In Ear Monitors - help needed...

[tonyf]

16 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

In other news, courier insurance has paid out on my lost IEMs... so it's time to get busy looking...

Current wishlist...

JH : Lola, Roxanne, Layla

64 : N8, 12t, 18t

UE : Live

Noble : Kaiser Encore

...but the hardest decision is quite possibly the colour scheme! 😛

The Laylas and the A18ts look absolutely awesome. Nice quandary to have 😉

[EBS_freak]

1 hour ago, tonyf said:

Fixed!

That was pretty much the solution! 😛 She didn't like the removal process much. Clearly not one for waxing.

[EBS_freak]

1 hour ago, tonyf said:

The Laylas and the A18ts look absolutely awesome. Nice quandary to have 😉

The Laylas are actually quite a boring listen - the treble is pretty recessed and overall, it's quite dark sounding despite the piece trying to be sold as a flat reference piece... but I think I need to give them another go I think. But then again, flat can be boring. They aren't going to be used for critical mixing of listening... so I should but the one that puts a smile on my face when I use them live. But then again, I've got the means of EQing them with an inch of their life with the setup I run with. Hmm.

The 18t I have a couple of reservations over - the size. I've only seen the universal version of it... and it's a bit of a beast. I'm beginning to think that the 12t is where it's at... but then again... I need to have a decent listen to them all again. The A8 has always stood out to me as one of my fave 64s... but that's gone off the table now due to the arrival of N8... but I'm not sure I want to go the dynamic route...

But talking of dynamics... there's always the UEs.

Decisions, decisions.

 

[TPJ]

So, a number of weeks ago I ordered molds from Snugs for my UE900s IEMs. The process took a little longer than the website stated but got there in the end. I've only played one gig with them but it was hot and we were rushed setting up so I don't know if the seal was good. I've since tried them at home and the seal seems to change from ear to ear when I put them in. The audiologist noted I had long ear canals and it took her three or four attmepts to get molds she was happy with. These were then sent to Snugs for manufacturing. They feel way better than the ear buds and I just need to figure out how to ensure a good seal. One thing I want to do is change the leads, the hard cable over the ear may be interfering with the seal and swivels around a bit.

 

[EBS_freak]

1. Were the impressions open, half open or closed impressions?

2. When you insert the inear, do you pull back on your pinna (specifically Darwin's tubercle - look at us getting all biology) as you push the in ear inside your ear canal? It should be a tight - but not painful fit. Once in, it should occlude noise from the outside world quite considerably. You will come to know when your inear is seated right and not - because the sound and seal just won't feel right. Can you post a pic up close of them in your ear and in place?

3. When you say changes from ear to ear, what do you mean? As in, some times they appear to seal better than other times... or is the fit inconsistent between your left and right ear?

[TPJ]

1. They took both kinds of impressions and I specified open for the molds as I sing.

2. I don't recall pulling that part back, just pushed them in and twisted a bit until they felt "in". The external sound was definitely occluded but it felt like the very ends were not sealed/seated, especially when really opening the jaw. I could feel them sealing and then releasing a little bit which then affect the sound. A quick poke and they seemed to go back in. Maybe I didn't get them in correctly in the first place.

3. Sometimes they don't seal as well. The left will feel better than the right then after taking them out and putting them back in, the right would feel better etc... They are colour coded so I'm not confusing the molds. 

I don't think I'm doing it correctly. I can try and get some pics when I get home.

[Bigwan]

16 minutes ago, TPJ said:

1. They took both kinds of impressions and I specified open for the molds as I sing.

2. I don't recall pulling that part back, just pushed them in and twisted a bit until they felt "in". The external sound was definitely occluded but it felt like the very ends were not sealed/seated, especially when really opening the jaw. I could feel them sealing and then releasing a little bit which then affect the sound. A quick poke and they seemed to go back in. Maybe I didn't get them in correctly in the first place.

3. Sometimes they don't seal as well. The left will feel better than the right then after taking them out and putting them back in, the right would feel better etc... They are colour coded so I'm not confusing the molds. 

I don't think I'm doing it correctly. I can try and get some pics when I get home.

Following this as I'm interested in getting these for my UE900s...

[EBS_freak]

1. Cool, open or semi open are good for singing.

2. Pulling your ear back will definitely help you get a better seal until you get used to how it all feels. Until you get used to them, I would expect them to be a little tricky getting them in and out.

