Jaco pastorius.

[Dingus]

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1374177706' post='2146222']
I really can't understand this sort of attitude.[size=4]Not just for Jaco, but Shakespeare, Mozart and others as well. Yes they were good at what they did, but the attitude that no can ever be better (which I know is not what you said) seems very negative and backward looking. All budding bassist, playwrights and composers might as well pack up now.[/size]

Jaco may have been technically brilliant, but his music (esp. the solo's) do very little for me (in fact bass solos generally leave me bored to tears). There are plenty of bass players I much prefer to listen to, which in my mind makes them "better".

Besides Jaco's been dead for 26 years - time to move on.
[/quote]

Well , the thing is that Jaco and the other artists you mention were radical departures within their given discipline , and changed their medium forever . It is possible for all kinds of fancy Dan bass players to come along with amazing chops and technique , but so far most have struggled to make the impact that Jaco did . I wouldn't put Jaco in the same bracket as Mozart or Shakespear for various reasons ( I could explain why , if you like ) , but in his own modest way he was a genius of sorts , but not because of his technique . His gift was that he thought about and interpreted music differently to other people , and happened to do so via the medium of the bass guitar . Like just about every genius you can think of , Jaco was unconventional , a radical , and unlike anything that had come before him on the bass guitar . He wasn't alone in that by any means - there were other fantastically gifted players of that era - but at his best he was brilliant in his own right . He was versatile too , despite having such a distinctive signature style . He was a World- class jazz bassist and accomplished soloist , but his work as an accompanist in various genres is equally accomplished and shows great maturity and sensitivity to the overall musical picture rather than just his own role in it . Regardless of your own personal taste ( which you are fully entitled to , I hasten to add) Jaco was the real deal , the complete package . I am not one of Jaco's slavish followers by any means , and I couldn't even say he was the player I myself have enjoyed or or directly tried to emulate the most , but his stature on the instrument is undeniable .

Edited July 18, 2013 by Dingus

[steve-soar]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1374179577' post='2146251']
Well , the thing is that Jaco and the other artists you mention were radical departures within their given discipline , and changed their medium forever . It is possible for all kinds of fancy Dan bass players to come along with amazing chops and technique , but so far most have struggled to make the impact that Jaco did . I wouldn't put Jaco in the same bracket as Mozart or Shakespear for various reasons ( I could explain why , if you like ) , but in his own modest way he was a genius of sorts , but not because of his technique . His gift was that he thought about and interpreted music differently to other people , and happened to do so via the medium of the bass guitar . Like just about every genius you can think of , Jaco was unconventional , a radical , and unlike anything that had come before him on the bass guitar . He wasn't alone in that by any means - there were other fantastically gifted players of that era - but at his best he was brilliant in his own right . He was versatile too , despite having such a distinctive signature style . He was a World- class jazz bassist and accomplished soloist , but his work as an accompanist in various genres is equally accomplished and shows great maturity and sensitivity to the overall musical picture rather than just his own role in it . Regardless of your own personal taste ( which you are fully entitled to , I hasten to add) Jaco was the real deal , the complete package . I am not one of Jaco's slavish followers by any means , and I couldn't even say he was the player I myself have enjoyed or or directly tried to emulate the most , but his stature on the instrument is undeniable .
[/quote]
Brilliant post.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1374179577' post='2146251']
Well , the thing is that Jaco and the other artists you mention were radical departures within their given discipline , and changed their medium forever . It is possible for all kinds of fancy Dan bass players to come along with amazing chops and technique , but so far most have struggled to make the impact that Jaco did . I wouldn't put Jaco in the same bracket as Mozart or Shakespear for various reasons ( I could explain why , if you like ) , but in his own modest way he was a genius of sorts , but not because of his technique . His gift was that he thought about and interpreted music differently to other people , and happened to do so via the medium of the bass guitar . Like just about every genius you can think of , Jaco was unconventional , a radical , and unlike anything that had come before him on the bass guitar . He wasn't alone in that by any means - there were other fantastically gifted players of that era - but at his best he was brilliant in his own right . He was versatile too , despite having such a distinctive signature style . He was a World- class jazz bassist and accomplished soloist , but his work as an accompanist in various genres is equally accomplished and shows great maturity and sensitivity to the overall musical picture rather than just his own role in it . Regardless of your own personal taste ( which you are fully entitled to , I hasten to add) Jaco was the real deal , the complete package . I am not one of Jaco's slavish followers by any means , and I couldn't even say he was the player I myself have enjoyed or or directly tried to emulate the most , but his stature on the instrument is undeniable .
[/quote]
Excellent post. Couldn't have put it better.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1374178290' post='2146233']
You may (or may not) be joking here, but the fact is that Jaco is hardly known outside bass player circles.
[/quote]
I presume that you're the one doing the joking this time?

