Another bass octave thread (and the winner is...)

[mcnach]

You can never have enough threads about octavers for bass, can you?

I have recently started a new funk band with a few members from my main band and others, and I am now "allowed" to let loose with FX

So the octave pedal came out.

In the past I tried various multiFX, Zoom, Boss, they all worked but none excited me enough. When I went for single pedals I tried (owned for a while, sometimes simultaneously) the Boss OC-3, Boss OC-2, Danelectro Chili Dog and MXR bass octave deluxe. Oh, and I had a Digitech SynthWah whose octave mode was pretty cool. It's actually a very nice pedal. But it requires more juice than the others and at the time it was an issue so I let it go. If I was allowed only one pedal, I would probably choose the SynthWah for versatility.

Anyway, pure octave pedals...
The Chili Dog was the least good of the bunch. It sounded great, and on guitar I loved it, but the tracking was poor for bass unless you really played high.
The Boss OC-3 did not do much for me when I compared it to the Boss OC-2, which was nice and fat and dirty.
The OC-2 sounded nice, but tracking could be an issue at times and it's prone to glitches meaning that short notes are best.
The MXR tracked better and was VERY good... but too "clean".

So I kept the OC-2 and sold all the others.

And did not use it all that much.
Until now.

I *love* the OC-2. With a bit of overdrive after it... it can be amazing.
But the tracking/glitches annoy me a bit.
I decided to check two other pedals: the Aguilar Octamizer and the T-Rex Octavius. Different animals... so there's the risk I will keep them all

I just got the Octamizer, yesterday, and I have been playing with it a bit now.
My initial impressions were quite good. It can be very clean, but it can do dirty octave too. Not as much as an OC-2, but it's still very good. Tracking is NOTICEABLY better. Much much better. Yes, it's still better to stick to higher notes, but I can go lower and 1) it tracks more confidently than the OC-2 and 2) it sounds good, unlike the OC-2 that can sound like a mess on the lower notes. Although I don't really go there with the octave on, normally, it's nice that I can ocassionally stray and it won't be too messy.
The Octamizer works with overdrive pedals in a different way than the OC-2. Because it's cleaner, you hear "distorted bass plus octave" more clearly than using the OC-2, which is less recognisable as a bass. Not better, not worse. Just different.

I like the Octamizer. Because it tracks better than the OC-2 and it can be made to sound a little dirty, I'm leaning towards letting it replace the OC-2. But I will have to try it with the band. Often things sound very differently once I play at higher volume and with guitar, voices etc... but it sounds very promising.

I have ordered a T-Rex Octavius as well, which has been on my mind for ages but never tried because of the 12V requirement and, frankly, the cost. But I had a "what the hell" moment and ordered one the other day. I should receive it on Monday. Will it really follow me like a dog?
[size=3][b][i]edit: the T-Rex Octavius arrived on page 2[/i][/b][/size]

[media]http://youtu.be/OAZimHX75Xk[/media]

Edited April 8, 2013 by mcnach

[xgsjx]

You make me envious!

I'd love to A/B the OC2 & OC3. I bought an OC3 off Shep about a year & a bit ago (he was replacing it with another OC2).
I've heard that a few folk think the OC3 is a bit thin, but used through a couple of filters, dirt & chorus, I'd call it anything but thin.

For your funk band, I'd definitely suggest getting a filter to go after the octave & dirt.

[tedmanzie]

funnily enough i thought the MXR tracked miles better than the Aguilar, I could hardly shake it off!...

[mcnach]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1365265745' post='2037431']
You make me envious!

I'd love to A/B the OC2 & OC3. I bought an OC3 off Shep about a year & a bit ago (he was replacing it with another OC2).
I've heard that a few folk think the OC3 is a bit thin, but used through a couple of filters, dirt & chorus, I'd call it anything but thin.

For your funk band, I'd definitely suggest getting a filter to go after the octave & dirt.
[/quote]


The OC-3 was not bad at all, it's just that I preferred the OC-2. I would not call the OC-3 thin either, but it was a different sound, and it was good, for sure!

