Crappy bass tone

[Wil]

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1365678717' post='2042687']
I might try them mate, can you elicidate on the tonal qualities of the Optimas?
[/quote]

They don't sound quite like any steel strings I've tried. I've been using them for years now so hard to directly compare, all I can say is they sound so good I've never been tempted away from them. I was hopping between brands all the time before.

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='Wil' timestamp='1365679226' post='2042700']
They don't sound quite like any steel strings I've tried. I've been using them for years now so hard to directly compare, all I can say is they sound so good I've never been tempted away from them. I was hopping between brands all the time before.
[/quote]

My bass teacher told me about gold strings he used before. He said they sounded excellent, but because of the price, he would rather get ProSteels, because they were the closest sounding at half the price. That's what I was told anyway.

[Coilte]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1365679223' post='2042699']
Nobody has dissed anything dude
[/quote]

Well... it appeared like that to me.


[quote name='megallica' timestamp='1365668465' post='2042477']
.

Any other nominations for what you might deem a crap bass sound?

[/quote]

[Wil]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1365679386' post='2042704']
My bass teacher told me about gold strings he used before. He said they sounded excellent, but because of the price, he would rather get ProSteels, because they were the closest sounding at half the price. That's what I was told anyway.
[/quote]

Yeah, they're not cheap. So much so that I bought a Gretche Corvette a month ago, broke a string 2 weeks ago and havent restrung it yet...

[xilddx]

[quote name='Coilte' timestamp='1365679136' post='2042697']
OK, I accept your point. What I am getting at is, people dissing ( not yourself, I am talking generally) other people's tone, just for the sake of it.
[/quote]
It's not for the sake of it, they are expressing opinions and it's interesting to see trends emerge, such as massive Geddy fans disliking his bass sounds. It's interesting.

Edited April 11, 2013 by xilddx

[xilddx]

[quote name='Wil' timestamp='1365679226' post='2042700']
They don't sound quite like any steel strings I've tried. I've been using them for years now so hard to directly compare, all I can say is they sound so good I've never been tempted away from them. I was hopping between brands all the time before.
[/quote]

I'll give them a try mate, I've just read some reviews and they sound good. Thank you!

I have to say that I am very very fussy about bass strings (tone, reliability, quality, consistency, compliance, etc) but not so for guitar - only durability and reliability. I'll order some OGs mate and see.

[Coilte]

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1365679791' post='2042716']
It's not for the sake of it, they are expressing opinions and it's interesting to see trends emerge, such as massive Geddy fans disliking his bass sounds. It's interesting.
[/quote]

Fair enough. I wont hijack the thread any further.

[spacey]

I like to hear the tone of a bass guitar on recordings, any tone, I have heard no end of warm compressed organ pedal type bass sounds on recent recordings, giving little reason to use a bass guitar at all, why not just use the keyboard ?
The bass guitar is an instrument of wide tone, it can clank, buzz, clink, scoop or smooth.
The art of recording the bass is a long forgotton art.
Lazy studios use DI and software emulaters and leave the bass sounding like a set of organ pedals.

High End Studios once upon a time would have a Bass booth where Tin sheets were on the walls and a Mic in the booth, this would be mixed with a DI signal for low end harmonics, the results were those famous bass tones of yesteryear that set players apart.
Tones were as important as technic is setting carears, each player had a unique way of getting the tone to recording.

Those skills are lost, one bass player sounds just like the last and the one before that, warm muddy dull compressed strangeled tones of what are rich and diverse instruments.

To hear a new recording where you can jump and and say that is a bass guitar, it is a breath of fresh air in todays lazy recording sounds.

My ten pence !

[Dave Vader]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1365677752' post='2042663']
He said guitarists just buy the standard strings, and don't even think about the difference a different set of strings would make to their tone. That's the moment he knew I was a bassist, when I bought prosteels for a guitar
[/quote]

To be fair though, bass strings make a huge amount of difference to your tone, whereas in 25 years of playing guitar, I have only heard ever so tiny differences between different guitar strings, and like Nige, go for long lasting and cheap (rotosound rotos, 10-52 if you're wondering, come with a free spare top E as well, and are long enough to be tied back together at least once if they break at the bridge.)

I occasionally buy different and interesting strings, only to be disappointed. Particularly with acoustic strings, they all lose tone after a few hours of my big sweaty paws all over them, and the cheap ones sound just as nice for those few hours.
Lots and cheap is the name of the game for guitars, change them as often as you can afford.

