Band problem #27187

[tonyquipment]

I guess it boils down to: is it worth it?

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='Confuzzled' timestamp='1369951255' post='2094986']
1/ The band is something of a money pit, and I'm bearing the brunt of it ...
[/quote]
Are you a bassist or a manager? Either way this has to stop and all costs are to be paid out of earnings or are to be shared equally. If anyone doesn't like it they can f*** o**.

[quote name='Confuzzled' timestamp='1369951255' post='2094986']
2/ ... I'm quite laid-back ... I'm generally belittled ...
[/quote]
Sorry, but I am going to belittle you again. Are you a bassist or a mouse? Either way this has to stop and all band members need to respect what other members of the band do for the band. If anyone doesn't like it they can f*** o**.

[quote name='Confuzzled' timestamp='1369951255' post='2094986']
3/ ... Goes against every fibre of my being ...
[/quote]
It looks to me as though you are the one who doesn't like it and therefore you should be the one who f**** o**.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='Confuzzled' timestamp='1369951255' post='2094986']
1/ The band is something of a money pit, and I'm bearing the brunt of it.
[/quote]
BTW, the one and only time this might be thought reasonably to be true is if, and only if, you are the bandleader and musical director. It's your band so you pay but in return everbody else does as they are told and they get paid.

Edited May 31, 2013 by EssentialTension

[WalMan]

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1369996758' post='2095297']
Are you a bassist or a manager? Either way this has to stop and all costs are to be paid out of earnings or are to be shared equally. If anyone doesn't like it they can f*** o**.


Sorry, but I am going to belittle you again. Are you a bassist or a mouse? Either way this has to stop and all band members need to respect what other members of the band do for the band. If anyone doesn't like it they can f*** o**.


It looks to me as though you are the one who doesn't like it and therefore you should be the one who f**** o**.
[/quote] ... so to sum up then, everyone should just f*** o** Sounds like a plan.

Been through it somewhat with the current band, arrange the bookings (along with the drummer who does the posters & hall bookings for r/h), bought the lights (after getting sick of playing under the stock 40W bulb in the corner of the pub. Last year we'd had enough and didn't chase gigs and the r/h bookings were handed over. We've also had 'the meeting', but the net result is nothing in the diary and I suspect a slide into giving up, which is sad but its had a good run.

If it's a band that you enjoy otherwise/musicwise then the meeting to set some ground rules to go forward is probably your best bet, but if that has no net effect then as above

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='WalMan' timestamp='1369997771' post='2095313']
... so to sum up then, everyone should just f*** o** Sounds like a plan.
[/quote]
Thanks for clarifying what I really meant.

[Cosmo Valdemar]

I say jump ship. But I've always placed enjoyment at the top of the list of band priorities - I don't care how successful we are, if it's a drag, it ain't worth it.*

On the bright side, if you do leave, think of the mess it will leave them in


*Unless of course the band was my living, in which case I would just get on with it.

[RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE]

If you are gonna 'make it' ,how long would this be for ? 1 -2 albums ?
Are you not better off being a session bassist instead ?
Maybe you could have a big public spat , and end up in the press. (Publicity

[Starless]

Forget 'petrol money'. If the van is yours and you also use it for personal (non-band) trips, then keep an accurate count of every mile the van does on band business. On a monthly basis take the total band mileage multiply by 0.45 and then invoice each band member for an equal share of that figure (in pounds sterling). If you do all the driving then that is your contribution to the band's transport. The rest contribute by recompensing you via the 45p per mile mileage allowance for fuel and other running costs.

[Jonnyboy Rotten]

IMHO if I was in your position I would start (if you haven't already) keeping track of what 'the band' is spending and how much of it has come out of your pocket.

I would suggest working out the average cost of keeping the band going each month and just have the members all stick the same amount in by Direct Debit.

Or like a previous post said - just present them with the evidence and just say you can't keep putting £XXX into the band without seeing either some help or some return.

I hope it gets sorted mate - let us know what happens.

[skankdelvar]

No offence intended but this is the standard band interpersonal dynamics thing, only slightly worse than usual.

