Beginner's Choice

[hughcanbefound]

[quote name='ashgeezer' post='207562' date='May 27 2008, 08:39 PM']I think the rest of the guys have covered all the basses but not many have mentioned an amp.
I started learning myself about a year ago (im 39 so an oldie to learning really) and i bought a carlsbro kickstart 30w, you can pick em up brand new off ebay for around 60 quid and their decent little amps, they have the 10 in speaker as appossed to 8 in (sometimes smaller) that usually come with practice amps, audio in socket so you can jam along to your fave tracks and a host of other features.
At the end of the day its up to you but the amp is worth looking into, im upgrading my amp soon but im keeping the 30w because its such a great little amp.[/quote]

Thank you ashgeezer, but at the moment I know that all I really need is a practice amp with headphone support. I go to boarding school and the whole boarding house will go crazy if I jack it up too loud!

-H

[Doc B]

The only things I'd add to the other replies is to suggest that you look at passive instruments only (ones that don't need a battery for the tone controls and/or pickups). IMO you'll find it simpler to get a good tone if you don't have too many controls to contend with. Cheaper active (ones that do need batteries) can sound a bit, well, cheap.

Simpler, Precision or Jazz style basses are what I'd advocate - they can be modified easily and are easy to sell on.

The Squier VM series are great, in fact I sold a rather tasty graphite necked Status bass and got a Squier VM Jazz. There's also a couple of Precision basses in the VM series. A Squier VM would be a very good buy as Squiers tend to lose value less quickly than other cheaper brands. The VM Series are about £220-230 new and well worth it. I am currently 'pimping' my Squier VM Jazz and will post pics when it is done.

[queenofthedepths]

I think it's also important to remember that for £100 you can get a bass which is very easy to play but may well not sound brilliant... anything on top of that goes towards making it a nice-sounding bass, pretty much (okaeey, so there are lots of other factors but this is the big one, coz aesthetic appearance is entirely subjective - pick something YOU like the look of)
Anyway, no matter how good the bass is, there's no point spending loads more on that than the amp you're playing it through, because a crap amp will make any bass sound crap... remember, the chain is only as strong as the weakest link, and when it comes to bass-playing, the chain is as follows: Your fingers, to the bass itself, through a cable (and maybe effects pedals), into your amp and out into the room you're playing in! Firstly, your own talent will improve quickly so don't worry about that! The bass itself should be the one you like, cables are cheap and easily replaceable, effects are completely customisable, the amp should be the best you can afford and the room you're playing in depends on whether you're practising in your bedroom, jamming in a rehearsal studio with a noisy band, or playing a gig of whatever size... it's important to have equipment appropriate to what you're going to do with it and if you're after the all-round best gear you can afford, it's wise to have stuff which is consistent in quality... of the many basses I've owned, just 2 of them (which I still have) have cost me more than your budget of £300, so IMO that's more than plenty for a beginner bass and in your situation I would spend more on an amp!
This post has degenerated into a bit of a mess as I've written it so if it makes little sense, just follow everyone else's advice

[The Burpster]

Sounds like you need a Roland Cube 30 practice amp. Has MP3 input and headphone out jack, loads of useful effcets. an use it for group practice as long as your drummer isnt Animal (from the Muppets). Can picked up 2ndhand for 60-90squid.

IMO Denmark Street could put you off, I dont like the place. I definately dont like the Bass Cellar. Have a look there by all means but make sure you visit the Gallery after you've been to D. St.

Having read your last comment the Ibanez is growing stronger by the minute. Yes you will take a hit in value once its no longer new, but if you dont use it as an ashtray or toilet (or both) if you dont keep up playing you will at least be able to sell it. The others in your list (possibly with the exception of the Yamaha) will be much harder to sell.