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1365678038' post='2042674']
I have also read from an expert on Gibsons that many players go for higher gauges on their Gibbos to get better tone, but if you have a great guitar in the first place it will sound great with even 8-40s, only poor guitars need heavier gauges.
[/quote]

Maybe, but it won't feel the same, which is important, I like the heavier gauges cos they feel excitingly fun. However, Tony Iommi uses super light strings, and still has the tone we all want.
I can't get the sounds I like from light strings, probably cos it feels like playing a toy.
Anyway, this isn't guitar chat....

Chap I saw at a gig the other night who had his bass so drowned in envelope filters that you couldn't make it out among the other muck in his band. Awful, though probably not his fault, as was a multi band night, with nought but a line check before they played.
With a regular engineer, he could have been awesome.

[xilddx]

[quote name='spacey' timestamp='1365680913' post='2042736']
I like to hear the tone of a bass guitar on recordings, any tone, I have heard no end of warm compressed organ pedal type bass sounds on recent recordings, giving little reason to use a bass guitar at all, why not just use the keyboard ?
The bass guitar is an instrument of wide tone, it can clank, buzz, clink, scoop or smooth.
The art of recording the bass is a long forgotton art.
Lazy studios use DI and software emulaters and leave the bass sounding like a set of organ pedals.

High End Studios once upon a time would have a Bass booth where Tin sheets were on the walls and a Mic in the booth, this would be mixed with a DI signal for low end harmonics, the results were those famous bass tones of yesteryear that set players apart.
Tones were as important as technic is setting carears, each player had a unique way of getting the tone to recording.

Those skills are lost, one bass player sounds just like the last and the one before that, warm muddy dull compressed strangeled tones of what are rich and diverse instruments.

To hear a new recording where you can jump and and say that is a bass guitar, it is a breath of fresh air in todays lazy recording sounds.

My ten pence !
[/quote]

Blimey mate. No offence meant, but it's posts like this that makes me realise I have a very open mind. The goal is to make music, not a technical exposé on how to record instruments in musical format. I also think that your olde worlde recording methods are limited to an old geezer with an old bass and an old amp, one tone, one approach, one option, James Jamerson for example. Popular music is so much more complex now. I could be using five different tones with different effects and envelopes in one song.

You would hate the way I get my sounds and how I record. But I would like to think the music speaks for itself. I wonder what you think of this as a bass tone? I'm intereted to know [url="http://kitrichardson.bandcamp.com/track/you-always-did"]http://kitrichardson.bandcamp.com/track/you-always-did[/url]

[RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE]

I remember a few years back , buying a few sets of cheap trace Elliot headless strings at a music fayre.for some reason, the e string wouldn't fit properly on my washburn status.
The other thing was, although they sounded bright and vibrant, after about 3 hours they sounded dull.
There's me thinking I had a bargain.(

When I was properly learning the bass, it was in the mid-late '80s. The washburn status has a very clinical sounding graphite neck.
A few members of bands I was in , weren't that keen on the sound(but loved the looks;)
However, by accident the active circuitry was removed and I got a lot more compliments in the sound.

Edited April 11, 2013 by RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='Dave Vader' timestamp='1365681190' post='2042744']
To be fair though, bass strings make a huge amount of difference to your tone, whereas in 25 years of playing guitar, I have only heard ever so tiny differences between different guitar strings, and like Nige, go for long lasting and cheap (rotosound rotos, 10-52 if you're wondering, come with a free spare top E as well, and are long enough to be tied back together at least once if they break at the bridge.)

I occasionally buy different and interesting strings, only to be disappointed. Particularly with acoustic strings, they all lose tone after a few hours of my big sweaty paws all over them, and the cheap ones sound just as nice for those few hours.
Lots and cheap is the name of the game for guitars, change them as often as you can afford.
[/quote]

I very much disagree. Strings make a big difference, at least as much as an amp does, and more than the pickups do. I've used rotosound rotos on my basses before, and I wasn't pleased. They are OK to begin with, but they die a death after about a month. I don't gig, and I only play a few hours a week, so why is a set of strings going dead in a month? The only thing which led me to buying more was the price, and the fact that I couldn't afford more expensive ones, which is obviously a false economy. I never use them anymore, and I've heard a couple other people having bad experiences with them too. Maybe their more expensive strings are better, but even a £14 set of strings should last more than a month, am I not right?

I won't buy cheap strings. I just won't. It's a false economy, i've done it, I wasn't pleased, and I won't be doing it again.

[shizznit]

This is another classic 'subjective' BC thread! No-one is right or wrong here.

I personally like a full and thumpy Hofner Violin bass tone, a bright and scooped Ken Smith tone and everything else in between. I listen to music ranging from folk to dub step. Its all good. Every type of bass tone serves a purpose. You don't have to like it...you don't even have to listen to it, but goodness sake don't get upset about it!

