you with more infor about them before you are going to supply them with more about you.
As devil's advocate, I'd say:
That may have patted them against the growing direction of their fur.


IME, these things are dynamical in the interaction: their original ad was uninformative and badly written. You then didn't offer too much extra either, and the result is what we know.

I suppose this was just a lucky escape for you, but in another case on the future: how about something slightly more like:


"
Hey guys,
I'm much interested in your prospect.
As a bassist with [kind] of background, and [such and so] of playing experience, I'm used to cooperate with the drummer so as to create a firm foundation for the rest of the band.
I'm not a typical soloist, but I do try to create interesting parts for the rest of the band to listen to whilst at the same time trying to be clear and easy to respond to.
Though having played hundreds of functions, incidentally I've never done weddings. I do know the typical songs though, and am willing to dress in style with the occasion.

If this sounds remotely interesting, how about some words about you, your set list, gear and plans?
To save time, you could just call me on 01-23456789.
Thanks, and c-ya?
"


Again, I hope this contributes to something and is not regarded as a sneer. It isn't meant in any other way than answering your question in a serious manner.

best,
bert
[/quote]

Bert - thank you for your helpful and measured response.

Steve

Edited February 23, 2013 by solo4652

[Thunderthumbs]

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1361465991' post='1986160']
Sounds like your goldfish is looking a bit poorly so you went to the fayre to see if you could win another.
[/quote]
You are not a man, you are Cantona.