The filter section is covered already with a Soundblox BEF Pro. I love this thing
I also have a Bassballs modified to have the internal trimpots accessible with standard outside knobs, and it can produce some cool sounds, but I'm not sure I need to clutter the pedalboard with it. Then there is the EHX microsynth. I really like it, but it seems a bit too bulky for a sound I will use only rarely, so I might not keep it long.

Yup, an octave, an overdrive and and envelope filter (with presets!) and that's me sorted I think

[mcnach]

[quote name='tedmanzie' timestamp='1365268707' post='2037485']
funnily enough i thought the MXR tracked miles better than the Aguilar, I could hardly shake it off!...
[/quote]

I didn't get to compare the MXR and the Aguilar side by side. When I tried the MXR against the OC-2 I chose the OC-2 based on the sound, but the MXR tracked a lot better, no doubt. However, I found it a bit lacking in the personality department, for my taste. A bit too clean. The MXR is a very good octave pedal, but it does not produce the kind of sound I was after.

The Aguilar also tracks a lot better than the OC-2, but I can't compare it against the MXR. It's possible the MXR is a bit better there than the Aguilar, I do recall the MXR tracking very nicely. The Aguilar, however, is more "dirty" (or rather, it can be more dirty, for you can use the filter to change the tonality a lot, from very clean to dirty, and from very deep and bassy to very trebly), and I can get the kind of sound I want from it, while I could not get it from the MXR, unfortunately.

[xgsjx]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1365272359' post='2037555']
The OC-3 was not bad at all, it's just that I preferred the OC-2. I would not call the OC-3 thin either, but it was a different sound, and it was good, for sure!

The filter section is covered already with a Soundblox BEF Pro. I love this thing
I also have a Bassballs modified to have the internal trimpots accessible with standard outside knobs, and it can produce some cool sounds, but I'm not sure I need to clutter the pedalboard with it. Then there is the EHX microsynth. I really like it, but it seems a bit too bulky for a sound I will use only rarely, so I might not keep it long.

Yup, an octave, an overdrive and and envelope filter (with presets!) and that's me sorted I think
[/quote]

I'd like an HH3 to plug into my filter. Maybe one day.

[Kev]

The OC-2 really is great, nothing has matched its synthyness for me, even if it does track a bit [i]too [/i]badly. Best octaver i have ever had is the Mutron Octave Divider, but good luck finding one for less than £450 odd these days!

[bobbass4k]

The sound of the OC-2 is second to none, but it's something of an anomaly, it's popularity and status is kind of self propogating. Think about it, if Boss released a brand new Octave pedal that didn't track very well, couldn't handle chords, glitched out on long notes, and one of it's only 3 controls was almost completely unusable, people would slate it.

[Prime_BASS]

Personnaly octave pedals, they are all one trick ponies, and non really work as well as they should.
I much prefer octave up sounds, since you never get tracking issues and its much easier to fatten up what you already.

Although the octamizer is my personal favourite for octave Downs, and is also a better alternative to the meatbox too.

[mcnach]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1365273187' post='2037573']
I'd like an HH3 to plug into my filter. Maybe one day.
[/quote]

yeah, that sounds like it can be a lot of fun! Maybe if the funk band starts to make a bit of money I can justify it... but, we need songs first. So far we've only written four (as in 90% done, just details about the vocals left to do) and a couple more half way... lots of work to do still

[mcnach]

[quote name='Kev' timestamp='1365273527' post='2037579']
The OC-2 really is great, nothing has matched its synthyness for me, even if it does track a bit [i]too [/i]badly. Best octaver i have ever had is the Mutron Octave Divider, but good luck finding one for less than £450 odd these days!
[/quote]

I have never seen one in person and I hope I don't, in case I really like it. £450? Ouch! You'd better use it for every song all the time so that you get your money's worth then!

There was a Guyatone something or another that the bass player in a band I saw once was using. I can't recall what it was... it had some envelope filter like effect but it may have had an octave too... regardless, it was an amazing sounding pedal, really fat and juicy... but not light juicy... STICKY juicy! ( we come up with really weird stuff to describe sounds, don't we?). He used it for sure when doing Stevie Wonder's "Superstition". But when I was talking to him about it, I remember he mentioned the cost and I blocked it out of my mind, as it was also very expensive.

edit: I think it was the Guyatone Ultron. No octaver there but very tasty nevertheless.

