Kev Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 I have just tried my Mesa Boogie bottle rocket in the effects loop of my 3leaf wonderlove and find the bottle rocket unusable; there is a massive volume drop when the pedal is engaged. The Mesa seems to work fine outside of the loop and other pedals work fine in the loop, any ideas? I thought it may be an issue with the valves in the pedal but as I say they work fine outside of the loop. Help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartelby Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 (edited) A phase issue? Ah, having looked at the 3Leaf pedal I could be entirely wrong... Edited March 26, 2013 by bartelby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 (edited) could be a phase thing? EDIT: Oh, beaten to it. It's an easy test anyway, if you have an old jack lead you can take apart. Edited March 26, 2013 by cheddatom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 26, 2013 Author Share Posted March 26, 2013 Pardon my ignorance, but what would I need to do resolve, if at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime_BASS Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 I think, but not sure, if you re wire the wires the other way round on the jacks, it will reverse the polarity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Swaping the wires around won't work. Only easy way to fix it is to put another pedal in the loop that also flips the phase - most simple single-transistor boost/buffer circuits do so, so if you happen to have one of those lying around, stick it before or after the Mesa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Any example pedals? You don't mean just a buffered bypass, I assume? As I have an oc-2 in the loop and problem remains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartelby Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 There's a list here: [url="http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=796444"]http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=796444[/url] no idea how accurate it is, but I've no reason to doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 (edited) Okay, i can see that the majority of those pedals will only work when engaged, which is not suitable for me as the Mesa will be a pretty much always on pedal without further effects. I need something that will do it's thing in bypass, is there no little box or something on the market that does the job?? Edited March 27, 2013 by Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 28, 2013 Author Share Posted March 28, 2013 After reading that thread, i notice that there seems to also be a general consensus that the problem is barely noticeable in a mono rig. Is phase really my issue? As the volume drop is significant and could never be described as barely noticeable! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 (edited) The problem is most definitely noticeable in a mono rig, moreso than stereo! If left and right channels are out of phase with each other and coming out of separate speakers at least it will sound ok in some parts of the room, but if you only have one channel, and you mix two out of phase signals together they cancel each other out before they even get to the speaker. I think the EHX LPB-1 should do the trick and is pretty cheap. A guitarist friend of mine suffered the same issue running this pedal through the FX loop of his amp which was blended in parallel, so it must be a phase flipper. Edited March 28, 2013 by dannybuoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 28, 2013 Author Share Posted March 28, 2013 Will the LPB-1 flip the phase in bypass mode? I cannot imagine it will as it will be true bypass. I dont really want to use anything that will effect the tone, simply a completely transparent pedal/device that will allow me to use the Mesa as an always on pedal within the Wonderlove loop. I can see the barge concepts VB JR, Mosquite Blender and Gigrig Humdinger do it but by no means am i prepared to spend that kind of money!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Easy way to tell if it's a phase issue. Turn the blend down so none of the clean signal is present. If that's louder than 50/50 blend then phase is the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 good call Bigwan Why wouldn't flipping the wires around on one end of a jack lead work to flip the phase? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 It's signal and ground you're swapping in that case. I'm surprised spencer hasn't taken "inverting" pedals into account with his most recent design and added a phase switch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 It's signal and ground you're swapping in that case. I'm surprised spencer hasn't taken "inverting" pedals into account with his most recent design and added a phase switch. Ironically the crap blend implementation of the original meatball would have worked better for inverting pedals! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I'm not really aware of the theory, it's just I've been told in the past that changing the wires round on one end of a jack cable would flip the phase... and I honestly thought I'd had it off a lecturer at uni. Oh well, it's not the first time I've found out something I learned at uni was bollocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I think that's a balanced signal you're talking about, like an xlr/di where there are 2 signals, 180 degrees out of phase with each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 28, 2013 Author Share Posted March 28, 2013 Sadly the pedal doesn't have a blend, anything else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 The wonderlove I mean, not the Mesa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 29, 2013 Author Share Posted March 29, 2013 [quote name='Bigwan' timestamp='1364454676' post='2026633'] Easy way to tell if it's a phase issue. Turn the blend down so none of the clean signal is present. If that's louder than 50/50 blend then phase is the issue. [/quote] So turn the blend knob on the wonderlove so it is fully wet, and compare to when it's 50:50? If that's the case, the volume at 50:50 is much louder so it's not a phase issue? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 29, 2013 Share Posted March 29, 2013 So just to clarify, with the Mesa engaged, and wonderlove blend at 50/50, the volume is louder than with the blend all the way to wet (Mesa still engaged). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 29, 2013 Author Share Posted March 29, 2013 With the Mesa on, wonderlove on, blend knob full clockwise is quieter than the blend knob at noon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 29, 2013 Share Posted March 29, 2013 Weird... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted March 29, 2013 Author Share Posted March 29, 2013 Anyone any ideas then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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