3. If they don't seal properly, there's 2 things, either your aren't inserting them right... or the quality of impression or the final sleeve is not representative of your ear. The first one is easy enough to rectify, the 2nd could require a remould or a call back to snuggs. From what you said earlier, I'm not entirely confident about the impression! What instructions was she working to? Did Snuggs provide anything? The impression for a custom IEM/sleeve etc needs to go past the second bend.

 

[TPJ]

The place that did the impressions, Binns Hearing in Bradford, does them all the time. There were no instructions from Snuggs that I know of although they did get in touch with the place prior to my appointment to sort payment.

I'll have more time this weekend to mess around and see what I can do.

Many thanks for the help and advice.

[EBS_freak]

4 minutes ago, TPJ said:

The place that did the impressions, Binns Hearing in Bradford, does them all the time. There were no instructions from Snuggs that I know of although they did get in touch with the place prior to my appointment to sort payment.

I'll have more time this weekend to mess around and see what I can do.

Many thanks for the help and advice.

No worries - let us know how you get on.

[EBS_freak]

So... Fender have now joined the dynamic driver band wagon...

NINE–(9.25mm Dynamic) - £89.00

NINE-1–(9.25mm Dynamic + 1 BA) - £215.00

TEN-3–(10mm Dynamic + 3 BA) - £699.00

TEN-5–(10mm Dynamic + 5 BA) - £999.00

THIRTEEN-6–(13.6mm Dynamic + 6BA)- £1549.00

I wonder how much of the knowhow of Aurisonics are still with them. Certainly seems strange that now, everybody seems to be focusing on hybrid designs. What's happened to cause this knee jerk? That thirteen-6 though - thats some big dynamic to have sporting at your ear. Certainly an interesting prospect.

[EBS_freak]

OK, N8s are landing in the UK this week. Looking forward to giving them a listen!

[Dood]

7 minutes ago, EBS_freak said:

OK, N8s are landing in the UK this week. Looking forward to giving them a listen!

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts knowing your experience with other top IEMs!

[EBS_freak]

3 hours ago, dood said:

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts knowing your experience with other top IEMs!

I'm swaying towards 64 this time... partly for a change, partly because I was really, really impressed with the 12 when I heard that. The N8 is a bit of a curve ball but in my head I'm thinking 12. The 18 is too flat for me I think... I like the personality in the bass (that's why the N8 with it's dynamic interests me)... and if I was going to spend that sort of money... I think I'd be looking at cans...

[guyl]

Took the plunge recently and bought custom IEMs (and a pair of attenuated ear plugs) from Read Audio. I have no previous IEM experience, but Read Audio came highly recommended. 

Two gigs in, and I'm really pleased. Matt started life at ACS, but then set up on his own. He really knows his stuff and customer service is outstanding. He came to meet me at a pals house to take the moulds and the IEMs arrived at home within 48 hours.

The custom mould earplugs are excellent too. Should have done this years ago...      

[EBS_freak]

17 minutes ago, guyl said:

Took the plunge recently and bought custom IEMs (and a pair of attenuated ear plugs) from Read Audio. I have no previous IEM experience, but Read Audio came highly recommended. 

Two gigs in, and I'm really pleased. Matt started life at ACS, but then set up on his own. He really knows his stuff and customer service is outstanding. He came to meet me at a pals house to take the moulds and the IEMs arrived at home within 48 hours.

The custom mould earplugs are excellent too. Should have done this years ago...      

Not cheap those Reed Audio... I remember the separation from ACS and its interesting to see that he's gone down the acrylic route given that ACS are obviously known for their softer silicon. On the plus point, he didn't take the unreliable connectors with him also!

Quick turn around, not bad. Which did you go for, the dual or the triples?

 

[guyl]

The duals. It seemed if studio quality, and the ability to properly eq the monitor mix were available, the triples would have been best. But as I play a variety of gigs and don’t always know what I’ll get soundguy/desk the duals were more forgiving. Also cheaper! 

 

 

[andysg42]

Another plunger ! my band has just gone in ears ,using a Behringer x18 mixer using ipads to run are monitor mixes . I opted for ACS Emotion live 5 driver with the live pack with a UE Sound tap for my monitor levels ,Diing my bass from a Vanderkley Spartan head .. definitely takes some getting used to running my own mix ,Found to start with I was driving everything to hard .IE ,overdriving my IES . But have brought the volume down a lot now . The great thing is how we always get a great mix ,no matter stage size or room acoustics .Really pocket with the drummer in any acoustic problems also has lightened my playing style ,not having to dig in to hear my self .The down side for me is the bass comes over quite neutral sounding not transferring my pickup balance and  eq as I would like to my IEs . Also the isolation takes some getting used too ,but the live pack helps a bit . I am  Running it wired at the moment but am feeling a bit tied up with leads ,very restricting . Suppose I will   have to look into wireless systems after I've recouped some money . my 8th gig in using my IES . I was a bit old school about  the +s of in ears being 53 , but have changed my mind. Excellent investment  and my backs loving it . 