[xilddx]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1365683001' post='2042793']
I very much disagree. Strings make a big difference, at least as much as an amp does, and more than the pickups do. I've used rotosound rotos on my basses before, and I wasn't pleased. They are OK to begin with, but they die a death after about a month. I don't gig, and I only play a few hours a week, so why is a set of strings going dead in a month? The only thing which led me to buying more was the price, and the fact that I couldn't afford more expensive ones, which is obviously a false economy. I never use them anymore, and I've heard a couple other people having bad experiences with them too. Maybe their more expensive strings are better, but even a £14 set of strings should last more than a month, am I not right?

I won't buy cheap strings. I just won't. It's a false economy, i've done it, I wasn't pleased, and I won't be doing it again.
[/quote]

You need to read Dave's post again mate

[cheddatom]

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1365671626' post='2042539']
Fieldy from Korn... Not my type of music but bleugh anyway.
[/quote]

This, a million times over. I would have liked Korn, they have some great riffs, but FFS I can't listen to that band. What a complete idiot.

[RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE]

Btw; am I the only one here that think mc cartneys bass tone stands out more on 'the ballad of John &yoko' than anything else?

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1365683128' post='2042798']
You need to read Dave's post again mate
[/quote]

I don't I understood it. I reckon guitar strings should last a good few months, especially if you are just a home player, like me. I can hear the difference in guitar strings. Admittedly, it's not as noticeable a difference as bass, but it is a difference. My school also used to buy incredibly horrible cheap strings which were just the epitome of awful.

[xilddx]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1365683605' post='2042806']
I don't I understood it. I reckon guitar strings should last a good few months, especially if you are just a home player, like me. I can hear the difference in guitar strings. Admittedly, it's not as noticeable a difference as bass, but it is a difference. My school also used to buy incredibly horrible cheap strings which were just the epitome of awful.
[/quote]
Oh ok, it looked like you thought he was talking bass strings don't matter

[Dave Vader]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1365683605' post='2042806']
I don't I understood it. I reckon guitar strings should last a good few months, especially if you are just a home player, like me. I can hear the difference in guitar strings. Admittedly, it's not as noticeable a difference as bass, but it is a difference. My school also used to buy incredibly horrible cheap strings which were just the epitome of awful.
[/quote]

Oh yeah, in a home playing environment my rotos go for ages. It's when i gig them or hit a long studio session that they all go to crap, usually the more expensive ones die earlier IME.
Btw, my SG has had the same set of rotos on it since last july, it did 2 half gigs as a back up (last couple of songs in both sets) when my strat chucked a string break on me. And it gets played a fair bit at home, and sounds great.
Don't judge roto's guitar strings by the bass strings.
I bought a set of those optima golds back in the 90s when everyone was raving about them, and they got shredded inside a fortnight, without gigging them. So I get wary of gimmicky stuff.
Used to play ernie balls all the time (good enough for Jimi, good enough for me) but changed cos they don't do the hybrid gauge I like.

[2pods]

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1365682514' post='2042776']
Blimey mate. No offence meant, but it's posts like this that makes me realise I have a very open mind. The goal is to make music, not a technical exposé on how to record instruments in musical format. I also think that your olde worlde recording methods are limited to an old geezer with an old bass and an old amp, one tone, one approach, one option, James Jamerson for example. Popular music is so much more complex now. I could be using five different tones with different effects and envelopes in one song.

You would hate the way I get my sounds and how I record. But I would like to think the music speaks for itself. I wonder what you think of this as a bass tone? I'm intereted to know [url="http://kitrichardson.bandcamp.com/track/you-always-did"]http://kitrichardson.../you-always-did[/url]
[/quote]

I really like that tone. How did you get it, or is that a Nige trade secret ?

[51m0n]

[quote name='spacey' timestamp='1365680913' post='2042736']
I like to hear the tone of a bass guitar on recordings, any tone, I have heard no end of warm compressed organ pedal type bass sounds on recent recordings, giving little reason to use a bass guitar at all, why not just use the keyboard ?
The bass guitar is an instrument of wide tone, it can clank, buzz, clink, scoop or smooth.
The art of recording the bass is a long forgotton art.
Lazy studios use DI and software emulaters and leave the bass sounding like a set of organ pedals.

High End Studios once upon a time would have a Bass booth where Tin sheets were on the walls and a Mic in the booth, this would be mixed with a DI signal for low end harmonics, the results were those famous bass tones of yesteryear that set players apart.
Tones were as important as technic is setting carears, each player had a unique way of getting the tone to recording.

Those skills are lost, one bass player sounds just like the last and the one before that, warm muddy dull compressed strangeled tones of what are rich and diverse instruments.

To hear a new recording where you can jump and and say that is a bass guitar, it is a breath of fresh air in todays lazy recording sounds.

