Changing the style of a song.

[xgsjx]

I've started a band. I advertised for musicians & put the genre as being a mix of Acid Jazz, Breakbeat, House & Funk & anything else with a good groove.
I've got 2 guitarists (one's a musician & sings too), a drummer & a singer/turntablist.

I suggested a couple of covers to get us playing together & then once we're comfortable, get writing our own stuff.
I've suggested a few songs for the band to choose from & if they had any good suggestions then we could try them out too.
They're just practice tracks to get us gelling, but what some of the band have suggested couldn't be much further from any of the styles that I advertised.
Here's what I've been given...

From the guitarist: Bruce Dickinson - Winds of change
From the guitarist/singer: Barenaked Ladies - It's all been done
From the drummer: Bruce Springstein - Radio nowhere
From the turntablist/singer: Hot Natured - Benediction
The last one is the only one that's already along the right lines of the genre.

The first 2 are @ 134 bpm & Radio Nowhere is 140 bpm, so I'm thinking that they could be done in more of a house/acid jazz style. But it would have made more sense to pick songs already in the genre.
We're gonna try them out on Tuesday, so we'll see what comes of them.

Any of you guys have to rewrite the genre of a song?

[charic]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1368172559' post='2073954']
I've started a band. I advertised for musicians & put the genre as being a mix of Acid Jazz, Breakbeat, House & Funk & anything else with a good groove.
I've got 2 guitarists (one's a musician & sings too), a drummer & a singer/turntablist.

I suggested a couple of covers to get us playing together & then once we're comfortable, get writing our own stuff.
I've suggested a few songs for the band to choose from & if they had any good suggestions then we could try them out too.
They're just practice tracks to get us gelling, but what some of the band have suggested couldn't be much further from any of the styles that I advertised.
Here's what I've been given...

From the guitarist: Bruce Dickinson - Winds of change
From the guitarist/singer: Barenaked Ladies - It's all been done
From the drummer: Bruce Springstein - Radio nowhere
From the turntablist/singer: Hot Natured - Benediction
The last one is the only one that's already along the right lines of the genre.

The first 2 are @ 134 bpm & Radio Nowhere is 140 bpm, so I'm thinking that they could be done in more of a house/acid jazz style. But it would have made more sense to pick songs already in the genre.
We're gonna try them out on Tuesday, so we'll see what comes of them.

Any of you guys have to rewrite the genre of a song?
[/quote]

I wrote death metal versions of Brianstorm by Arctic Monkeys and "Feeling Good" (the Muse version). More for fun than any practical reason though

[neepheid]

That's how we kicked off in the Inevitable Teaspoons. For reference I guess we're like an R&B/Rock/Blues band. We sat round the table and asked each member for a song that they'd like to do in the band - anything goes sort of thing. The list:

Me: Gary Numan, "Cars"
Drummer: U2, "Angel of Harlem"
Trombonist: Kiss, "Crazy Crazy Nights"
Saxophonist: The Isley Brothers, "Harvest for the World"
Keys: Joe Cocker, "Delta Lady"

In the end only Delta Lady stuck and has remained in the set list. Admittedly we haven't made much of a change from the original, horn section stabs instead of backing vocals and the drumming's a bit more energetic. We messed about with Cars, played it in swing time and all sorts of nonsense but at the end of the day there just wasn't enough in the song to work with. We had fun messing about with it though, and we might return to it one day, if I can graft some kind of middle bit into it. Maybe a mashup with something else. Hmmm.

We do a cover of Cream, "White Room" with no guitars. That's quite different I suppose. Overdriven bass, drums, keys (with phasers set to stun), sax and the secret weapon - wah wah trombone. Whether it's change of genre or just wilful weirdness is another question, but we like it

[Roland Rock]

It's obvious the direction that fate is taking you - you will be the world's first band to only cover songs by people called Bruce. Add Bruce Hornesby and Jack Bruce to the list too ;-)

I laughed when I saw your brief then the first suggestion being Bruce Dickinson! But what the hey, try it in your style and it might turn out to be a great version

[Cat Burrito]

In the 90s my pop punk did Pulp's Common People in the style of the Sex Pistols' Pretty Vacant and I thought it was superb. Always went down really well. I think mixing up genres is almost always interesting. I'm playing with some rockabilly boys at the moment who are doing "Walk Right In" (the old country blues standard) as a swing type thing. All good fun

[Lowender]

I'm of the belief that if you're going to do an original arrangement, do a completely different take. Use the composition as the vehicle and take it to a new place. But if it's meant to be cover that people want to hear, then give them an accurate reproduction of the version they know. A "neither here nor there" representation never really works since it just sounds like a bad cover.

Having said that, I posted a couple of videos I found on Youtube where guys were doing (what I thought was) interesting, unusual takes on a couple of standard songs and the responses from the BassChat crowd was vehement hatred. So, be forewarned.

Edited May 10, 2013 by Lowender

[xgsjx]

Hehe, you ought to hear what we've done with Come Together (the Beatles). It start's off like the original & then turns a bit techno rock.
I like it, but I'm sure there's folk who hold old songs as "sacred". I always try to play a song nothing like the original.

