Kiwi Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 I've been trying to put together a disco function band but come up against a wall of opportunists when it came to finding a keyboard player. Found one decent Aussie bloke who had fantastic kit, was prepared to put in the rehearsal time and then he decided he wanted to go travelling... ...so I've decided that I might as well transpose all of the brass, sample and strings parts into MIDI and sequence them to run live. It gives me more control over the sound of the band and hopefully will keep the other musicians tighter also. At the moment I have a Yamaha CS6R sound module mainly for synth and arp sounds. I plan to get a couple of other modules to supply good rhodes/wurlitzer sounds and strings/brass patches. As far as Rhodes is concerned, there seems little out there to top the Nord Electro 2. Have to say that when I heard one being played for the first time, it made me go all weak kneed and gooey inside. Stunning piece of kit! As far as strings/brass patches go I was looking at the E-Mu Virtuoso 2000. Does anyone already have this module? Are there better modules out there? I'd like strings patches that can do whirling build ups ala Brothers Johnson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crez5150 Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='21360' date='Jun 21 2007, 01:28 PM']I've been trying to put together a disco function band but come up against a wall of opportunists when it came to finding a keyboard player. Found one decent Aussie bloke who had fantastic kit, was prepared to put in the rehearsal time and then he decided he wanted to go travelling... ...so I've decided that I might as well transpose all of the brass, sample and strings parts into MIDI and sequence them to run live. It gives me more control over the sound of the band and hopefully will keep the other musicians tighter also. At the moment I have a Yamaha CS6R sound module mainly for synth and arp sounds. I plan to get a couple of other modules to supply good rhodes/wurlitzer sounds and strings/brass patches. As far as Rhodes is concerned, there seems little out there to top the Nord Electro 2. Have to say that when I heard one being played for the first time, it made me go all weak kneed and gooey inside. Stunning piece of kit! As far as strings/brass patches go I was looking at the E-Mu Virtuoso 2000. Does anyone already have this module? Are there better modules out there? I'd like strings patches that can do whirling build ups ala Brothers Johnson.[/quote] Hi Mate Sounds kool..... I play in a couple of function bands... one of which is pure funk/70's dance/disco..... the keys player is very kool and has minimal kit to cover the variety of sounds needed....indeed has the Nord Electro as this is a must for that typical rhodes/electro sound..... and you right.... the sound is something else. the other keyboard he uses is a Korg Triton... the great thing about this keyboard is the ability to load samples in... we're playing a lot of stuff like Brand New Heavies/Jamiroquai/Wonder and he has a lot of extremely realistic brass parts sampled in.... you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference... any way good luck with the sequencing... Crez5150 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted June 21, 2007 Share Posted June 21, 2007 Thought about just using Ableton live with a laptop....??? alot easier .... and cheaper...! Worth thinking about. Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 [quote name='lowdown' post='21448' date='Jun 21 2007, 04:26 PM']Thought about just using Ableton live with a laptop....??? alot easier .... and cheaper...! Worth thinking about.[/quote] Tell me more please (like I need an excuse for another PC). Will the plugins will compare to the Nord/EMU for quality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Steve... The plugins with live6 are mainly efx...... you can purchase there sampler....no need though.. Live6 is what it say's on the box... Live. You can bounce/render midi within live6... But you can do all your Recording in PT.. Get it sounding how you want it [eq/pan/efx etc] then export into Live 6.. Then arrange into scene's track's what ever... the beauty is that you can control from a small midi controller [like Oxygen 8..or whatever] so no f..k..g around with a mouse/pad etc.. It can all be controlled on the fly/realtime.. Sends for a click to the drummer or other members. Just output from the Laptop into the PA...and away you go...! Portable as well.... Also if you Laptop is set up for just Audio , and has no other programme's on it.... Live 6 is very very stable.and not a CPU hog. You are not limited to set orders either...if you get to a gig and want to change the set list... it can be done in minutes...can even change as you go...when you know what you are doing....!! Just think keyboard's played as you want,,,strings..percussion...extra backing vox..even double you Bass with some Bass synth... I mentioned this, because the other night here in a club in Berlin..i saw it all in action with a band. just a trio with no keyboards....and it worked a treat.. I will be seeing these guys over the weekend.so i will find out the set up... I am back next week...so will report more.... But seems like a sound investment to me...[no humping modules and [Top Ten hit] around] You can even get midi files from the net[tons of free stuff]...this will make the first work load a lot easier...but once done you are laughing I have collected tons of these files over the years..some great ..some not so good.. But even the ones that are not so good,can be used as templates ,,then tweeked to taste... You are welcome to copy the midi disc's i have...but you will have to sift through them.....! Check out the Ableton live site.... Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 [quote name='lowdown' post='21724' date='Jun 22 2007, 08:42 AM']Steve... I mentioned this, because the other night here in a club in Berlin..i saw it all in action with a band. just a trio with no keyboards....and it worked a treat.. I will be seeing these guys over the weekend.so i will find out the set up... I am back next week...so will report more.... But seems like a sound investment to me...[no humping modules and [Top Ten hit] around] You can even get midi files from the net[tons of free stuff]...this will make the first work load a lot easier...but once done you are laughing I have collected tons of these files over the years..some great ..some not so good.. But even the ones that are not so good,can be used as templates ,,then tweeked to taste... You are welcome to copy the midi disc's i have...but you will have to sift through them.....! Check out the Ableton live site.... Garry[/quote] Garry, you're pretty much covering all the plans I had in terms of modding existing MIDI files and going live - no need to reinvent the wheel eh? As you say - loads of variability in quality though. Some of the MIDI files I've already collected sound like they've been made for a Game Boy, I'm sure there will be occasions where its just going to be quicker for me to start from scratch. I'll have to compare the cost of a laptop + plug ins + software against the cost of the rack gear too. I know very little about Live6, does it play samples or MIDI? Whatever I do get, I will want to record with as well. How do you create hammond/rhodes/wurlitzer patches? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 I have a Nord Electro. I upgraded the firmware and patches to the Nord Electro 2 for free from the Clavia site. If I were you, I would head down the laptop route - it's just far, far easier. The rhodes/wurli/clavi sounds on the free Reason Electro-mechanical Refill sound great. There are also various other soft synths that sound fantastic. You could find great soft synths for strings and brass. You just get more power, more control and more patches if you go laptop. It's also a bit cheaper. A Nord Electro and a Korg Triton are each quite expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MythSte Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 i have to agree with the use of abletone and a live trigger. however If you dont already have a laptop handy then it may start getting pretty pricey. The joy of it is you can use any trigger you like. We tried having our guitarist using a behringer midi footswitch for a while, but then switched to a Korg PadKontrol as we could give it to one of the already playing synths and do lots of rather cool modulation bits and bobs. It is a lot easier than using racks when you get used to it, you can import samples from anywhere! If our guitarist comes up with a funky little breakbeat on fruitloops or something he can stick it on a pendrive, set the tempo then play it over a section in the track! I think you can even sort out tap tempos and stuff on the fly. Hmm! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 [quote name='The Funk' post='21798' date='Jun 22 2007, 11:25 AM']The rhodes/wurli/clavi sounds on the free Reason Electro-mechanical Refill sound great. There are also various other soft synths that sound fantastic. You could find great soft synths for strings and brass. You just get more power, more control and more patches if you go laptop. It's also a bit cheaper. A Nord Electro and a Korg Triton are each quite expensive.[/quote] I've tried a Triton and TBH, I wasn't sold on it. It sounded a bit thin to me. Besides which I don't think I really need one at the moment. What would I be looking at in terms of ball-park costs for Ableton Live6 + best electromechanical/orchestral plug-ins do you think? I'll work out the cost of a laptop separately as I know its going to vary a lot depending on spec. PS: Its great to see such a breadth of experience on this topic!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_funking_in_the_80s Posted August 4, 2007 Share Posted August 4, 2007 I have played keys in a disco 70's band. Brass and strings are easy for modern synths, pianos too. But proper Hammonds and Rhodes take a bit more effort. There are a number of soft synths that do the one thing. The German company NI are good at this, they have really good Hammond soft syth. My keyboard was OKish at Rhodes and Hammond, the brass/string/clav/piano and other sounds were good. Also my keyboard was good for live playing were I can change sounds/key splits real easy. This was good for the 70s disco as I would often use brass and piano or something and flick between the two mid song. So all I took to the gig was the one keyboard which would easily cover all the sounds. But I would guess for your application a fast computer running a collection of soft synths would be good. It would depend on how realistic you need the Rhodes to be. It takes so much time and effort to audition synths, then find one at a good price etc. The computer is much easier. As for the keyboard player coming then going, well this seems to be the norm with musos that have not signed a binding contract. I have had enough of pamering to musos in an attempt to get them to do the job, but they usually drop by the wayside. My next outfit needs to have some form of contract written up but that will also have to include some regular income etc. Ohh it's all getting too complex already! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted August 4, 2007 Author Share Posted August 4, 2007 Well funnily enough I've found passable (although not as creamy) impersonations of hammonds, rhodes and wurlitzers on my Yamaha CS6R which will do for now. I do need to learn how to get the unit to play off different MIDI channels simultaneously however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr.funk Posted August 25, 2007 Share Posted August 25, 2007 You might look at the Roland XV series, they have SRX expansion slots for pianos and all sorts, I haven't heard them but the samples are supposed to be very high quality. I think the 5050 has 4 outputs so you can make better use of it's multi-timbrality (?!). If you were looking to keep the cost down I would use Ableton live (an older version of) to trigger the midi clips and then have a midi interface connected to your sound modules. That will mean the computer isn't processing any audio so should keep the cpu load down and mean you don't need an awesome machine.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted August 25, 2007 Share Posted August 25, 2007 On the other hand...... I know a very good keyboard player, currently living in the Medway, Kent area, if that is of interest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted August 25, 2007 Author Share Posted August 25, 2007 [quote name='chris_b' post='50589' date='Aug 25 2007, 04:05 PM']On the other hand...... I know a very good keyboard player, currently living in the Medway, Kent area, if that is of interest?[/quote] Thanks mate, since posting we managed to snag 'Jim'. But if your guy is comfortable with rehearsals in Willesden Green part of London, if would be worth having his details anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted August 26, 2007 Share Posted August 26, 2007 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='50677' date='Aug 25 2007, 07:52 PM']rehearsals in Willesden Green[/quote] Haha, I will never understand why there's such a concentration of rehearsal studios in that part of town. I would ask you which ones you use but all the names have changed (even though nothing else has). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted August 26, 2007 Author Share Posted August 26, 2007 we use a place called Resident - its tucked down the back of some residential streets but the place is quite reasonable in condition and rates. We block book and so get a discount on the rates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Funk Posted August 26, 2007 Share Posted August 26, 2007 I remember when it first opened as Stepping Stone studios. Best rehearsal studio I've ever seen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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