Trading and selling on Basschat seems to have dramatically declined

[Chiliwailer]

[quote name='Gust0o' timestamp='1371590213' post='2116019']
The dangers of internet forums, chaps (chaps in a passive sense, I believe) - intonation is so often missing, and what we'd laugh off in the pub we take umbrage at in pixellated read-out
[/quote]

Nice quote. (Meant in a sincere appreciative way rather than with a smug and sarcastic tone).

This is my first venture onto forums. I'm generally more on the outernet (not even on facebook) so I now consider myself better educated on what to expect all round.

[markbunney]

My bass was on here for nearly 4 months before it finally sold on gumtree.

I had some interest on here, even to the point of arranging the details of delivery/meet up then the people just disappeared without even saying they'd changed their mind.

[Musicman20]

Personally I think £0 to £20 is a fair jump. £2 an advert would be fairer. Not saying BC doesn't deserve the cash, I just think people aren't as willing to sell now. The £20 has to be considered first.

[SpaceChick]

Haven't read through the whole thread, but thought I'd add my views.

I think £7 one off or £20 yearly fee is reasonable if you are selling regularly or selling a high priced item.

However, for someone like me who won't be selling much, I think it is pricey.

I have a fretless P bass to sell now, I'm only looking at selling it for about £120. I'm loathed to pay a £7 fee as I worry it wouldn't sell and that is a big percentage of the sale cost (not flashy enough for many basschatters and quite a specialist item), however, I can list it on Facebook for free and can wait for a free listing day on eBay and only have to pay fees if I do sell it.

(Note, I'm not trying to advertise my fretless here through the backdoor! However, if someone read my post and did want it I would pay a £7 out of politeness )

So whereas Basschat would have been my first port of call previously, now I am put off by the fees in view of my comparatively cheap items!!

[Conan]

[quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1371625218' post='2116218']
So whereas Basschat would have been my first port of call previously, now I am put off by the fees in view of my comparatively cheap items!!
[/quote]

I admit that I hadn't really thought of that. I guess one decent sale of, say, £500 more than covers the £20 but if all you have to sell is small or inexpensive items (I don't like the word "cheap" as it implies poor quality ) then the fees do seem disproportionately high.

I'm still sticking to my view that £20 a year as a membership fee represents good value for all the fun and information available on here. If you see it that way, then the selling becomes free! £20 a year is less than 0.5p per day. How many of us are on here every day? Would you balk at a charge of 0.5p to log on?

[Lfalex v1.1]

If the fees had been in place when I attempted to sell 3 items on here in the space of 18 months, I'd be between £21 and £40 out of pocket. None of the items sold. Strange, because I subsequently sold them elsewhere for precisely what I wanted.
Latterly, I just use EBay/Gumtree etc. and have had none of the issues encountered on here (time-wasting, low-balling and so on)
Conversely, when I've bought on here, It's been great, as have all the BCers I've met in person. In fact, all the people I've sold to by other means have been pretty OK, too.

[JTUK]

[size=5][sup]Prices are pretty keen on here and everyone knows what they want to pay so not sure it is that good a place for seliing...[/sup][/size]
[size=5][sup]Not that I sell anything,... [/sup][/size]
[size=5][sup]It is good for specialist stuff... as you simply don't come across it elsewhere ...but for general you can source elsewhere.[/sup][/size]
[size=5][sup]and at better prices. Maybe the fee has had an impact there as well.[/sup][/size]
[size=5][sup]£20 to a 'trader' is nothing spread across a good few items..so £7.00 per single item doesn't sound so bad...but that still means [/sup][/size]
[size=5][sup]it has to sell through this medium.. [/sup][/size]
[size=5][sup]Talking to a regular selller, they said they had all but given up selling here as the low balls were ridiculous or tedious as best....[/sup][/size]
[size=5][sup]as in what part of the add did you NOT understand....!!! ONO means a near offer, for example.[/sup][/size]

[tredders]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1371625816' post='2116226']
I'm still sticking to my view that £20 a year as a membership fee represents good value for all the fun and information available on here. If you see it that way, then the selling becomes free! £20 a year is less than 0.5p per day. How many of us are on here every day? Would you balk at a charge of 0.5p to log on?
[/quote]

That's how I look at it. I paid my £20 and then sold a (decent) combo for a bargain price of £100. I've not got anything else to sell on the horizon, but I figure £20 to be a reasonable sum for access to this place for a year...