My ten pence !
[/quote]

Never heard of a bass booth with tin on the walls. What studio was this, who designed it, what recordings is it on? Plenty of places still have booths, they get used for whatever you need, many fantastic records were made with the band in one live space, even quite recently, spill doesnt matter if it sounds great and the sounds you are capturing work perfectly together.

I can think of a tonne of recordings I've heard, and mixed, recently without a bass sound like you have described. Many of them were DI'ed - there is nothing at all wrong with DI'ing a bass, you need to be a decent engineer to track a good sound, a decent engineer to mix a good sound and a decent bassist, with perfectly functioning kit and great playing to lay down a decent track. Without all of the above the bass will end up buried in the mix always.

Then you need a producer with a mind for a bass tone that isnt purely there to support the bottom of the track, and in todays world there is so little space on chart music for the bass that it doesnt happen often. One Pink track off her last album had 150 tracks on it including something like 4 or 5 kick drum sounds used in different bits of the song - personally I cant tell that that is all going on, go figure.

The last real pop smash hit for me with a really great stand out bass tone moment was Cee Lo Greene's Forget You, and from what I heard the only bits that were actual bass guitar were the little stand out fills

Just for a moment bear in mind that it is far harder to mix a 150 track song all recorded as overdubs and sequenced and make a coherent record from it than it is to track a band together and mix that IME and IMO. However, it is far cheaper to have a facility that cannot cope with the band at once thing than one that can.


[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1365682514' post='2042776']
You would hate the way I get my sounds and how I record. But I would like to think the music speaks for itself. I wonder what you think of this as a bass tone? I'm intereted to know [url="http://kitrichardson.bandcamp.com/track/you-always-did"]http://kitrichardson.../you-always-did[/url]
[/quote]

Rather tasty that - if I do say so

[xilddx]

[quote name='2pods' timestamp='1365693950' post='2043074']
I really like that tone. How did you get it, or is that a Nige trade secret ?

[/quote]
[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1365694381' post='2043084']
Rather tasty that - if I do say so
[/quote]

Thanks 2pods It's a Warwick Corvette $$ into a POD X3 LIVE into a Tascam 2488 MkII and flown in as a WAV. 51m0n mixed and mastered it and did his magic with the bass track.

[KevB]

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1365684722' post='2042846']
Oh ok, it looked like you thought he was talking bass strings don't matter
[/quote]

After using god knows how many different brands of varying prices over the last 20-odd years of playing I'm frankly not convinced they actually do make that much of a difference (as long as it is a sensible comparison eg roundwound vs roundwound not roundwound vs flatwound).
I'd be interested for someone to set up a blind audio sample test with different manufacturers strings all of the same style and gauge and on the same bass run through the same rig played by the same player. Could we tell the difference between the £6 set and the £30 set?. Each set would realistically be run on the same bass for 6 months and played as often. One sound sample when freshly strung and another 6 months down the line to see how each set wears with equivalent use. Probably been done but not seen or heard the data personally.

[megallica]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1365683001' post='2042793']
I very much disagree. Strings make a big difference, at least as much as an amp does, and more than the pickups do. I've used rotosound rotos on my basses before, and I wasn't pleased. They are OK to begin with, but they die a death after about a month. I don't gig, and I only play a few hours a week, so why is a set of strings going dead in a month? The only thing which led me to buying more was the price, and the fact that I couldn't afford more expensive ones, which is obviously a false economy. I never use them anymore, and I've heard a couple other people having bad experiences with them too. Maybe their more expensive strings are better, but even a £14 set of strings should last more than a month, am I not right?

[b]I won't buy cheap strings. I just won't. It's a false economy, i've done it, I wasn't pleased, and I won't be doing it again.[/b]
[/quote]

Me too, they sounded really dull right out of the packet.

I suppose how long your £14 set of strings will last depends on how you play, how often you play and how much you sweat

[Dave Vader]

[quote name='KevB' timestamp='1365695641' post='2043112']
After using god knows how many different brands of varying prices over the last 20-odd years of playing I'm frankly not convinced they actually do make that much of a difference (as long as it is a sensible comparison eg roundwound vs roundwound not roundwound vs flatwound).
I'd be interested for someone to set up a blind audio sample test with different manufacturers strings all of the same style and gauge and on the same bass run through the same rig played by the same player. Could we tell the difference between the £6 set and the £30 set?. Each set would realistically be run on the same bass for 6 months and played as often. One sound sample when freshly strung and another 6 months down the line to see how each set wears with equivalent use. Probably been done but not seen or heard the data personally.
[/quote]

Can we also have them in the mix with a whole band please?
Just to get it in perspective.


btw, my 18 quid fender flatwounds do a whole year of heavy gigging before they need to get changed. Result