Edited April 6, 2013 by mcnach

[mcnach]

[quote name='bobbass4k' timestamp='1365274958' post='2037606']
The sound of the OC-2 is second to none, but it's something of an anomaly, it's popularity and status is kind of self propogating. Think about it, if Boss released a brand new Octave pedal that didn't track very well, couldn't handle chords, glitched out on long notes, and one of it's only 3 controls was almost completely unusable, people would slate it.
[/quote]

ha ha, true!!!
I guess when it came out there was nothing else that could compare, for its price (relatively economical)... so that led to its popularity.

[mcnach]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1365275218' post='2037608']
Personnaly octave pedals, they are all one trick ponies, and non really work as well as they should.
I much prefer octave up sounds, since you never get tracking issues and its much easier to fatten up what you already.

Although the octamizer is my personal favourite for octave Downs, and is also a better alternative to the meatbox too.
[/quote]

But the glitches appear due to poor recognition of the low frequency notes, so if you let a pedal do the octave up, it is likely to be just as glitchy, only more noticeable as the bassier tones can be easier to disguise. Also the octave up sounds I have heard are a bit too "metallic" sounding and artificial, to me. The EHX POG has an octave up and if blended carefully it can sound pretty cool, I have to admit.
I'm expecting the T-Rex Octavius early next week and that one also does octave up. The demo video above makes the octave up sound not very nice... but if blended a bit lower in the mix it can be interesting I suppose.
What pedal do you use for the octave up?

Octamizer as a Meatbox substitute... I believe that! I was experimenting with it and it can make some truly deep noises!

[sprag]

[quote name='bobbass4k' timestamp='1365274958' post='2037606']
The sound of the OC-2 is second to none, but it's something of an anomaly, it's popularity and status is kind of self propogating. Think about it, if Boss released a brand new Octave pedal that didn't track very well, couldn't handle chords, glitched out on long notes, and one of it's only 3 controls was almost completely unusable, people would slate it.
[/quote]

All true, but the your opening line trumps all. I love my oc 2, sure I can't play it down low and yeah its staccato or not at all but the sound the sound.

Edited April 7, 2013 by sprag

[Sibob]

I really wish I could line up everyone's rig and hear the OC-2 'sounding like a mess down low' . I really don't have that issue at all, feed it a bass heavy, round signal, and it tracks perfectly well down to an A, in my experience, lower if your attack is considered (don't choke the note).
The glitching is from buzzy notes not tracking etc

Si

[EskimoBassist]

I did like my Octamizer, but for some reason I didn't convince me to lose the OC-3. Dunno why!

[bobbass4k]

[quote name='Sibob' timestamp='1365342892' post='2038230']
I really wish I could line up everyone's rig and hear the OC-2 'sounding like a mess down low' . I really don't have that issue at all, feed it a bass heavy, round signal, and it tracks perfectly well down to an A, in my experience, lower if your attack is considered (don't choke the note).
The glitching is from buzzy notes not tracking etc

Si
[/quote]

Aye, with the neck pup solo'd I can get it to track a G, occasionally an F#, but I've found it is more prone to glitching the lower you go, no matter how clean the note is. I play in D standard so my low G is open and it still glitches out after a couple of seconds.

[mep]

I have only used an OC2 & the Ashdown octaver. IME a lot depends on the bass. Passive basses seem to track better. When using my Ray I will play further up the neck to help out. Any other passive vs active comments?

[Kev]

I have found that passive basses work best with alot of effects, including octavers, and playing with the neck pickup yields best results.

However, i have my thumb slightly blended towards the bridge and is very much active and i love the OC-2

[mcnach]

[quote name='Kev' timestamp='1365362399' post='2038609']
However, i have my thumb slightly blended towards the bridge
[/quote]

I looked at this sentence for a couple of minutes going until I noticed the Warwick on your signature "ah! The Warwick Thumb, not his thumb!!!" It makes a lot of sense now... I think I need a coffee!

[mcnach]

[size=5][b]The T-Rex Octavius arrived!!![/b][/size]

... and it's going back.

