Disappointing shop experience

[ras52]

[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1375093623' post='2156529']
I think the worst thing a shop can do is put you through some little practice amp when you're trying out an instrument. Surely you want it to sound as good as it can when the prospective customer is making up his or her mind? Case in point - was in Glasgow a couple of weeks back. Tried a bass in one shop and was put through an Orange crush combo which was buried behind another amp (?). Tried a bass in another shop and was put through a Mark Bass combo. From which shop do you think I bought the bass?

Not the first time a shop has lost a sale from me because they made the bass I am trying sound merely functional. I try not to take it personally either, but there's a degree of feeling like I'm not being taken seriously in all this.
[/quote]

+1

I "popped into" Andertons on Saturday - I went to buy a specific item but thought I'd have a nose around first. An electo-acoustic g**t*r caught my eye, and when I asked to hear it amplified they found me a quiet spot downstairs and set up a very nice AER amp and left me to it. To cut a long story short... thank god for interest-free credit!

[BassTractor]

I can just add to others' experiences.

Me, I wasn't too keen on seriously trying a 700 quid classical guitar that had no sound quality whatsoever - obviously due to very, very old, bad factory strings. I just handed it back saying it badly needed some serious strings. Shop keeper's son said he'd think of it, but that most customers don't hear it.
I beg to differ: most customers do not walk straight to a 700 quid instrument. I understand what he's saying, but why take the risk on such an instrument?
Anyway, they must have done something, coz when I returned recently, it had gone.

Many years plus moons ago, I was ready to buy a 3,000 quid black Les Paul Custom (sorry, but that is what they cost here). Shop keeper had it hung from a thread in the shop window facing the South-West - where the sun starts baking said LP from 9 AM to late in the evening.
No thank you. It's a dog by now.

Same as above: how can I judge the amp and cab when it's facing sideways, in close contact with other stuff in the shop, whilst shop keeper could easily have turned it 90 degrees? The amp/cab probably is not a dog, but should I buy it virtually unheard?

The list goes on.


best,
bert

[molan]

[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1375093623' post='2156529']
I think the worst thing a shop can do is put you through some little practice amp when you're trying out an instrument. Surely you want it to sound as good as it can when the prospective customer is making up his or her mind? Case in point - was in Glasgow a couple of weeks back. Tried a bass in one shop and was put through an Orange crush combo which was buried behind another amp (?). Tried a bass in another shop and was put through a Mark Bass combo. From which shop do you think I bought the bass?

Not the first time a shop has lost a sale from me because they made the bass I am trying sound merely functional. I try not to take it personally either, but there's a degree of feeling like I'm not being taken seriously in all this.
[/quote]

Our standard first question is to ask the customer what he usually uses and then try and find the closest thing from our stock. It's not always easy to match up but we always try to get as close as possible.

If someone calls in advance we'd probably recommend bringing their own amp along (unless it's a monster!).

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1375058905' post='2156311']
In this weather it's near impossible to keep an entire showroom's worth of stock in tune, with perfect action and with great intonation.

Believe me, I've tried!
[/quote]

I went into a large guitar shop in a major northern british city and tried out about 10 different jazz basses. One of them had such a bad bow in the neck I felt I needed to tell the staff as I was leaving - like major bow, checking the fretboard is still attatched level.
Anyway he rolled his eyes and told me that the shop is nicely heated when open - but cools down a lot at night. The fluxuations in temprature being so great they apparently had the frets lifting on a load of custome shop guitars..... beggers belief why he told me that!

[martin8708]

I was considering taking my new acoustic guitar to Chandlers for a set up , so this thread has planted a small seed of doubt.
I normally set up my basses and electric guitars myself , but I was going to splurge on a pro set up as the nut and saddle needs adjusting ,and acoustic guitars are ( for me ) more difficult to adjust .
There is no-one on the Island I would trust , not aware of any one in Southampton or Pompey , and Chandlers seemed to have legendary status as guitar techs to the Gods .

Is the new shop still worth the trip for the set - up ?

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1375094045' post='2156536']
Personally I wouldn't condemn a shop based on one reported bad experience.
[/quote]

Here on BC, I often see one shop or another praised to high heaven for its personal customer service when I know i've been let down by the same shop.

Sometimes it's the other way around and a shop is being slagged for being useless when I've had excellent service.

[neepheid]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1375118387' post='2156932']
Our standard first question is to ask the customer what he usually uses and then try and find the closest thing from our stock. It's not always easy to match up but we always try to get as close as possible.

If someone calls in advance we'd probably recommend bringing their own amp along (unless it's a monster!).
[/quote]


That's a level of attention to detail I've yet to encounter, good on ya.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='martin8708' timestamp='1375120135' post='2156954']
I was considering taking my new acoustic guitar to Chandlers for a set up , so this thread has planted a small seed of doubt.
I normally set up my basses and electric guitars myself , but I was going to splurge on a pro set up as the nut and saddle needs adjusting ,and acoustic guitars are ( for me ) more difficult to adjust .
There is no-one on the Island I would trust , not aware of any one in Southampton or Pompey , and Chandlers seemed to have legendary status as guitar techs to the Gods .