[Brave Sir Robin]

Second hand Yamaha / Ibanez, and an amp with decent wattage (second hand too), unless you just want to practise. Warwick Rockbasses are quite decent too. I've never been a fan of fender copies, just a personnal dislike so I wouldn't know about Squiers, but the Vintage series is suppose to be pretty good.

a couple of examples you may find shopping around :

Yamaha BB414
Yamaha RBX374
Ibanez SR400
Ibanez SR500
Ibanez RD
Ibanez BTB
Ibanez ATK
Warwick Rockbass
Peavey Millenium BXP

Seocnd hand, between £120 to £200 depending on condition and luck.

You can find very decent oldies too, especially in the ibanez range. I got my K5 for £220.

For amplification, Dont expect something fancy, but Peaveys, Fenders, Crates, Berhinger... Plenty to choose. You may even be lucky and find a decent Gallien Krueger Backline or Ampeg B-100.

Edited May 27, 2008 by Brave Sir Robin

[sam_]

i seriously recommend the ibanez (G)SR range, very good basses for the money, although they are active, but the batteries do last a long time as long as you remeber to unplug the bass from the input jack when it's not in use.

also, after trying some other brands AFTER buying my behringer amp i realise just how very very muddy and bad the sound produced from them is and wish i spent more on the amp first time around!

[ead]

One knowing Basschatter made an excellent suggestion to me when I was in a similar position - that was to seek out a used Spector. I got myself a Spector Legend 4 for less than your budget and have never had a single regret!

Alain

[BassBomber414]

Sam

With regard to the BB414 and BB614 , I'm a BB 414 owner.

If you are ever going to play in a band get the 614 - you need the extra knob which blends the two different sounds from the Precision and Jazz pick ups.

The 414 has a three way selector switch which won't give you the fine control you need to 'cut into' the band sound.

If that doesn't mean much to you now - it will later ,when you play with a drummer.

The below link is a good comparison article.

[url="http://www.bassplayer.com/article/yamaha-bb414-bb614/may-05/8554"]http://www.bassplayer.com/article/yamaha-b...614/may-05/8554[/url]

If you are interested in a 614 the Pewter BB614 on the forum for £150 looks a good option.

You don't have to buy an amp at this stage,a Zoom B2 effects unit (£49 GAK) gives you sound effects and a bank of drum patterns and a headphone output. It takes batteries or runs on the mains.Very portable and great sound via headphones.

If you buy an Amp - make sure you have an input for your your MP3 player for playing along and a headphone output.A very good sounding one with plenty of output is the Fender Rumble 15 - about £69 from GAK.

[Paul Cooke]

[quote name='hughcanbefound' post='207571' date='May 27 2008, 08:52 PM']Thank you ashgeezer, but at the moment I know that all I really need is a practice amp with headphone support. I go to boarding school and the whole boarding house will go crazy if I jack it up too loud!

-H[/quote]

Peavey Max 126
[url="http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/peavey-max-126---new-product!!!/66691"]http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/peavey...#33;!/66691[/url]

or

Peavey Max 158
[url="http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/peavey-max-158-combo/68346"]http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/peavey...158-combo/68346[/url]

both have headphone support and also auxiliary inputs so you can silently jam along to your MP3 or CD player...

well almost silently... the bass itself will make sounds... and they can be highly annoying for others in the same room...

if your budget can stretch just a little further, you could try the Marshall MB-30

[url="http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/marshall-b-25-mkii/328"]http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/marshall-b-25-mkii/328[/url]

also has CD input and headphone out... but has 30 watts into a 10 inch speaker and onboard compressor

[The Burpster]

[quote name='BassBomber414' post='207790' date='May 28 2008, 08:27 AM']The 414 has a three way selector switch which won't give you the fine control you need to 'cut into' the band sound.[/quote]

OR

Rather than get a 614 he can stick with the 414, and when he gets to that stage and knows the difference he can ditch the shonky Jap wiring and wire it Vol Vol Tone......