I have made up my mind in less than 15min.
Does it follow you like a dog? I don't know... it didn't move, it remain firmly planted where I placed it, which is what I want from any pedal, so that's good. The tracking is AMAZING. No glitches, perfect tracking down to low E. Awesome. It's such a shame it has such an uninspiring and metallic kind of sound. It's a pretty clean kind of octave, but on bass it sounds too artificial. And not good artificial like an OC-2 kind of synthy atificial, this is bad metal box kind of artificial. Maybe on guitar it's better, I am sure that with a bit of distortion and using a bit of octave up you can get some thick tones out of this... but on bass, not for me. I was expecting the octave up to sound metallic, they nearly always do and the youtube videos showed that. But the low octave also has a very annoying metallic clang to it.

In addition, this particular example was clearly handled before I got it. It might be a return. That's not necessarily a problem. Yeah, it's nice to have a neat package rather than one with a scrunched up plastic bag for the pedal and a not very neatly packed power supply... but that's not something that would annoy me. However, the pedal was dirty. Not talking of fingerprints only, there is a blob of something on the top of the pedal... I don't know if it's kebab sauce or what but that's not how to send a "new" pedal to someone.
(Thanks, GAK, for disappointing me again)

If I liked the pedal, I might have just asked for a return just because GAK have annoyed me in the past... but the truth is that this is not a nice octave pedal on bass, despite it's astoundingly good tracking.

Now we need an OC-2 clone that tracks like the Octavius!

So, it looks like I am keeping the Octamizer for sure. I really like it. I'm not sure yet whether I will sell the OC-2 'though... it sounds great... but more and more I'm finding that the Octamizer is a good compromise, and more tonally versatile.

Edited April 8, 2013 by mcnach

[paul_5]

If it's an analogue unit then octave up will always have an element of distortion to it, it's impossible (as far as I know) to separate the two. Shame it's bad at low octave too, as the tracking on the video you posted is brilliant. "Romantic"?

[mcnach]

[quote name='paul_5' timestamp='1365424364' post='2039300']
If it's an analogue unit then octave up will always have an element of distortion to it, it's impossible (as far as I know) to separate the two. Shame it's bad at low octave too, as the tracking on the video you posted is brilliant. "Romantic"?
[/quote]

The tracking is exceptionally good. Not sure I'd call it romantic , but it's really really really good. Pity the sound is so "meh". Unless you want a very subtle octave... if you want a very subtle octave down, then the metallic character can be disguised. Not for me 'though.

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='mcnach' timestamp='1365281164' post='2037708']


But the glitches appear due to poor recognition of the low frequency notes, so if you let a pedal do the octave up, it is likely to be just as glitchy, only more noticeable as the bassier tones can be easier to disguise. Also the octave up sounds I have heard are a bit too "metallic" sounding and artificial, to me. The EHX POG has an octave up and if blended carefully it can sound pretty cool, I have to admit.
I'm expecting the T-Rex Octavius early next week and that one also does octave up. The demo video above makes the octave up sound not very nice... but if blended a bit lower in the mix it can be interesting I suppose.
What pedal do you use for the octave up?

Octamizer as a Meatbox substitute... I believe ithat! I was experimenting with it and it can make some truly deep noises!
[/quote]

I've been playing with a digitech whammy and a few other that only do +1 octave.
I've never really had any issues with tracking. Until I start trying to play something as fast as say the beginning of bombtrack for example.
How I would use it anyway tracking down low and sound is irrelevant as it spud be getting driven and eq'd to buggary.

[mcgraham]

[quote name='Sibob' timestamp='1365342892' post='2038230']
I really wish I could line up everyone's rig and hear the OC-2 'sounding like a mess down low' . I really don't have that issue at all, feed it a bass heavy, round signal, and it tracks perfectly well down to an A, in my experience, lower if your attack is considered (don't choke the note).
The glitching is from buzzy notes not tracking etc

Si
[/quote]

I agree. If you're using it as dry + octave 1 to taste/for girth, even short staccato notes can be done down to about F# or so. If you're using it as just an octave 1 then I agree, down to an A.

I also find octave 2 useable. It starts to jump out when moving to the higher strings and swells in as you go higher. Keeps an even distribution of lower harmonics to keep a full sound. I like it anyway!