Is the new shop still worth the trip for the set - up ?
[/quote]
New shop? What new shop?

Edited July 30, 2013 by BetaFunk

[BetaFunk]

I've bought basses in both of these shops. Chandlers Guitars (Kew) was a shop i'd never been in despite living near to it because i don't play guitar but i saw a used bass advertised, went there and got a very good deal on it. I found them nice people to deal with.
Charlie Chandler's Guitar Experience must have been in Hampton Wick for over ten years now and i bought a really nice bass there this year for a great price so was well pleased with that. I have never used them for repairs as i have someone local who is brilliant for repairs and set-ups but i know a lot of people who take their guitars for repairs and set-ups there and wouldn't go anywhere else.
Roddy Frame was on Robert Elms Radio London show a couple of years ago and said that CCGE in Hampton Wick was his favourite shop in the London area.

[molan]

[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1375133595' post='2157193']
That's a level of attention to detail I've yet to encounter, good on ya.
[/quote]

To be honest it was Alex at The Gallery that first did this for me and I've always remembered it

[woodyratm]

[quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1375093623' post='2156529']
I think the worst thing a shop can do is put you through some little practice amp when you're trying out an instrument. Surely you want it to sound as good as it can when the prospective customer is making up his or her mind? Case in point - was in Glasgow a couple of weeks back. Tried a bass in one shop and was put through an Orange crush combo which was buried behind another amp (?). Tried a bass in another shop and was put through a Mark Bass combo. From which shop do you think I bought the bass?

Not the first time a shop has lost a sale from me because they made the bass I am trying sound merely functional. I try not to take it personally either, but there's a degree of feeling like I'm not being taken seriously in all this.
[/quote]
Which shop did the crappy amp thing? Just so I know where to avoid!

Guitar Guitar in Glasgow were great when I was trying out FX. Asked what bass I played, what amp I played and got testing on equipment which was close.
Almost ended up badly when I almost walked with the bass, head and cab! Would have bankrupt myself

[iceonaboy]

I would always tune up a guitar before playing it. I would not expect it to be tuned, because most shops have loads of guitars hanging. To check every one , every so often would be un feasable in the extreme. I was in guitar guitar in Glasgow a few weeks back and tried a Tele. There was a big ding out of the top, plus I noticed a few other guitars had bad dings and thats all down to heavy handed f***ers playing them. Even the Tele that I dedcided on, when brought home, was noticed heavy scratch plate useage. Much to my chagrin

[iceonaboy]

[quote name='woodyratm' timestamp='1375185703' post='2157740']
Which shop did the crappy amp thing? Just so I know where to avoid!

Guitar Guitar in Glasgow were great when I was trying out FX. Asked what bass I played, what amp I played and got testing on equipment which was close.
Almost ended up badly when I almost walked with the bass, head and cab! Would have bankrupt myself
[/quote]

+ 10 to that, very helpfull staff as are the staff at CC Music

[Musicman20]

This doesn't apply to our specialists, such as Bass Gear/Bass Direct, as they know their equipment etc.

But, one thing that REALLY winds me up is the whole 'laid back semi-amateur musician' image that even some high end guitar/drum/bass shops demonstrate.

It's one thing being in a band, thinking you are going to make it, its another working at a music store, being arrogant and NOT knowing your product, (which happens too often for my liking).

The whole laid back/scruffy in your jeans and band tshirt does not wash me with; I'm expected to be on my game, 100% professional, and exceptionally well mannered at work. If I go into a shop, I expect the staff to do the same.

[ras52]

It was a l-o-n-g time ago, but Chandler's Kew did a superb full service/MOT job on my old Strat, including stoning the frets etc,

[Low End Bee]

Andy the tech does great set ups for me and likes working on basses. Often got a bass back from him and he's done extra, uncharged work that's improved the bass.

It's true that they do have a certain 'old school' way of customer service on their retail side. I've bought the odd expensive thing from them with no problem though.

I can sort of see the point of the OP. Although one mans set up is another mans unplayable. I doubt if silddx and me could comfortably swap basses

[mentalextra]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1375092965' post='2156517']
It depends if a customer has come to try something specific or just wants to browse a large range of instruments.

I was in one day when someone quite literally tried every single instrument in the showroom and at least four different amp and cab combinations. This wasn't a problem (and he spent over £4,000 at the end - ironically on the thing he tried first!) but it's hard to allow for someone wanting to try the entire stock.

The place I help out at goes through the entire stock about 4 times a year to check on set up - that's basic tuning, truss rod adjustment, intonation, electronics testing etc.

There's always random checking as well, especially for movement in the neck - some brands never budge and others move around a bit if there's significant climate change.

Between the three of us in the shop we probably play every bass at least once every couple of weeks.

Even with this we often find a random instrument will have gone significantly out of tune or the neck has moved an the action is too low/high.

Strings sometimes deteriorate with hardly any use whilst others are fine for ages.