Edited July 18, 2013 by BetaFunk

[lowdown]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1374179577' post='2146251']
Well , the thing is that Jaco and the other artists you mention were radical departures within their given discipline , and changed their medium forever . It is possible for all kinds of fancy Dan bass players to come along with amazing chops and technique , but so far most have struggled to make the impact that Jaco did . I wouldn't put Jaco in the same bracket as Mozart or Shakespear for various reasons ( I could explain why , if you like ) , but in his own modest way he was a genius of sorts , but not because of his technique . His gift was that he thought about and interpreted music differently to other people , and happened to do so via the medium of the bass guitar . Like just about every genius you can think of , Jaco was unconventional , a radical , and unlike anything that had come before him on the bass guitar . He wasn't alone in that by any means - there were other fantastically gifted players of that era - but at his best he was brilliant in his own right . He was versatile too , despite having such a distinctive signature style . He was a World- class jazz bassist and accomplished soloist , but his work as an accompanist in various genres is equally accomplished and shows great maturity and sensitivity to the overall musical picture rather than just his own role in it . Regardless of your own personal taste ( which you are fully entitled to , I hasten to add) Jaco was the real deal , the complete package . I am not one of Jaco's slavish followers by any means , and I couldn't even say he was the player I myself have enjoyed or or directly tried to emulate the most , but his stature on the instrument is undeniable .
[/quote]

Top of the class dude...

[sblueplanet]

I'm pretty sure every artist would love to think that their music or style is still a topic for hot discussion 25 years on.
Jaco didn't invent the instrument but he definitely re-invented how the instrument could be approached as a way of playing and composing and for that he'll always be a touchstone.

[White Cloud]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1374179577' post='2146251']
Well , the thing is that Jaco and the other artists you mention were radical departures within their given discipline , and changed their medium forever . It is possible for all kinds of fancy Dan bass players to come along with amazing chops and technique , but so far most have struggled to make the impact that Jaco did . I wouldn't put Jaco in the same bracket as Mozart or Shakespear for various reasons ( I could explain why , if you like ) , but in his own modest way he was a genius of sorts , but not because of his technique . His gift was that he thought about and interpreted music differently to other people , and happened to do so via the medium of the bass guitar . Like just about every genius you can think of , Jaco was unconventional , a radical , and unlike anything that had come before him on the bass guitar . He wasn't alone in that by any means - there were other fantastically gifted players of that era - but at his best he was brilliant in his own right . He was versatile too , despite having such a distinctive signature style . He was a World- class jazz bassist and accomplished soloist , but his work as an accompanist in various genres is equally accomplished and shows great maturity and sensitivity to the overall musical picture rather than just his own role in it . Regardless of your own personal taste ( which you are fully entitled to , I hasten to add) Jaco was the real deal , the complete package . I am not one of Jaco's slavish followers by any means , and I couldn't even say he was the player I myself have enjoyed or or directly tried to emulate the most , but his stature on the instrument is undeniable .
[/quote]
This.

[steve-soar]

Hahahaha. Jaco wins.

[steve-soar]

Jaco makes me go to uninvited places. I avoided listening to him for years, then when I did, it all slotted into place.