[Leon Transaxle]

[quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1368177293' post='2074038']
I'm of the belief that if you're going to do an original arrangement, do a completely different take. Use the composition as the vehicle and take it to a new place.
[/quote]
I go with that.

[Skol303]

Hmmm... I guess the question here is what direction do you want to take the band in?

There could actually be scope to produce some cool 'remixes' of classic songs in alternative genres - might even be a useful gimmick that would give your band a unique edge.

As it stands, it sounds like your band members (other than the turntablist) have a very different vision of where they want to be heading - or at least they have very different musical tastes/backgrounds. If it's the former then you might be in for a clash of expectations; if it's the latter then it's not such an issue, just a case of needing to broaden the music that your band members are familiar with (sharing a bunch of reference material would be a good way to start).

I've cooked up numerous 'remixes' myself - and that's always a case of taking inspiration from the original material, but using it to create something different; sometimes wildly different! And it's great fun I think it could definitely work in the context of band and might be worth exploring... makes me think of stuff like Orbital's legendary take on Belinda Carlisle's "Heaven is a Place on Earth", which became a firm favourite of their setlist.

Anyway, keep us posted!

Paul

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='xgsjx' timestamp='1368172559' post='2073954']
Any of you guys have to rewrite the genre of a song?
[/quote]
Don't have to but regularly do. A song is just a melody line and some words, after that you can do what you like.

[xgsjx]

[quote name='Skol303' timestamp='1368192503' post='2074316']
Hmmm... I guess the question here is what direction do you want to take the band in?

There could actually be scope to produce some cool 'remixes' of classic songs in alternative genres - might even be a useful gimmick that would give your band a unique edge.

As it stands, it sounds like your band members (other than the turntablist) have a very different vision of where they want to be heading - or at least they have very different musical tastes/backgrounds. If it's the former then you might be in for a clash of expectations; if it's the latter then it's not such an issue, just a case of needing to broaden the music that your band members are familiar with (sharing a bunch of reference material would be a good way to start).

I've cooked up numerous 'remixes' myself - and that's always a case of taking inspiration from the original material, but using it to create something different; sometimes wildly different! And it's great fun I think it could definitely work in the context of band and might be worth exploring... makes me think of stuff like Orbital's legendary take on Belinda Carlisle's "Heaven is a Place on Earth", which became a firm favourite of their setlist.

Anyway, keep us posted!

Paul
[/quote]

That could be a very good idea! Alt covers band with just a couple of our own tracks.

When I was first advertising for musicians I spoke with the drummer & the guitarist both separately & we discussed the ideas that I have for a band & they was both wanting to do something different. So I think it's the latter of what you said.

The guitarist is from a metal background & the drummer likes all sorts of stuff but is partial to a bit of Tool.
We then got together one evening just to talk about what we want the band to do & the idea is pretty much the same.
I suppose if they don't really know much of the genres then the suggestions are going to be from what they do know.
The other guitarist/singer wasn't at the meeting & is a friend of the drummer's but I think he still knows the route we're looking at (though I might have another meeting to check we're all on the same train).

I've created a playlist of all the tracks that's been suggested by all the band members & shared it with them so we all know the songs. I'm gonna make another playlist of genre specific stuff to share so they know what I'm actually aiming towards. It doesn't have to go there, just so long as it grooves & gets people dancing. So if it ends up sounding like drum & bass with Nirvana on top, then that's cool.

I'm looking forward to Tuesday's sesh.

[Skol303]

^ Nice one G, it sounds like a good project based on what you say above!

In which case the diverse musical backgrounds of those involved could be an advantage - adding a fresh set of ears to each 'remix'.

And DnB Nirvana is something I want to hear. Bring it on

[JTUK]

We rewrite most of the stuff..... but only in terms of putting our sound and stamp on them so not a zillion miles away from the template track..
It all comes down to how strong the idea or vision is...
The last thing you want to end up with is a contrived version...it either flows or it doesn't...

[xgsjx]

That's a very good point. We've hit the eject button a couple of times with songs that we thought would work, but just didn't.

[thisnameistaken]

You're very lucky finding a turntablist who wants to do a live band. I'm really struggling.

[Lowender]

Two completely revamped versions of Nirvana song that work (for me, perhaps not others) and for different reasons.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oKVWHaMef4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6IJGRm54D4

[Lowender]

Another pretty cool one. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaKRYdGoNZI

[Painy]

I played for a couple of years with a band that did a very heavy, hard rock cover of Insomnia by Faithless which was guaranteed to fill the dance floor!
Be careful you don't allow yourself to get too gimmicky with making this your thing though. Saw a band in Norwich years ago who's entire set was made up of lightening fast shouty punk covers of pop songs. Hilarious as I found their version of My Heart Will Go On from Titanic, it did get a bit tired after about 15 minutes! As it happens my band recently played a gig where the support was booked by the venue. The guitarist from afore mentioned punk band was playing with them and this time was playing nothing but lightening fast shouty punk covers of Elvis songs!