You've paid for lots of stuff - if you're the only one subbing out, then they've slit you up like a kipper. If not, stop moaning. That's life.

The others belittle you. Or is it that you feel they don't praise you enough? Don't hold your breath waiting around for unsolicited praise from anyone in this world. Equally, never let a slight go unchallenged. Sharing your unhappiness with us may feel soothing but it'll get you [i]nowhere [/i]in the real world.

They critiqued you on your stage presence. You didn't like the critique. Ask yourself - [i]were they right?[/i] If they were, just suck it up and work on your act. If not, tell 'em why they're [i]wrong [/i]and tell 'em to poke it. Oh and don't be surprised if people make lists. That's what most people do best in bands - make lists.

OK - your band has trouble filling venues but they're thinking of hiring a radio plugger, FFS?

Delusional.

First off, radio pluggers never did much even in the old days, apart from smuggle underage girls into Radio 1. These days, they're practically extinct. Do it online, do it yourselves and you'll do it right.

What else? Well, if you want to be looked up to and you want to 'have a say' and you want to earn money rather than spending it then best switch to being the frontman, write the songs and hire your own band. Then you'll have a bass player of your own to kick in the bollocks if he or she will put up with it.

It's a food-chain thing.

Edited May 31, 2013 by skankdelvar

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='lurksalot' timestamp='1369994616' post='2095261']


Wow , and the OP thinks he has a problem
[/quote]

It's about that Tim to change personas, I'm sososososo bored now.

[Roger2611]

Sorry if it sounds harsh, it's not meant that way, but from the way I read the OP you want your ego massaging as well as the other band members, you are realising the truth of being a bass player....we all know they run the van (because bass players are the only ones reliable enough to handle such responsibillity and that can find a venue and arrive on time) As a bass player you already realise that in the great scheme of things you are nothing more than halfway between a drummer and a musician and are by rights going to be taken for granted by the rest of the band.

Your post makes me think of a lead guitarist trapped in a bass players body, yes I think the money issues need to be resolved but you have to do that, if you appear happy to keep paying for stuff then the other band members will be happy to let you keep doing so, do you really want to let the others have responsibillity for running the van....I think not!

I my band (notice the "my" was deliberate) I built the PA (made the singer pay for it though) I sort out anything technical in the band, I supply the lighting (by choice) the one thing I don't do any of is finding gigs, that is down to the other guys

[Twigman]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' timestamp='1369992073' post='2095222']

If you feel pressured to be the fall guy for paying for thongs, insist on taking all the cut of a gig.
[/quote]
Perhaps the others are a little shy going in to Ann Summers to buy 5 of them ????

[TimR]

It's not about the money though is it? It's about the way that the other guys expect you to do those things. Essentially they're wrapped up in their own little worlds.

Why don't they have money? I'd hazard a guess that they don't work because they're waiting to be famous.

Stop doing stuff and delegate it to some of the others. Then it's their problem if it's not done the way they want it.

Careful you're not being a control freak, lots of things will and can be done by others equally as well, maybe just not the way you would have done it.

In the meantime, get in a covers band, go out and do some easy freelance gigs and have some fun.

[Confuzzled]

Thanks for this guys, some interesting opinions from both sides; I deliberately stuck this up on here and stood back for a bit to think things through myself.

I've certainly got to have it out with the band, and need to make sure that if I'm going to spend more money keeping the van on the road that I'm going to see some (if not all) of it back, as I don't need the thing day-to-day and could be saving a packet were I to be on two wheels instead or just driving a little 1.3. I've put too much time, money and effort in to throw my toys out of the pram and quit, but I'm sufficiently pissed off at being taken for granted that I'd certainly have that in the gun cabinet.

I'll let you know how things go (and then let the mods know so they can delete this thread, we're not supposed to have multiple accounts )...

[JTUK]

Quit.... but since your posting this I assume you want to stay.

Write out a list of all the monies owed and present it to the band at a special meeting that you have requested.
Tell them what you are not happy with and how it is going to change...
and make up your mind that you'll walk if they don't shape up.

I think they may well call your bluff... as they think you are weak.

If you don't or can't do this, then dig deep again and again....