[the boy]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1374179577' post='2146251']


Well , the thing is that Jaco and the other artists you mention were radical departures within their given discipline , and changed their medium forever . It is possible for all kinds of fancy Dan bass players to come along with amazing chops and technique , but so far most have struggled to make the impact that Jaco did . I wouldn't put Jaco in the same bracket as Mozart or Shakespear for various reasons ( I could explain why , if you like ) , but in his own modest way he was a genius of sorts , but not because of his technique . His gift was that he thought about and interpreted music differently to other people , and happened to do so via the medium of the bass guitar . Like just about every genius you can think of , Jaco was unconventional , a radical , and unlike anything that had come before him on the bass guitar . He wasn't alone in that by any means - there were other fantastically gifted players of that era - but at his best he was brilliant in his own right . He was versatile too , despite having such a distinctive signature style . He was a World- class jazz bassist and accomplished soloist , but his work as an accompanist in various genres is equally accomplished and shows great maturity and sensitivity to the overall musical picture rather than just his own role in it . Regardless of your own personal taste ( which you are fully entitled to , I hasten to add) Jaco was the real deal , the complete package . I am not one of Jaco's slavish followers by any means , and I couldn't even say he was the player I myself have enjoyed or or directly tried to emulate the most , but his stature on the instrument is undeniable .
[/quote]
Right on m*****f***er...... Nobody can argue with that. If they try they must be stupid.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='BassBus' timestamp='1374174515' post='2146173']
I think a lot of both those players music is equally as good, if not better, than anything Jaco did. But then, that is the subjectivity of this.
[/quote]
You're missing the point. Jaco led. Others followed.

[Count Bassy]

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1374180274' post='2146261']
I presume that you're the one doing the joking this time?
[/quote]

No I wasn't. Ask a cross section of joe public to name a bass player and I'm pretty sure he'd be way down the list after, for example, Paul McCartney, Sting, Phil Linnot, Chris Wolstenholme, and probably after John Entwhistle as well. Most people have never heard of him.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1374192104' post='2146411']
No I wasn't. Ask a cross section of joe public to name a bass player and I'm pretty sure he'd be way down the list after, for example, Paul McCartney, Sting, Phil Linnot, Chris Wolstenholme, and probably after John Entwhistle as well. Most people have never heard of him.
[/quote]
Please tell that you were joking. Please.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='the boy' timestamp='1374186633' post='2146367']
Nobody can argue with that. If they try they must be stupid.
[/quote]
I agree but i'm sure that ain't gonna stop 'em!

[cloudburst]

I'm struggling to see why public perception has got anything to do with prowess as a bass player. Some of the most gifted people in their field - be it medicine, science etc - and the ones who push the boundaries, accomplish a great deal, are names the average Joe hasn't heard of.

CB

[miles'tone]

My favourite track with Jaco wearing his sideman cap.
This is one sweet groove

The outro is pure Jaco.
You can almost see the mischievous grin on his face, knowing that it's going down on a track hoping to be a top 40 single

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgGjg9FLq74

Edited March 24, 2014 by icastle
Link fixed.

[steve-bbb]

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1374192104' post='2146411']
No I wasn't. Ask a cross section of joe public to name a bass player and I'm pretty sure he'd be way down the list after, for example, Paul McCartney, Sting, Phil Linnot, Chris Wolstenholme, and probably after John Entwhistle as well. Most people have never heard of him.
[/quote]

no mark king??? FTW

[4000]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1374179577' post='2146251']
Well , the thing is that Jaco and the other artists you mention were radical departures within their given discipline , and changed their medium forever . It is possible for all kinds of fancy Dan bass players to come along with amazing chops and technique , but so far most have struggled to make the impact that Jaco did . I wouldn't put Jaco in the same bracket as Mozart or Shakespear for various reasons ( I could explain why , if you like ) , but in his own modest way he was a genius of sorts , but not because of his technique . His gift was that he thought about and interpreted music differently to other people , and happened to do so via the medium of the bass guitar . Like just about every genius you can think of , Jaco was unconventional , a radical , and unlike anything that had come before him on the bass guitar . He wasn't alone in that by any means - there were other fantastically gifted players of that era - but at his best he was brilliant in his own right . He was versatile too , despite having such a distinctive signature style . He was a World- class jazz bassist and accomplished soloist , but his work as an accompanist in various genres is equally accomplished and shows great maturity and sensitivity to the overall musical picture rather than just his own role in it . Regardless of your own personal taste ( which you are fully entitled to , I hasten to add) Jaco was the real deal , the complete package . I am not one of Jaco's slavish followers by any means , and I couldn't even say he was the player I myself have enjoyed or or directly tried to emulate the most , but his stature on the instrument is undeniable .
[/quote]

+1, and I'm not really much of a fan at all, of either his playing or his music.

