I'm ignorant

[The Hat]

When it comes to bass. To my mind bass can be in many different genres, and here's where I'm gonna upset people, but bass in metal now that stumps me. Can't see why anyone would want to learn for metal, the two don't go together to me .

[leschirons]

Are you saying that there's no need for a bassplayer in a metal band, or are you saying you wouldn't want to play bass in a metal band?

Metal is not my thing personally and of course there are a few scenarios where you can play without bass but I've never heard of anything rock orientated which doesn't require a bass.

[MiltyG565]

Are you saying that bass doesn't belong in metal, or am I missing something here?

TBH, without bass, metal would be high gain guitars and a man screaming.

[Mr. Foxen]

Plenty of metal bands now have three bass players. Generally a couple of them haven't graduated into getting a real bass yet and make do with detuning their guitar, and eqing out the middly sound of guitar.

[chrismuzz]

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1366656425' post='2055615']
Plenty of metal bands now have three bass players. Generally a couple of them haven't graduated into getting a real bass yet and make do with detuning their guitar, and eqing out the middly sound of guitar.
[/quote]

Hahaha! Try posting that on the sevenstring forums and see what happens

[mushers]

dont get metal i turn it off if i hear it, dont like it dont want it and said so in an ad i put on join my band and still got 3 invites for metal bands....

[Mikey R]

Just compare the guitar tone from Metallicas "Justice for All..." album with the black album three years later. Sure, they spent alot more on the studio, they layered more, and Bob Rock brought alot to the sound, but fundamentally that huge sound is from the guitar being supported from below by the bass played in unison.

On Justice, the guitars are boomy and undefined, because James Het was boosting his own low end trying to get that huge sound without a bass player.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Mikey R

[Skol303]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1366656279' post='2055611']TBH, without bass, metal would be high gain guitars and a man screaming.[/quote]

Love it Milty! That genuinely made me LOL

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1366656425' post='2055615']
Plenty of metal bands now have three bass players. Generally a couple of them haven't graduated into getting a real bass yet and make do with detuning their guitar, and eqing out the middly sound of guitar.
[/quote]

Detuning has to be one of the most annoying things about guitarists, in my opinion. It's like they aren't happy with doing the solos and getting the glory, but they also have to tread on our toes to just rub salt in to the wound. Down-tuned and 7/8/9 string guitars normally sound bloody horrible too. I just bloody HATE the whole idea of it.


[quote name='Skol303' timestamp='1366656721' post='2055632']
Love it Milty! That genuinely made me LOL
[/quote]

Well, at least it's the truth

[xgsjx]

Most of the metal that I used to listen to would have sounded rather empty without any bass.
Imagine what Motorhead's Ace Of Spades would sound like without that (or any) bassline. Would anyone have wanted to listen to it?

[sykilz]

Iron Maiden with no bass........ (shudders......)......

[xgsjx]

Couldn't agree more with the detuning of guitars.
At the rehearsal rooms, one guy said to the guitarist "they've got a nice marshall 4x12 rig in there, has loads of bass". I said "Why don't you just take up bass & be done with it".

[bobbass4k]

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1366656425' post='2055615']
Plenty of metal bands now have three bass players. Generally a couple of them haven't graduated into getting a real bass yet and make do with detuning their guitar, and eqing out the middly sound of guitar.
[/quote]

Stephen Carpenter (Deftones) has gone so low he's actually gone full circle. He started on E standard 6 strings, then Db Standard 6 strings, then Drop C 6 strings, then Ab standard 7 strings, then drop Gb 7 strings, then Gb standard 8 strings, now with the new album he's on F standard and drop E 8 strings. He is actually now just playing bass, but it works for them.

Although I should declare I'm a die hard drop tuning fan. I usually stick to D standard/ Drop C and never really go below Drop B, but the timbre of a guitar is completely different to a bass in any tuning, and if the bass drops with the guitar (as it should) you still get a well rounded sound.

Edited April 22, 2013 by bobbass4k

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='bobbass4k' timestamp='1366658012' post='2055668']
Stephen Carpenter (Deftones) has gone so low he's actually gone full circle. He started on E standard 6 strings, then Db Standard 6 strings, then Drop C 6 strings, then Ab standard 7 strings, then drop Gb 7 strings, then Gb standard 8 strings, now with the new album he's on F standard and drop E 8 strings. He is actually now just playing bass, but it works for them.

Although I should declare I'm a die hard drop tuning fan. I usually stick to D standard/ Drop C and never really go below Drop B, but the timbre of a guitar is completely different to a bass in any tuning, and if the bass drops with the guitar (as it should) you still get a well rounded sound.
[/quote]

Didn't their bass player just die after being in a coma for ages? In terms of good reasons to cover bass territory with your guitar, that is pretty much up there.

