Joined my first band

[Jobiebass]

Morning campers.

Finally have time to join a band so me and a few mates started on on the weekend.
Now I seam to have run into a problem, ive been playing about 3 years but I just rip off other peopels bass lines which means now I have no clue how to make up one up to go with that they are playing unless I just play root notes, I tried throwing in some extra notes, just 3rds and 5ths here and there but tbh it wasnt great.

Is there any books you would recomend?? I could really do with swatting up, its a little embarasing when the drummer (who shreads guitar) can pick up my bass and make something up better then I can.

[jakenewmanbass]

If you have people around you that can give suggestions (ie the drummer) then use their ideas, don't be afraid to ask, and there is no shame in using the resources you have available. You've already done the important thing of learning others bass lines, in time you will develop your own lines as the songs become familiar. You are just at the beginning of something new so relax and ease your way into it, effort is always appreciated. You should not be embarrased by the comparative abilites of others, be hungry to learn from it. Pride has no place in the bass chair.
Jake

Edited June 2, 2008 by jakesbass

[Toasted]

I found I learned most, most quickly in your situation when I got myself a teacher

[Jobiebass]

Well ive just started taking lessons. Mainly just for the theory. learning scales and such forth, Inprov will come in time im sure. But if I can find extra help in the form of a book it'll give me something to do between bass lessons on top of what my tutour asks me to do/learn.

[jakenewmanbass]

[quote name='Toasted' post='210931' date='Jun 2 2008, 09:25 AM']I found I learned most, most quickly in your situation when I got myself a teacher [/quote]
+1

[lozbass]

Everyone has a different approach and there's no doubt that experience, technique and knowledge of theory are a big help. However, I would suggest that you think carefully about the music/songs/lyrics for which you are providing (or creating) a bassline. Personally, I find it very difficult to devise lines in a rehearsal setting. I like to sit quietly, usually without a bass, and just think about a piece of music/song in its entirety an in its component parts. What is the music about? What does it mean to me? How can my part (i) complement the music sympathetically or, (ii) add something, take it off into another dimension, underpin the fundamental, provide an intriguing counterpoint? What I try to do ('not for me to judge how successfully!) is imagine the bass line (or bass part) into being before I try to play it. I just mess around with ideas in my head (often humming!) and try to create lots of different approaches and versions, always bearing in mind that I'm aiming for a sympathetic interpretation and a line/part that will complement (or nuance, re-layer, re-orient, extend) the music into which it will fit.

I see some great bass players - people with astonishing technique - however, I'm frequently surprised that their technique is apparently allowed to take precedence over interpretation. I'm a big fan of (notionally) dischordant and atonal composition (as well as conventional composition), however, I get a bit turned off when a technically stunning line crashes across the music in which it sits (or rather doesn't sit), and it's clear that the player hasn't given the first thought to the music and its performance as a whole.

I hope this makes sense and wish you the best of luck - I know that what works for me won't always work for others, but it may be worth a bit of experimentation - let your imagination run riot.

Edited June 2, 2008 by lozbass

[Jobiebass]

[quote name='lozbass' post='210968' date='Jun 2 2008, 10:20 AM']let your imagination run riot.[/quote]

I know what your getting at but im finding it hard. There was a build up which was a# x6, d#, f, Cx8 Dx8 and I knew there needed SOMETHING either on the last 2 C notes or around that area that I could have easly put something in but I just have no clue what to play or do. Im not asking for a solution to that, im just trying to say I can spot the opertunity but I need some direction.

[lozbass]

Don't get hung up on it - at least you're thinking about it (a very good sign!) I won't be so arrogant as to suggest something in relation to the line that you mention (and I don't know anything about the context), however, I'd recommend that you just sing the passage to yourself and see what comes up (I've been doing it with your sequence and enjoying myself!). Don't force it, just play around with ideas (and have a think about syncopation and beat structure if it would help). Good luck, it's not always easy but it can be fun

[wulf]

Two quick thoughts:

1. Learning basslines from recordings is invaluable even if you play in a strictly originals band because it builds your vocabulary. Try riffs and ideas from the music you have been working on, twist and adapt to fit what else is going on and you should find you have some original basslines that don't sound ripped off but do sound great.

