bassjamm Posted June 10, 2008 Share Posted June 10, 2008 Hi everyone, I just spotted the Warwick Jonas Hellborg range of amps and cabs...just wondered whether or not any of you had used any of this stuff? The 2x12 looks nice, but quite poor power!!! Jam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodl2005 Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 What Do U mean "poor Power" low sensitivity... as in 103dB @ 1w/1m etc..??? (U can probly tell I'm NO tech!!) I'm Also interested in them. Only seen them in mags & online... never heard or heard of ppl using them-except Mr Hellborg ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassjamm Posted June 11, 2008 Author Share Posted June 11, 2008 [quote name='rodl2005' post='216558' date='Jun 11 2008, 04:02 AM']What Do U mean "poor Power" low sensitivity... as in 103dB @ 1w/1m etc..??? (U can probly tell I'm NO tech!!) I'm Also interested in them. Only seen them in mags & online... never heard or heard of ppl using them-except Mr Hellborg ![/quote] Sorry, by that i meant wattage...the 2x12 is only 200 watts!!! How rude!!! And it's a 4 ohm cab! I see that the Bass Merchant in Essex is selling them!!! They certainly look mean, that's for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umph Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 [quote name='bassjamm' post='216640' date='Jun 11 2008, 09:33 AM']Sorry, by that i meant wattage...the 2x12 is only 200 watts!!! How rude!!! And it's a 4 ohm cab! I see that the Bass Merchant in Essex is selling them!!! They certainly look mean, that's for sure![/quote] at 103dB @ 1w/1m you only need that much power ;< unless your intending to kill children with your cab Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 Are'nt they really expensive, I haven't looked to be honest, I'm only going by what I've read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 The cost is more than a big turn off factor... ...as is the weight... ...oh...and did I mention the price?? Lot of money for what it is I reckon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassjamm Posted June 11, 2008 Author Share Posted June 11, 2008 I don't understand all of that technical jargan...give me it in English boys Yeah, i know they're pricey! But then again, so are the Berg cabs i'm looking at, as well as the Epifani, and pretty much all the others...barr the Dr Bass 2460 a steal of a price!!! Anyway, the Hellborg cabs look to be quite mean i reckon! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 What kind of music do you play and are you going to be relying on the Hellborg backline to be your FOH sound or will they be stage monitors with PA taking a line from your preamp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassjamm Posted June 11, 2008 Author Share Posted June 11, 2008 [quote name='warwickhunt' post='216714' date='Jun 11 2008, 11:10 AM']What kind of music do you play and are you going to be relying on the Hellborg backline to be your FOH sound or will they be stage monitors with PA taking a line from your preamp?[/quote] I'm mostly do Funk/Jazz gigs, not jazz as in 4 string quartet, like jazz funk, full on stuff! I'm playing in bars, to venues, clubs, and the occasional festival, where i'll D.I. So i'm going to be relying on my backline for my FOH sound for most of the gigs i do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 There are some demo videos on Youtube I've seen. The design intent seems to be to recreate a system that has a very full dynamic range - something that Hellborg has always pursued in his signature gear since getting into acoustic bass guitars. The marketing seems to be promoting something akin to a hi-fi system. Hmmm. Personally, I don't think I need that level of dynamic range in my music and certainly find it difficult to understand where my money would be going if I bought the amp system. The stage is a very crude listening environment, I think that all the refinements on offer here would probably be completely lost unless I was doing a solo acoustic gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='216758' date='Jun 11 2008, 12:13 PM']There are some demo videos on Youtube I've seen. The design intent seems to be to recreate a system that has a very full dynamic range - something that Hellborg has always pursued in his signature gear since getting into acoustic bass guitars. The marketing seems to be promoting something akin to a hi-fi system. Hmmm. Personally, I don't think I need that level of dynamic range in my music and certainly find it difficult to understand where my money would be going if I bought the amp system. The stage is a very crude listening environment, I think that all the refinements on offer here would probably be completely lost unless I was doing a solo acoustic gig.[/quote] +1 That's why I asked about musical styles. I'm not saying that the Hellborg system couldn't do rock/funk/etc but it was the design intent to get all of the nuances out of Hellborgs playing/technique/instrument. Bumping an' grinding away with a pub band probably wouldn't get you much benefit from all of that exquisite design and quality components. An amp cab retailing at 50% of the price (or less) would probably achieve about the same desired affect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassjamm Posted June 11, 2008 Author Share Posted June 11, 2008 [quote name='Crazykiwi' post='216758' date='Jun 11 2008, 12:13 PM']The stage is a very crude listening environment, I think that all the refinements on offer here would probably be completely lost unless I was doing a solo acousitic gig.[/quote] There we have...the future of the bass guitar Hehe...totally understand what you're saying there mate!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 Review in this month BGM - Preamp/Power Amp/2 Cabs = four and a half grand! That buys a lot of Bergantino's! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 [quote name='bass_ferret' post='216810' date='Jun 11 2008, 01:05 PM']Review in this month BGM - Preamp/Power Amp/2 Cabs = four and a half grand! That buys a lot of Bergantino's![/quote] ...not to mention the hassle from the other half. Not that I have that problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul, the Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 I had seen some vids for his gear on Youtube. I couldn't understand the power/impedance, myself, but I'm sure he's got his reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 Mr Hellborg himself personally demonstrated them and his Warwick sig bass for me! We spent a long while cranking his system up and having lots of fun with it. It is very loud!! It's a very clean and noiseless system. There seemed to be lots of slam on tap, but, as it was a very large room, I didnt get to feel the low end woof that I would have liked to have. That said.. It's a great sounding set up. I think the big 2x15 cab has me very interested. Would love to see what a couple of those could do... other than break my back! - Jonas was a very patient and friendly chap on the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chopthebass Posted June 11, 2008 Share Posted June 11, 2008 I heard this gear for the first time at the London Guitar Show last year, and I thought it sounded pretty average. It looks like hi-fi gear and I was expecting a lot, but it just didn't deliver. Very poor bottom IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassjamm Posted June 11, 2008 Author Share Posted June 11, 2008 It's all very interesting stuff!!! I think i'd try it out if given the chance, but by the sounds of it, it's not worth going out of my way for! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted June 12, 2008 Share Posted June 12, 2008 Actually if you look on the Thomman website, the 2x12 is actually very reasonably priced, it certainly compares well with Bergantino and Epifani. [url="http://www.thomann.de/gb/warwick_jh_hc_212_hellborg_hi_cab.htm"]http://www.thomann.de/gb/warwick_jh_hc_212...borg_hi_cab.htm[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassjamm Posted June 12, 2008 Author Share Posted June 12, 2008 [quote name='6stringbassist' post='218047' date='Jun 13 2008, 12:44 AM']Actually if you look on the Thomman website, the 2x12 is actually very reasonably priced, it certainly compares well with Bergantino and Epifani. [url="http://www.thomann.de/gb/warwick_jh_hc_212_hellborg_hi_cab.htm"]http://www.thomann.de/gb/warwick_jh_hc_212...borg_hi_cab.htm[/url][/quote] I think it's more a question of power though...200 watts @ 4 ohms. I think that's quite poor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 Erm I hadn't noticed that, it doesn't seem very good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted June 13, 2008 Share Posted June 13, 2008 [quote name='bassjamm' post='218051' date='Jun 13 2008, 12:54 AM']I think it's more a question of power though...200 watts @ 4 ohms. I think that's quite poor![/quote] But does it matter? I doubt it. The limiting factor in power handling for bass cabs is not the thermally limited power handling but the excursion limited power handling. That 200W number is the thermally limited power handling. Unfortunately no manufacturers quote the excursion limited power handling but rest assured that it is FAR less than the thermally limited figure (Acme are a unique exception to this). For a 1000W rated neo 4x10" you're probably looking at 300W excursion limited and for a 500W rated neo 2x12" you're looking at 225W excursion limited. All that 500-1000W figure does is sell cabs, it doesn't actually make any difference in the real world. Factor in the high sensitivity of this 2x12" design and the power handling becomes even less relevant. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIM Basses Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 (edited) That told you Jaime! I Love you Alex Edited June 14, 2008 by RIM Basses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassjamm Posted June 14, 2008 Author Share Posted June 14, 2008 [quote name='alexclaber' post='218307' date='Jun 13 2008, 01:53 PM']But does it matter? I doubt it. The limiting factor in power handling for bass cabs is not the thermally limited power handling but the excursion limited power handling. That 200W number is the thermally limited power handling. