"What's your fee for dep work?". Errrr, dunno...

[solo4652]

I've been asked to dep for one gig in May. As far as I know it's a fee-paying gig in a social club. I'm told that there is "only time for one rehearsal before the gig". It will be the first time I've done any dep work and the band has asked "What is your dep fee?"

What's normal for dep work? I was thinking it was simply a matter of accepting what the bassist would normally have received for the gig.

Steve

[chris_b]

I usually don't see deps being required to rehearse.

I do a lot of deps and I wouldn't expect to be asked to rehearse. But, as a matter of professional pride, I [i]will[/i] turn up knowing the set better than the guy I'm replacing.

In my bands we only ask deps who are good enough to busk the gig to a high standard.

Our deps get a cut of the money. Anyone who thinks they are worth more than the regular guys won't get asked.

[Monckyman]

Minimum £100
You are after all spending two nights with the band and no doubt a good amount of time studying any tunes you don't know.

[JTUK]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1366015732' post='2047178']
I usually don't see deps being required to rehearse.

I do a lot of deps and I wouldn't expect to be asked to rehearse. But, as a matter of professional pride, I [i]will[/i] turn up knowing the set better than the guy I'm replacing.

In my bands we only ask deps who are good enough to busk the gig to a high standard.

Our deps get a cut of the money. Anyone who thinks they are worth more than the regular guys won't get asked.
[/quote]

This...

You can put any price on your services that you like, but the bottom line is can the gig afford it...?

It is hard to get a quality dep for £50, so we might agree to some sort of exes to smooth the deal ..
but you end up robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Rehearsals are not included.... but then you have to know the guy can cut it busking/reading or whatever.

If the gig is £850, we might put the dep on £100, pay ourselves more, to balance up the light gigs, and kitty the rest.
We then use the kitty to pay all gigs at a min of £50 per skull.

You have to play the dep game as above, IME, as the [b]last[/b] thing you want is to be reaching for the 'unknow quantity' phone call.

Edited April 15, 2013 by JTUK

[Conan]

[quote name='Monckyman' timestamp='1366015776' post='2047180']
Minimum £100
You are after all spending two nights with the band and no doubt a good amount of time studying any tunes you don't know.
[/quote]

Surely the whole point of declaring yourself available for dep work is that you already have a huge repertoire and/or can read and/or can learn tunes extremely quickly and are versatile enough to play well with the rest of the band?

Or am I missing something?

That said, I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect a little more than the regular bassist. After all, your presence will have saved the band's reputation (especially if the dep is needed at very short notice).

As with a lot of these questions, I guess the best answer would be "it depends".

Edited April 15, 2013 by Conan

[Monckyman]

Yes, if you are a regular dep, you will have those skills, so £100 is very cheap.
If you are not a regular dep and aren't set up for it, you will need a rehearsal at least.

We have used a dep keyboard player a couple of times.
We paid him £20 less than an equal split, because deps don't pay for rent or fuel or the PA etc.
Was still a good wage.

[solo4652]

[quote name='Monckyman' timestamp='1366017828' post='2047224']
Yes, if you are a regular dep, you will have those skills, so £100 is very cheap.
If you are not a regular dep and aren't set up for it, you will need a rehearsal at least.

We have used a dep keyboard player a couple of times.
We paid him £20 less than an equal split, because deps don't pay for rent or fuel or the PA etc.
Was still a good wage.
[/quote]

I'm certainly not a regular dep. I don't read, and I wouldn't say I learn songs extremely quickly. I have always taken pride in practising hard at home so I know what I'm doing at rehearsals and gigs. For me, one rehearsal doesn't sound enough to learn intros, outros, different keys to what I'm used to. In reality, maybe I'm not the right person for depping at this gig.

[Adrenochrome]

For a normal pub/wmc covers gig then it's the usual share of the money. I wouldn't expect to have to rehearse with the band for a single gig.

[Monckyman]

Steve, may sound daunting, but if you record the rehearsal with every song you're not sure about, then you can rehearse more at home and nail the intros etc.
It will be a good experience and may lead to more paying work.
Go for it.

[mike257]

[quote name='Monckyman' timestamp='1366019537' post='2047247']
Steve, may sound daunting, but if you record the rehearsal with every song you're not sure about, then you can rehearse more at home and nail the intros etc.
It will be a good experience and may lead to more paying work.
Go for it.
[/quote]

Wise words. The first time is the hardest but if you put yourself out there the opportunities will start coming your way. I also find dep gigs often push me to learn things I might not have done otherwise and that can only be good for you as a musician.

[shizznit]

I guess I'm a little more demanding than some dep's! I expect the same payment as what the regular guy gets for a performance and I don't pay for rehearsal time or other expenses that I won't get reimbursed for.

[danthevan]

I would say if you start asking £100 then they'll expect you to be sh*t hot.
If you say bung me £30 and some beers then they'll know what sort of standard to expect!
Keep it simple, enjoy it and buy yourself a new set of strings from it!

[ubassman]

+1

[quote name='danthevan' timestamp='1366020670' post='2047274']
I would say if you start asking £100 then they'll expect you to be sh*t hot.
If you say bung me £30 and some beers then they'll know what sort of standard to expect!
Keep it simple, enjoy it and buy yourself a new set of strings from it!
[/quote]



If you have an awesome gig and you shine then you will no doubt be asked again - if your experience turns out to be a 'steep learning curve' then no harm done if your fees are modest . You could just say to the band that as its the first time you've played with them that rather than charge your normal dep fee of £100 you just would want some petrol money to cover your costs to see how it goes.

You definitely need to get along to the rehearsal - I once did a dep job where we had just one rehearsal and the band, who had been together for a couple of years, decided to play the soul classic 'My Guy' ( which they'd done before). The guitarist had downloaded his chord chart from Ultimate Tabs , which were different to the keyboard players version from a songbook with original intros and outros and the singer wanted to do the piece in an entirely different key with a sax solo in the middle!

Its always good to meet the guys and figure out their strengths and who is likely to be the person that strings it all together on the night - Ive always found the drummer and bass player usually keep everything together and if you've already 'bonded' then the gig usually hangs together.

Theres nothing like being comfortably stretched to develop as a musician and I have done many a gig just for the opportunity. Expect the unexpected and enjoy every minute!

Edited April 15, 2013 by ubassman

[The Dark Lord]

Are there many deps who don't read?

[JTUK]

A dep will be expected to have ears and know the songs.. How they go about that is upto them, but altho intros can be joined in later on some songs ...then outros must be nailed.
I usually let the drums start and cop the feel with a bar or so...you can't be all at sea at this point as it sets up the song.
You need to come away from the gig having impressed and get called again.

Just as the band need to be sure of you..then you need to be sure that are upto playing with deps...

As with all things, you need to swim in the right circles.
Some gigs are a roasting but if they are only paying pub rates, then I doubt it will matter too much either way.
They may have decided to make the gig a busk and just go with it..and that lessens the pressure.. but if the playing level is up a notch, then
you need to be on your toes.

Bands tend to ask people they know as they know what to expect... if you aren't comfortable of knowing where you stand in all this..
go for the rehearsal and a decent split share. That way you aren't setting yourself up for anything major falls, hopefully.

It seems at this stage..you need the experience of just dropping in/depping so you are learning on their time..as it were.
With this in mind, cut them some slack with the fees. go for a split on the night and you shouldn't have to pay for the cost of the rehearsals.

[Truckstop]

I do dep work for a couple of party bands and I don't read. Luckily, all the ones I work for play off a click with loads of other parts on track (keys, percussion, backing vox etc). They send me the click tracks and I learn the set off those.

For the record, I charge £90 a night plus expenses which I think is fair. 30 pence a mile travel and I ask for food and drink too. I also ask to be compensated if i have to buy clothes to fit their image. I think if I asked for more I wouldn't get as much work.

Truckstop

[ubassman]

[quote name='The Dark Lord' timestamp='1366022047' post='2047297']
Are there many deps who don't read?
[/quote]

Orchestral + big band + show work - obviously! ...you are playing someone else's dots !
Jazz dep - probably will be a reader anyway but perhaps more valuable to know the changes and be able to transpose into any key ..and to have a 'F1' pair of ears!

Everything else that works on chord changes and where its up to you how you connect the chords - probably not vital. This sounds like the gig in this instance.

That said - in my experience yes, deps are always excellent readers ...it kind of an assumed skill and if you are going to do that kind of work on a regular basis you have to be able to comfortably handle every musical situation.

Edited April 15, 2013 by ubassman

[solo4652]

I hadn't advertised myself as a dep, and I wasn't seeking any dep work. The band saw my "bassist available" ad on one of the usual websites and contacted me asking if I'd consider depping for them.

I've just received the setlist. There are 25 songs and I'd need to learn 13 from scratch. The remaining songs I've played before, but virtually all will need a key change. For me, that's a lot of work. Also, I'm afraid the setlist leaves me cold - I think it would feel like a chore learning and playing them on the night. I wouldn't feel engaged by the songs.

So, looking at this as objectively as I can, I'd say;

I hadn't regarded myself as experienced or musically flexible enough to take on dep work
I don't read
I like to arrive at gigs well-rehearsed and practised
I would need to put in a[i] lot[/i] of time before the gig to feel comfortable
I don't especially like the songs on the setlist

Looks like "Thanks, but no thanks"

Edited April 15, 2013 by solo4652

[Dad3353]

[quote name='solo4652' timestamp='1366024993' post='2047339']...Looks like "Thanks, but no thanks"[/quote]

Could be the choice of wisdom. Are you able to pass the gig on to a colleague able to fit the bill..? It would help those looking if you could give them a lead. Maybe someone here could step up to the mark..?

[danthevan]

If you dont like the songs, then don't bother

[BassBod]

If you won't enjoy it..don't do it. But don't give up on dep work as an option- you can work at many levels, have a lot of fun (with little commitment beyond the job at hand) and make some money. You always learn something..even if that is "say no next time".

[gapiro]

I'm sure if you suggest that they post in the Bassist Wanted forum here, they will find someone.

What sort of things is it? If the set list isn't interesting, i'd still do it, its something different to do, and better than twiddling thumbs at home... and you never know! My current band started off as a jazz funk band that I depped for a couple of times, the drummer and keys player from that band , along with me and another regular dep (guitarist) started the 80's band we are playing in now...

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='The Dark Lord' timestamp='1366022047' post='2047297']
Are there many deps who don't read?
[/quote]

Me, and most of the others I know...

[bassfunk]

I normally pay deps the same as my regulars, plus a bit more to cover rehearsal time etc. I see it as the regular guys get the benefit of regular paid gigs etc. The dep doesn't, 30 songs is a lot of work, especially as we change keys and have alternative arrangements etc.

I'd be willing to Dep if you don't want it? I'll send you a PM.

Thanks

[JTUK]

If you don't like the music then it needs to pay well...
It is better to have both, of course.

If you don't feel comfortable, then this is pushing yourself outside the comfort zone..which can be a good thing
but you need to get something from this or pass.