[borisbrain]

It's an interesting position. As Bruce Thomas (of The Attractions) once said, "in a band, there's creative tension, and then there's just tension". However, at the risk of offending a fellow 4-stringer, I gotta say that on the one hand you have some very legitimate grievances, and on the other there seems to be a bit of whining going on.

The van is yours, and you let the band use it for gigs. Great. The others help pay for fuel but not servicing costs like exhausts and so forth. But you'd probably think the lead singer was off his/her trolley if he/she expected you to contribute to the taxing or servicing of his/her car. If the van was purchased solely for the use of the band then you'd have a very strong argument, but I'm guessing that you get to use it at all other times.

As for belittlement, then every bass player in the world gets the piss taken out of them. We're only one up on the evolutionary scale from drummers... ; )

And if the band is going to move up a gear, then that means everybody has to move out of their comfort zone and work a bit harder. So yes - this means everybody else facing up to their financial commitments, but you will also need to play your part in stage presentation. Stage-managed bands like One Direction are indeed awful and clichéd, but they make a stack of money, and work very hard at it. Gene Simmons has to wear ridiculous make-up and stick his tongue out with Kiss; Angus Young keeps wearing those shorts in his 60s; the Bay City Rollers wore all that wretched tartan; the Glitter Band wore all that, um, glitter. If the band wants to be better-known or - gulp - [i]famous, [/i]then this is the crossroads you're at: either up-the-ante or fold.

I guess it comes down to whether or not you like the band and enjoy it all. If so, then say your piece to the others about sharing legitimate costs, then put on the glitter trousers and spangly boots and jump about 'n stuff. If you don't enjoy it, and feel that you're being shown the door, then you'd be equally entitled to move on (taking the van and other stuff with you, of course...)

Hope it all works out, and bestaluck

BB

[Lfalex v1.1]

No lengthy advice.
Just this:

GTFO

(get the **** out, for the uninitiated)

[tauzero]

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1370024819' post='2095771']
First off, radio pluggers never did much even in the old days, apart from smuggle underage girls into Radio 1. These days, they're practically extinct.
[/quote]

Nonsense. There are still plenty of underage girls around.

[itsmedunc]

[i]I put up with far worse than that for years. I left, they split up. And that was the end of it.[/i]

[Confuzzled]

[quote name='borisbrain' timestamp='1370054070' post='2096123']
The van is yours, and you let the band use it for gigs. Great. The others help pay for fuel but not servicing costs like exhausts and so forth. But you'd probably think the lead singer was off his/her trolley if he/she expected you to contribute to the taxing or servicing of his/her car. If the van was purchased solely for the use of the band then you'd have a very strong argument, but I'm guessing that you get to use it at all other times.

[/quote]

It was purchased MAINLY for band use, since for what I actually use it for I could easily get away with a little hatchback, but I happened to have the cash when the band started up (and I'm the oldest, so cheapest to insure ).

[JTUK]

Work on the basis that all extras outside of your playing role are chargeables.
This is why our band costs £275 per gig to run, minimum.

You may have to swap one cost for the other, and after all, you are IN a band, rather than empoyed by it,
but the workload.costs need to be spread.
If everyone takes an equal role then great, you are bartering one off against another, maybe..but if an unequal load, then make it an issue
to the point that people understand this is work that needs/has to be done by someone.

We pay kitty/admin/PA and therefore have to look to split the gig fee 6 ways ..the 6th share pays out the extras.

[TimR]

As I say you've got yourself in a tricky situation where the rest of the guys now expect you to do certain things. Rather than just dumping all your jobs on them at once, try offloading one small task every week or so.

Maybe give the guitarist the job of booking rehearsals and communicating with the band to make sure they can make them. Sometimes that's a pretty big task in itself. Maybe someone already does this, in which case you need to understand that you're not the only person doing anything. Even something that looks simple can actually be a real ballsache.

It might pay you to sit down and write out all the tasks first and evaluate who would be best to do certain tasks. Then just ask them individually.

Off load the tasks until what you're left with is manageable.

What happens if your family/work commitments change or you left? Would the band fold or have the guys got the drive? If it would fold you need to really evaluate who you are putting all this effort in for.