[johnnylager]

[quote name='spinynorman' post='207544' date='May 27 2008, 08:24 PM']...in a couple of years (!) you'll be wiping beer off it and falling off the stage with it like the rest of us.[/quote]

[hughcanbefound]

Woah OK. I don't really get what you're trying to say: preferentially a 414 or a 614? I don't know the difference in electronics or sound as yet but I do prefer the 614 only because the 414 doesn't come in natural.

The comparison's great, thanks.

And thanks for the amp advice Paul Cooke

-H

[The Burpster]

414 is Passive (does not have an on board pre amp) so the signal coming out of the pick ups is that which is sent to the amp.

614 is Active (has pre amp built in) so requires different wiring and a 9V battery inserting into it, this enhances the signal from the pick ups to the amp. It can be very useful, it an be a pain at times too.

The wiring in Yamahas can be somewhat odd.
Rather than stick with easy (read; sensible and usable) options they often plump for blend set ups that can be confusing, and really 'off the wall' I never really did find out what the knobs did on my RBX 170 until I re wired it.

Vol Vol Tone as I described above (often refered to as V/V/T) is each of the 2 pick ups (refered to as pups) having their own volume knob (pot or potentiometer) and one Tone knob that cuts out some high end signal making teh resultant signal more 'bassy'.
This is a common and sensible set up on basses with 2 pups and passive electrics.


The 3 band EQ that is on the 614 gives you positive boost to 3 parts of the signal, bass, mid, and treble (if you wish to use it), but can add a whole minefield of variables when you are setting out.

I see they dont make a 414 in natural, that is a bit of a b*gger isnt it....

[hughcanbefound]

[quote name='The Burpster' post='207864' date='May 28 2008, 10:27 AM']414 is Passive (does not have an on board pre amp) so the signal coming out of the pick ups is that which is sent to the amp.

614 is Active (has pre amp built in) so requires different wiring and a 9V battery inserting into it, this enhances the signal from the pick ups to the amp. It can be very useful, it an be a pain at times too.[/quote]

Are there any basses with both Passive *and* active wiring? I'm quite happy to replace a 9V battery every so often if it enhances the sound. Are there active pickups on guitars as well?

[allighatt0r]

I don't know about you H, but even I'm getting overwhelmed reading all of this advice.

Just a bit of hypothesising: I think what really develops a bass players likes and dislikes towards basses are his first bass, e.g. my first was a Peavey milestone, as i've already said, and i like solid colour basses with pickguards when i go into a shop.

Whereas, someone that started off with a shiny shiny odd shaped Spector... are more likely to like that sort of thing...

Basically, as i may have said before, we can't tell you what the perfect bass for you will be, and it's very very very unlikely that the bass you do end up getting will be your absolute perfect bass, a week or so down the line you'll probably be thinking "i wish this had more frets" or "why didn't i get a louder amp"

But, if you do buy the Ibanez, and don't like it, i'll.... "recycle" it for you


(By the way, my Cort GB74 is active and passive, you pull out the volume knob to make it passive, although i don't really like it any more. i wouldn't thoroughly recommend it. )

[hughcanbefound]

[quote name='allighatt0r' post='207872' date='May 28 2008, 10:34 AM']I don't know about you H, but even I'm getting overwhelmed reading all of this advice. [/quote]

I'm not overwhelmed, I love it! The more help I get from people who aren't the salesmen in bass shops the better, even if some of it is a little contradictory.

So for a beginner, in your opinion, one word: Passive or Active?

-H

[The Burpster]

[quote name='hughcanbefound' post='207868' date='May 28 2008, 10:31 AM']Are there any basses with both Passive *and* active wiring? I'm quite happy to replace a 9V battery every so often if it enhances the sound. Are there active pickups on guitars as well?[/quote]

Most basses with active electrics you can run passive too (so switching off the pre amp). Basses use them alot because bass signal can sometimes get lost in a band setting and needs a 'wee bit of help'....