[Damonjames]

I do think the £20 fee is putting some off. When I first got blocked trying to sell my mike dirnt bass, I was a little annoyed. But when I worked out eBay insertion fees (even if I doesn't sell) and then seller fees on top, if you are selling anything worth more than a few hundred quid, it starts to be a line ball call which is worth more. Atleast here it will run until you sell or choose to withdraw, you have a target market ready made, generally speaking the ads are accurate unlike eBay (search for a fender bass and you get all sorts of stuff), and I personally find the banter on items brill as you can get some personal reviews/experience. Also the fact that a year is a long time and your equipment needs may change (or get GAS) and you can still list on.
The most important thing to remember about the fee was to help with the administration of the site, so ask yourselves what having access to this community is worth to you??? Personally I'd say £20 is a small price to get me out of watching holby city while I sit next to my wife bc'ing on my iPhone!

[hamfist]

[quote name='Damonjames' timestamp='1371664632' post='2116813']
The most important thing to remember about the fee was to help with the administration of the site, so ask yourselves what having access to this community is worth to you???
[/quote]

A hugely important point, seemingly forgotten by many.

Edited June 20, 2013 by hamfist

[Conan]

[quote name='Damonjames' timestamp='1371664632' post='2116813']
The most important thing to remember about the fee was to help with the administration of the site, so ask yourselves what having access to this community is worth to you???[/quote]

Exactly. I find it incredible that some people are asking about where those funds will be spent - as if they would be happy to pay them if they were being used for some things, but would not pay if "their" money might be used for something of which they disapprove. I just don't get that. If we were talking about hundreds of pounds, fair enough - but £20 a year?

[Jellyfish]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1371718282' post='2117217']
Exactly. I find it incredible that some people are asking about where those funds will be spent - as if they would be happy to pay them if they were being used for some things, but would not pay if "their" money might be used for something of which they disapprove. I just don't get that. If we were talking about hundreds of pounds, fair enough - but £20 a year?
[/quote]

I also find it incredible that people don't seem to understand the sort of audience BassChat attracts on a daily basis in terms of 'viewership'. One of the biggest bass websites in Europe, if not the biggest, and people don't want to fork over £20 for a whole 12 months to be able to sell [b]anything[/b] on here? It's crazy.

If you're worried about losing £20, then add £20 onto your next sale. I can tell you now, if someone wants your item, an extra £20 won't make a difference. Worried about your item not selling at all? Then why put it up for sale in the first place if you have doubts?

I've also noticed a drastic increase in the quality of the adverts that are now popping up, now that people care if they sell. It's a lot less frustrating trying to look for tidbits of information and going through several links just to get a crappy little picture you took on your phone.

Not only that, but there is [i]still[/i] a minority that feel that £20 is somehow a sting to their wallet. What, to support a website with great advice and information, great members, open discussion about music and laughter (mostly at other peoples expense )?

The fees are great and, if anything, the quality of adverts have gotten better and the volume of 'I'll see if anyone wants this at a way-too-high-price' sale topics have reduced. It's brilliant.

[Prime_BASS]

Good point above.

At some point, we only have the end users (ourselves) to blame about the fees and even the ric ban.

Poor quality adverts that even after around a year of the rules stating there must be a valuation on your add even if its just for trade, there was still innumerable ads merely stating a bass was for sale or for trade.
Updating the site isn't free to the owners and we get the most out of it, for me the fee was a no brainer.
Although it's still a pain to sell stuff due to the sheer volume of potential viewers, but buying is never short of an absolute pleasure.

[Subfeeder]

I haven't read all the posts but I stopped advertising gear on Basschat when they put the fees on. There are plenty of other free options for selling gear on the internet so why pay? I wouldn't mind paying a couple of quid for an advert but £7 is too much. Seems like the Basschat admins are seriously out of step with the times if they think that they can justify these advertising fees to run a forum.

[Silvia Bluejay]

The impression I'm getting from this thread is that our membership is clearly divided into those who consider this site as a community, and don't mind giving their time and/or money just as a thank you for being part of it, and those who look at the forum mostly from the utilitarian point of view of shifting gear at the best possible price and don't seem to assign that much value to pure "bass chat", banter, advice, etc.
The latter group is clearly a bit miffed at the newly introduced fees. Basschat's owners, admins and mods are having to deal with two forces pulling in roughly opposite directions, and that can't be easy if, as they're doing at present, they try to keep both of them more or less satisfied.

[woodyratm]

Someone above posted that even £5 per advert would be more appealing. I'd be tempted to agree.

It's the age old 9.99 being cheaper than £10. It looks better..

I'd probs go a fiver.