[4000]

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1374193243' post='2146414']
Please tell that you were joking. Please.
[/quote]

I think it may depends what circles you move in. The only people I know who've heard of Jaco have done so because they're either already jazz fans or I told them. Most people I know have no idea who he was.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='4000' timestamp='1374221030' post='2146497']
I think it may depends what circles you move in. The only people I know who've heard of Jaco have done so because they're either already jazz fans or I told them. Most people I know have no idea who he was.
[/quote]
Most people have no idea what a bassist is ... and why on earth should they?

Edited July 19, 2013 by EssentialTension

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1374192104' post='2146411']
No I wasn't. Ask a cross section of joe public to name a bass player and I'm pretty sure he'd be way down the list after, for example, Paul McCartney, Sting, Phil Linnot, Chris Wolstenholme, and probably after John Entwhistle as well. Most people have never heard of him.
[/quote]
Most people wouldn't recognise any of those people as bassists let alone know Pastorius.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='miles'tone' timestamp='1374195326' post='2146420']
My favourite track with Jaco wearing his sideman cap.
This is one sweet groove

The outro is pure Jaco.
You can almost see the mischievous grin on his face, knowing that it's going down on a track hoping to be a top 40 single

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgGjg9FLq74
[/quote]
I liked that.

Edited March 24, 2014 by icastle
Link fixed.

[steve-bbb]

personally i rather like his stuff - his solo album stuff is ok and his jazz big band arrangements are great but for me personally the Joni Mitchell and Weather Report stuff is imho the best of the Jaco catalogue and i would suggest that this was down to the chemistry between the individuals in those groups ( and PM's Bright Size Life too)

In the JM band he was playing alongside Pat Metheny and Milke Brecker and backing the lyrics or arguably one of the finest songwriters in modern music. In Weather Report he was playing alongside the immense playing and compositional skills of Joe Zawinul and Wayne Shorter. Yet in both line-ups he manages to consistently produce bass lines which are so indescribably unique but they never seem to compete with the tune but always enhance it which is a major factor in why both of these bands the sum of the individual parts was far greater than the whole.

It has already been mentioned on another Jaco thread several months ago and worth searching but check out the video interview of Joni Mitchell describing Jaco and his contribution to her music

[lowdown]

Most people don't even know the names of tunes they are asking for...
Do you do that one by what's her name ?....You know her.. of course you do...go on now go...that one...


Lovely...
[quote name='miles'tone' timestamp='1374195326' post='2146420']
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgGjg9FLq74
[/quote]

Edited March 24, 2014 by icastle
Link fixed.

[merello]

It is always daft to have a pissing contest over how great someone is. Here is my opinion, and remember, you are all entitled to my opinion!

I was in a flat in Glasgow when, late at night, a channel put on live music. At that point, I only really listened to The Stranglers and Genesis and had started playing bass in a band for a laugh. The height of bass was JJ and Foxton with their great, driving, thunderous bottom lines that drove songs on.

It was Shadows and Light by Joni Mitchell. Not really my scene but as the evening progressed, I drifted closer and closer to the telly and further from the beer. I was hypnotised by the tic-a-tac and low smears. The lack of slavish root note playing and the way that everything served to make the song better enthralled me. This was the early to mid eighties and there was no easy way off finding out who he was. Eventually I ordered a Japanese import of the record at great cost. I think an album was about £4 and this was £16!

Whatever anyone thinks about him, he is one of the few musicians ever to sear himself on my life from one performance.