Edited May 11, 2013 by Painy

[Lowender]

[quote name='Painy' timestamp='1368256391' post='2074907']
I played for a couple of years with a band that did a very heavy, hard rock cover of Insomnia by Faithless which was guaranteed to fill the dance floor!
Be careful you don't allow yourself to get too gimmicky with making this your thing though. Saw a band in Norwich years ago who's entire set was made up of lightening fast shouty punk covers of pop songs. Hilarious as I found their version of My Heart Will Go On from Titanic, it did get a bit tired after about 15 minutes! As it happens my band recently played a gig where the support was booked by the venue. The guitarist from afore mentioned punk band was playing with them and this time was playing nothing but lightening fast shouty punk covers of Elvis songs!
[/quote]

Agreed. But that isn't really doing "arrangements, it's one gimmicky idea done over and over. Hell, you can do reggae versions of Sinatra songs or bossa nova versions of punk songs and it wouldn't even take any rehearsing. How about calypso renditions of country songs? It may be funny for about 16 measures but that's about it. it's hardly clever.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Lowender

[waynepunkdude]

[quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1368226233' post='2074803']
Two completely revamped versions of Nirvana song that work (for me, perhaps not others) and for different reasons.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oKVWHaMef4[/media]

[/quote]

Was ready to hate this as it's my fav Nirvana song, it's pretty good, not as good as the original in fact it takes the point out of the song, 6.5/10.

Our awful take on Tainted Love

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MD_7vflnbAI"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MD_7vflnbAI[/url]

[BassTractor]

[quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1368177293' post='2074038']
and the responses from the BassChat crowd was vehement hatred.
[/quote]

Hm. I'd call it reasoned dislike rather than vehement hatred. Good reasons too.

best,
bert

Edited May 11, 2013 by BassTractor

[Lowender]

[quote name='BassTractor' timestamp='1368287354' post='2075340']
Hm. I'd call it reasoned dislike rather than vehement hatred. Good reasons too.

best,
bert
[/quote]

Hey, pick anything -- any musician, any song, any film, any book -- and I can a reason to dislike it. It's easy. Someone can find a cure for cancer and someone else will have a problem with it. lol

[scalpy]

Love doing this. We do a few newish songs in the soul band this way.

Poker Face with a purdie shuffle.
Crazy (the Gnarls one) like a tango
Single Ladies with a Bo Diddley rhythm.

Me and the Mrs also do acoustic versions of Valerie in a cod reggae style, Ace of Spades like lounge jazz and Can't get you outta my head bossa nova!

[xgsjx]

We had a sesh last night & it was rock. We rock well, but I didn't want another rock band. They're like guitarists, too many average ones already.

Come Together works well, doesn't sound like a rock song. Too Close rocked (but I enjoy making wubs, so it was fun). It's All Been Done sounded like The original but with a disco bassline. Winds of Change sounded pants & we never did Radio Nowhere as no one printed the lyrics off & no one could member the chords.

I don't think the guys in the band have the skills yet to change a song style. They listen to the song & learn how the original is played, but don't change it when they play it.
The guitarist/singer said "we can do simple pop rock songs until we gel & then learn to play funk/soul" but my concern is that if we start out playing one style, it could be harder to change to another. I think it might be better to do simple funk soul songs like Bill Wither's Use Me, Cameo's Word Up & so on, that way we're not a million miles away from the Acid Jazz/ Breakbeat stuff that I advertised to do to start with.

I'm sure Bilbo's bands don't jam punk songs before learning jazz?

[xgsjx]

Just back from another jam. The suggested songs were Come Together (which is sounding pretty good & very different from the original), It's all been done, Radio nowhere & Johnny B (overrated 3 chord predictable pile of something that isn't) Goode.

So we started with the Barenaked Ladies song, It's all been done. They played & sung it just like the original. Tried it again as I didn't play the bassline anything like the original & it still sounded guff.
Then we tried Radio Nowhere. Again the 2 guitarists just tried to rock it. OK, it's a rock song, but were not a rock band. So I wubbed the whole song (which actually sounded good to an extent) & we binned that song as well.
They then pulled out Johnny B Gooaway!! I really hate this song. I never used to, but it's worse than Mustang Sally to play! It's a boring pile of steamy turd that just follows the same 3 chord pattern as almost every other crappy RnR song from the 50s & 60s. I tried playing something a bit more funky, popped the auto filter on, tried slapping, a bit of disco, but nothing makes it sound any better.

We then played Come Together & we had fun. At last a song that sounds good, is fun to play & the guitars sound good in it. So we played it another 2 times.
Then we played a wee bit of Get Lucky, which was sounding good, but one of the guitarists got bored & said it's just typical dance music & couldn't be bothered playing it anymore.

We did Crazy & then the 2 guitards started playing some random rock stuff & noodling about. Why is it so hard to find decent musicians!

I'll try another couple & see how it goes, but I think we need another band meeting to talk about the music & then just write things.