Because these things aren't uniform it's tough to always have every instrument just perfect all the time

Of course, then there's the issue of exactly what constitutes 'perfect' - one person's low action can be another's unplayable buzzy horror. We used to try and set everything as low as it would go but have found a lot of people want to dig in more and prefer higher actions. Then we raised a lot of basses and someone proclaimed (publicly on this very forum) that the particular, very expensive, brand he tried weren't all they were made out to be because the action on the one he tried was too high. He didn't ask us to lower it for him, just tried it briefly and then basically slagged the brand off

I guess it's a case of 'some you win, some you lose'
[/quote]

Dealing with the public is always tough whatever you sell I thought that the instrument manufacturers supplied guitars with a useable standard setup out of the box. If I bought a new Fender from a "box shifter" would it be totally unplayable without a few hours with a guitar tech?

How do you see your shop competing with the large "internet box shifters" in the coming years? Most of us pay a high premium using local shops, is it worth it?

I'm not trying to antagonise you, its a serious question

Edited July 30, 2013 by mentalextra

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='mentalextra' timestamp='1375192257' post='2157913']
I thought that the instrument manufacturers supplied guitars with a useable standard setup out of the box. If I bought a new Fender from a "box shifter" would it be totally unplayable without a few hours with a guitar tech?
[/quote]
I bought a Fender Pawn Shop Bass VI from an internet retailer simply because my local Fender dealer couldn't get one for me. It was pretty awful to play so i took it to my local luthier and he set it up for me. It would have been difficult to have played it as it came out of the box.

[molan]

[quote name='mentalextra' timestamp='1375192257' post='2157913']
Dealing with the public is always tough whatever you sell I thought that the instrument manufacturers supplied guitars with a useable standard setup out of the box. If I bought a new Fender from a "box shifter" would it be totally unplayable without a few hours with a guitar tech?

How do you see your shop competing with the large "internet box shifters" in the coming years? Most of us pay a high premium using local shops, is it worth it?

I'm not trying to antagonise you, its a serious question
[/quote]

In general terms you shouldn't find anything that's unplayable out of the box. However, it depends very much on where it's come from and how it was set up in the first place. One of our suppliers sets everything up to a pretty low action and then ships from USA. Their, very strong, recommendation is that we take each bass out of the box and leave it at showroom temperature for 24 hours in its case. Then we open the case and, in god old Spinal Tap fashion, do not touch it or go near it for another 24 hours..

By then it should have started to acclimatise to local temperatures. Of course, this may all be a bit over the top!

We've discovered that most truss rods need some minor adjustment if a brand new instrument has been on a plane. The necks often straighten up and actions become very buzzy. After a few weeks they'll start to settle again and need another minor adjustment.

I'd say if you're comfortable with basic bridge height and truss rod adjustment you'd be OK trying something from an warehouse type dealer. The bigger issue might be that you just get a 'duff' one. We don't sell 'out of the box' Fenders (Custom Shop only) but we do get a lot of used, nearly new, ones and sound quality definitely varies from bass to bass.

Our little place is quite 'bespoke' and we don't really get into price matching battles with online retailers. In fact we currently seem to be cheaper than Thomann on some ranges as they've been slowly raising their prices since DV247 went under/into new ownership. It feels like the pure price platform models may not be working as well as they were. However, this may not be the case with mass brands like Fender.

There will always be people who want the lowest price and are happy to forego customer service but there will also be people who are happy to pay a bit more for a personal service and simple stuff like a fast returns policy, quick response to questions & problems, local luthier repairs and setups etc.

If you'd have asked me 3 years ago I think i would have been more worried but there seems to have been a bit of a shift back towards higher service option retailers in some specialist areas. I don't think this is true of real high volume mass produced items like electronics but certainly it seems that people want to pick up and play the actual instrument they want to buy rather than risk a bland suck it and see policy. . .

[molan]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1375119487' post='2156944']
I went into a large guitar shop in a major northern british city and tried out about 10 different jazz basses. One of them had such a bad bow in the neck I felt I needed to tell the staff as I was leaving - like major bow, checking the fretboard is still attatched level.
Anyway he rolled his eyes and told me that the shop is nicely heated when open - but cools down a lot at night. The fluxuations in temprature being so great they apparently had the frets lifting on a load of custome shop guitars..... beggers belief why he told me that!
[/quote]

We try to keep temps as constant as possible but it's a tricky business. Loosely speaking we use minimal heat, and from small portable rads only, in the winter and just airflow without air-con in the summer. This kinda works but things still move around. It's usually spring and autumn when things are most noticeable though.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1375349947' post='2160035']
We try to keep temps as constant as possible but it's a tricky business. Loosely speaking we use minimal heat, and from small portable rads only, in the winter and just airflow without air-con in the summer. This kinda works but things still move around. It's usually spring and autumn when things are most noticeable though.
[/quote] I think you work in a bit of a higher end music shop than the one I'm talking about

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1375037987' post='2156047']
Isn't this standard practice for guitar shops?
[/quote]

Yes, I think so. Most shops get their delivery, and either put it on the shelves, or out on display in the store, I think. I also think it's not unusual to have the person or people looking after the shop to not know how to adjust something like the intonation. I don't know anything about this particular shop, and I know bigger shops have in store techs (which really means there's no excuse, let's be honest) but I think a lot of shops don't have a tech.