2. Try recording your sessions with the group. Listening back to those will give you an opportunity to firm up the things you did which worked and also to listen to what else is going on, sparking new ideas.

Wulf

[Musky]

[quote name='lozbass' post='211015' date='Jun 2 2008, 11:30 AM']Don't force it, just play around with ideas (and [b]have a think about syncopation and beat structure[/b] if it would help). Good luck, it's not always easy but it can be fun[/quote]

+1 to that.

That have been some great bass lines that are little (if anything) more than root notes. I was listening to Club Foot by Kasabian the other day - it seemed to me that the signature riff in it was actually guitar, and the bass was actually playing nothing more than root notes, albeit with an interesting rhythm. It sits perfectly in the song.

[Jobiebass]

So are there any decent books out there to help with this??

[Happy Jack]

[quote name='Jobiebass' post='211044' date='Jun 2 2008, 12:18 PM']So are there any decent books out there to help with this??[/quote]

There are loads - so many that there's little point looking unless you narrow your parameters first.

I play mainly blues, and I love walking basslines. So I go to the shop, look for books on [i]Building Walking Basslines[/i].

You need to decide what sort of bass you like to play - or alternatively what sort of bass will fit best with your new band - and THEN go looking for the right books.

As your starter for 10, you could try looking through a list of all titles by Hal Leonard (that's a publisher, not an author) or all titles by Ed Friedland (he's an author, not a publisher). I can happily recommend pretty much anything with one or both of those names on the cover.

Good luck.

[Bassassin]

I was in a similar position to you when I joined my first band, many, many millennia ago... I'd been playing 3 years, was reasonably competent & could play loads of other people's lines!

My advice would be to go back to the bassists whose work you know - and try & get inside their heads. Work out why they play what they do, how it works within the song as a whole, what ideas & techniques they'll regularly use to construct a bass part, and then try & apply those ideas to composing your own lines.

For me I think this approached help train the "composing" side of my brain - you'll find it becomes easier to hear a bass part in your head when you listen to a song.

Jon.

[Jobiebass]

Flea is pretty much my hero but the band is kinda blues/indy

[Oscar South]

This is a 2 step process, all you need to do is to get the music into your head and after that learn to play in on your bass.

As is usually the case, the answer here is ear training, transcribe a bunch of basslines or improvs of bassists you admire and would like to work into your style and take every opportunity to improvise yourself, jam with friends as much as you can and put the radio on or your playlist on shuffle and just jam along with it.

This is one of the most fun aspects of playing to learn, I wouldn't recommend any books on the subject, its something that just comes to you in time if you give it the right 'environment' to grow. Theory won't really help 'directly' at first (the more things to think about, the less room for actual expression) but after growing more comfortable with theory and improvising it'll improve your playing subliminally, I've heard theory described as a paradox in that every musician tries to learn more but also to forget it all while playing, I find this very true.

[bigjohn]

[quote name='Oscar South' post='211131' date='Jun 2 2008, 02:40 PM']all you need to do is to get the music into your head and after that learn to play in on your bass.[/quote]


singing the song to yourself in your head is a good one. I often jump out of bed with a new line in head, or think of one when I'm doing something entirely different. The trick is go and learn how to play it, and then try it out at your next rehearsal. Don't worry if it doesn't work - sooner or later one will come into your head which is just right.

[Oscar South]

Another interesting thing to do is to get new sounds into your head is to take all your basslines and play them backwards or all the intervals upside down (or both), can come up with some interresting stuff this way.

[skywalker]

+1 on the Hal Freidland books, Building Walking Basslines and Building Rock Basslines.

They will at least give you ideas of when to use notes other than the root, but I have found if I am struggling (often!!), play the root but "walk" over the chord change with chromatics to help the bassline to flow.