[EBS_freak]

8 hours ago, andysg42 said:

Another plunger ! my band has just gone in ears ,using a Behringer x18 mixer using ipads to run are monitor mixes . I opted for ACS Emotion live 5 driver with the live pack with a UE Sound tap for my monitor levels ,Diing my bass from a Vanderkley Spartan head .. definitely takes some getting used to running my own mix ,Found to start with I was driving everything to hard .IE ,overdriving my IES . But have brought the volume down a lot now . The great thing is how we always get a great mix ,no matter stage size or room acoustics .Really pocket with the drummer in any acoustic problems also has lightened my playing style ,not having to dig in to hear my self .The down side for me is the bass comes over quite neutral sounding not transferring my pickup balance and  eq as I would like to my IEs . Also the isolation takes some getting used too ,but the live pack helps a bit . I am  Running it wired at the moment but am feeling a bit tied up with leads ,very restricting . Suppose I will   have to look into wireless systems after I've recouped some money . my 8th gig in using my IES . I was a bit old school about  the +s of in ears being 53 , but have changed my mind. Excellent investment  and my backs loving it . 

With regard to the bass, have you tried splitting the input so you can have a channel for foh and channel for IEMs on your XR18 - means you can run different EQs - this will help greatly. Remember you have a compressor and EQ on your aux out also.

[intime-nick]

15 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

With regard to the bass, have you tried splitting the input so you can have a channel for foh and channel for IEMs on your XR18 - means you can run different EQs - this will help greatly. Remember you have a compressor and EQ on your aux out also.

that's what i do - works very well.  My FOH sound is very different to my IEM sound but from the same input.  I also do the same for the drummer (also on IEMs) whereas the two guitarists still like good 'ol wedges and prefer living with having their ears blasted....

Edited July 5, 2018 by intime-nick

[EBS_freak]

2 hours ago, intime-nick said:

that's what i do - works very well.  My FOH sound is very different to my IEM sound but from the same input.  I also do the same for the drummer (also on IEMs) whereas the two guitarists still like good 'ol wedges and prefer living with having their ears blasted....

It's the beginning of having a separate FOH and monitor mixer. Some pages back, I put up a diagram showing my setup with two Dante carded mixers. Basically all the channels of 1 are routed to the other, PRE DSP. This means I can run completely different processing per channel for FOH and Monitors. EQing the kick and bass for your inears this way is perfect... because as you have experienced, the EQ for FOH, especially if running subs, if far from ideal for your inears... and can sound a little weedy. The EQ on the Aux output can help... but it's compromise. You just have to watch what your mixers are doing Pre and Post fader, and Pre and Post DSP. Very cool trick and it's certainly helped some folk out along the way who were struggling with their inear sound and the bass sounding not quite how they wanted.

[andysg42]

Thanks EBS _Freak for your advice , will work on this over the weekend gigs . The dream if someone would open an IEM shop where you could try different manufacturers IEMs back to back  . Thanks again ebs 👍🍺

 

[Bigwan]

On the reshelling front I've discovered a local (to me) chap building custom IEMs who advertises a reshell service. He's on Facebook as "LUGS - Play it by ear". No affiliation with the guy but interested in having my UE900S done and he's confirmed he can do them. 

[EBS_freak]

4 hours ago, andysg42 said:

Thanks EBS _Freak for your advice , will work on this over the weekend gigs . The dream if someone would open an IEM shop where you could try different manufacturers IEMs back to back  . Thanks again ebs 👍🍺

 

http://www.custom-inearmonitors.co.uk - they have a fair few for you try... if you can't find something there, you ain't gonna!

[EBS_freak]

3 hours ago, Bigwan said:

On the reshelling front I've discovered a local (to me) chap building custom IEMs who advertises a reshell service. He's on Facebook as "LUGS - Play it by ear". No affiliation with the guy but interested in having my UE900S done and he's confirmed he can do them. 

Nice found. Certainly looks like he's got it down.