[Gust0o]

[quote name='Subfeeder' timestamp='1371728119' post='2117389']
I haven't read all the posts but I stopped advertising gear on Basschat when they put the fees on. There are plenty of other free options for selling gear on the internet so why pay? I wouldn't mind paying a couple of quid for an advert but £7 is too much. Seems like the Basschat admins are seriously out of step with the times if they think that they can justify these advertising fees to run a forum.
[/quote]

Perhaps they are. And there are options elsewhere - so you can, as you just did, not pay and remain free to use the forum. Which I think remains an important distinction. We would have had a different debate, I imagine, if they'd discussed charging to simply use the site

Of course, make sure you provide feedback - PM Ped or Kiwi and raise it.

What we did see, when the fees went on, was a huge amount of attempted fee evasion. People putting prices in to bypass the subscriptions or adapting old ads, quite consciously in many cases.

[The Dark Lord]

[quote name='Jellyfish' timestamp='1371720141' post='2117240']
I also find it incredible that people don't seem to understand the sort of audience BassChat attracts on a daily basis in terms of 'viewership'. One of the biggest bass websites in Europe, if not the biggest .........
[/quote]

There is an interesting point that has yet to be discussed here, relevant to "viewership" as you call it.

I actually don't know the "viewership" the site attracts in terms of page impressions per day / week / month. Does anyone here actually know that? The owners will, of course, at least have the ability to know that - but I don't know if they consider it to be commerically sensitive or not. I suspect the bounce rate will be low and the pages per visit will be more that your average website.

Edited June 20, 2013 by The Dark Lord

[BetaFunk]

I wonder how many posted adverts before the fee was introduced actually wanted to sell their bass? You don't don't see the 'not sure i want to let this go' and 'this is just a feeler' posts any more so perhaps there are still the same amount of basses being sold but just not as many advertised.

[ped]

Hi guys

All I'll say is that from our point of view, there's a very healthy marketplace which is thriving. It's matured.

If you would rather sell elsewhere, away from the biggest group of bass players outside the US, that's fine. It's totally up to you... as I said, though - we're very happy with it, and so are countless members who like to use the facility.

Cheers

[ambient]

I remember going to Winchester a few years ago. The cathedral wanted some ridiculous amount of money to go in, £15 or something each. Consequently people were stood in the doorway taking photos looking down the aisle, an empty cathedral.
Last time I went it was free, and the place was packed.

Charge £7 per advert and you may get 100 adverts over the course of a month. Charge £2 and you may get 500 adverts over the same period,

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='The Dark Lord' timestamp='1371730384' post='2117429']
I actually don't know the "viewership" the site attracts in terms of page impressions per day / week / month. Does anyone here actually know that?
[/quote]

Based on the handy stat at the bottom of the page, I can tell you that, in the last 15 minutes, 780 users have been online, of which over 3/4 weren't logged on or don't have an account.

That suggests a LOT of traffic, and presumably not-insignificant hosting bills.

[The Dark Lord]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1371730776' post='2117441']
Based on the handy stat at the bottom of the page, I can tell you that, in the last 15 minutes, 780 users have been online, of which over 3/4 weren't logged on or don't have an account.

That suggests a LOT of traffic, and presumably not-insignificant hosting bills.
[/quote]

I'd need a closer estimate than "a lot" to make the point though.

[Jah Wibble]

[quote name='bluejay' timestamp='1371728804' post='2117406']
The impression I'm getting from this thread is that our membership is clearly divided into those who consider this site as a community, and don't mind giving their time and/or money just as a thank you for being part of it, and those who look at the forum mostly from the utilitarian point of view of shifting gear at the best possible price and don't seem to assign that much value to pure "bass chat", banter, advice, etc.
The latter group is clearly a bit miffed at the newly introduced fees. Basschat's owners, admins and mods are having to deal with two forces pulling in roughly opposite directions, and that can't be easy if, as they're doing at present, they try to keep both of them more or less satisfied.
[/quote]

Init...

Really sad to see this situation on BC. Not sure if everyone is suffering from withdrawal from the Rick ban thread or something, but this kinda thing is putting me off this site.

I can't claim to have been on here in the good ole days but I think £20 for the year if you sell stuff regularly seems pretty good, if you don't like it stick on the bay or in a shop where they'll either give you a sh*t price or take a commission??
Perhaps the one off fee could come down to a Lady (Gadiver-fiver) but there IS a recession on and it only seems to be biting people hard (I for one) now.

You don't HAVE to post it up here, you DO have a choice, I don't think moaning on about is really worth it........is it?

[Conan]

[quote name='ped' timestamp='1371730507' post='2117434']
If you would rather sell elsewhere, away from the biggest group of bass players outside the US, that's fine. It's totally up to you...[/quote]

Conjures up an image...