A few makers have tried active electrics in 6 stringers but it never caught on, they prefer to use overdrive effects (pedals) or pre-amps with thier amplifiers.

[The Burpster]

[quote name='hughcanbefound' post='207879' date='May 28 2008, 10:41 AM']So for a beginner, in your opinion, one word: Passive or Active?[/quote]


Sounds to me your a pretty switched on young chap .....

Active is useful as it will (Eventually) give you more variables when you start playing with others.

Passive is easier to understand and MUCH easier to modify and tweak.....

Both produce different sounds.....

really its YOUR choice.....

I learnt with Passive, was happy with it. and now use both.

[hughcanbefound]

I think Passive it will probably be it then... But why oh why don't Yamaha do the 414 in natural? WHY?

[allighatt0r]

You could always get a luthier to take the paint off and wax it for you...

[bass_ferret]

dont get hung up on active/passive. Active basses are supposed to sound the same a passive with all the eq flat, there is usually a click on the knob for this, but I doubt if many actually are. But if you find the active confusing - dont use it and leave everything flat.

[hughcanbefound]

[quote name='bass_ferret' post='207930' date='May 28 2008, 11:38 AM']dont get hung up on active/passive. Active basses are supposed to sound the same a passive with all the eq flat, there is usually a click on the knob for this, but I doubt if many actually are. But if you find the active confusing - dont use it and leave everything flat.[/quote]

Ahh, now that's something that I didn't know... You can achieve the same results as passive with an active rig as long as you set all the knobs to a certain setting? Is that right? If that's the case then yeah I might as well go for active to open up my possibilities (and the gorgeous natural for the Yamaha...).

And at allighatt0r!

[bass_ferret]

[quote name='hughcanbefound' post='207956' date='May 28 2008, 12:16 PM']You can achieve the same results as passive with an active rig as long as you set all the knobs to a certain setting? Is that right?[/quote]
Thats what I said. Lots of active basses dont have a passive switch so setting the tone controls to the mid point is supposed to be flat. The Active/Passive switch is only there for when the battery goes flat mid set rather than offering an alternative sound, although some older basses had passive tone controls as well.

[BassBomber414]

It's clear that you fancy the Natural BB614 and if that was a bad choice lots of Basschatters would have told you so at the drop of a hat !

Fact is, it would be a very good choice, Yamaha instruments are generally great value and sound very good for their price.

You are never going to find out exactly what suits you until you play a while anyway ;the fact that you have a positive vibe for this particular guitar means you will want to pick it up and play it and that is a good thing.

One last word of advice - if you go down the 'internet sale' route it may be an advantage to buy all your gear in 'one go' as sellers often charge a standard fee for delivery , however many items there are.Those £10 fees add up.

The internet rate for a BB614 is £249 not £300.

[Fireflye]

I started playing bass around 18 years ago, having always been fascinated with the low-end of things. My first bass was a Marlin Sidewinder which had a neck like a banana and was very difficult to play, which was typical of most budget instruments of the time. After persevering for a couple of years I gave up in frustration.

Fast-forward to today and the quality of budget basses now is like night and day compared to back then. I picked up the bass again last year and with a budget of around £200 (probably not much more than what I paid for the Marlin in today's money), I set out to buy a bass.

I weighed up a VM Jazz against a BB414, both great basses but ended up walking off with the BB414 as it just had the edge in tone, playability and overall finish, though the VM certainly has the BB beat in looks alone. I've played a few basses since, namely MIM Jazzes and some others in the same price range as the Yamaha but I've yet to find one as good as the BB.

I've only a couple of gripes with it, the lack of a blend pot or individual volume pots for the pickups limits your options a little. Also if you like to anchor your thumb most will find the P pickup too high. This has in fact been a good thing for me as it has encouraged me to use floating thumb to the point that anchoring now feels unnatural to me.

You can't go wrong with a Yammy but as always, try before you buy and make sure you are comfortable with it.