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='bobbass4k' timestamp='1366658012' post='2055668']
Stephen Carpenter (Deftones) has gone so low he's actually gone full circle. He started on E standard 6 strings, then Db Standard 6 strings, then Drop C 6 strings, then Ab standard 7 strings, then drop Gb 7 strings, then Gb standard 8 strings, now with the new album he's on F standard and drop E 8 strings. He is actually now just playing bass, but it works for them.

Although I should declare I'm a die hard drop tuning fan. I usually stick to D standard/ Drop C and never really go below Drop B, but the timbre of a guitar is completely different to a bass in any tuning, and if the bass drops with the guitar (as it should) you still get a well rounded sound.
[/quote]

You can't drop tune a bass by an octave though.


[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1366657807' post='2055661']
Couldn't agree more with the detuning of guitars.
At the rehearsal rooms, one guy said to the guitarist "they've got a nice marshall 4x12 rig in there, has loads of bass". I said "Why don't you just take up bass & be done with it".
[/quote]

I don't really see the point in drop tuning. If you want low notes and bass, play bass!

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1366658698' post='2055686']
Didn't their bass player just die after being in a coma for ages? In terms of good reasons to cover bass territory with your guitar, that is pretty much up there.
[/quote]

He had been in a coma for 10 years I believe.

[chrismuzz]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1366658875' post='2055688']
You can't drop tune a bass by an octave though.
[/quote]

Not necessarily true! I tuned my newest Peavey 6er EEADGC for a laugh and it was gut wrenchingly awesome, no flab and plenty of attack! Only a .130 string as well! To be fair though, the 35" scale, neck through, and string through body construction helped a bit.

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='chrismuzz' timestamp='1366659280' post='2055693']
Not necessarily true! I tuned my newest Peavey 6er EEADGC for a laugh and it was gut wrenchingly awesome, no flab and plenty of attack! Only a .130 string as well! To be fair though, the 35" scale, neck through, and string through body construction helped a bit.
[/quote]

ew...

[chrismuzz]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1366659429' post='2055695']
ew...
[/quote]

No really, it was good man!

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='chrismuzz' timestamp='1366659492' post='2055699']
No really, it was good man!
[/quote]

It's going on the list of things I refuse to believe, along with God and potato bread outside of Northern Ireland.

[KingBollock]

Drop tuning doesn't bother me. What bothers me is when people lump all of metal music into one group. It is a massive and many varied creature and to dismiss it as any less than that shows a huge lack of understanding.

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='KingBollock' timestamp='1366659887' post='2055707']
Drop tuning doesn't bother me. What bothers me is when people lump all of metal music into one group. It is a massive and many varied creature and to dismiss it as any less than that shows a huge lack of understanding.
[/quote]

Bingo! I like some metal, like Iron maiden, but there's lots I don't like.

[JapanAxe]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1366656279' post='2055611']
TBH, without bass, metal would be high gain guitars and a man screaming.
[/quote]
Quote of the year!

[bobbass4k]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1366658923' post='2055690']
He had been in a coma for 10 years I believe.
[/quote]

5 actually, but yea, they got Sergio Vega in and he's recorded the last 2 albums, although his creative contribution to the first one was apparently minimal, so that may actually explain Stephs switch to 8 strings, if they were jamming and writing without bass he might have wanted to round out the sound, although actually I saw a gear walkthrough where he said his switch to 7 strings was mainly for comfort, his hands are too big for 6's, so maybe not.

[Bolo]

There's oodles and more of interesting and challenging basslines in heavy metal. Some bands not so much, where the bass just follows guitar and nothing else. Too many bands to name them all feature imaginative virtuose and creative bass players, whose parts are not at all easily copyed. The fun in playing slow (laid-back) basic blues/rock for half an hour or more escapes me, it feels like a chore. Me I'd rather play thrilling fast rollercoaster parts, that keep me on my toes and demand my full attention when playing.
Just to name a few people that have me raise the bar for my own skills:
Frank Bello, Dan Lilker, Steve Harris, Paul Barker, Jo Bench, Frank Watkins, Phil Rind....
Listening to these people (and many others) makes me pick up my bass, try to play what they play and incorporate what I learn in my own songwriting.

On the other hand, 'great' bands like the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Yes, Genesis and many other millionsellers I can hardly bare to listen a single song of.
It takes all kinds apparently!

Edited April 22, 2013 by Bolo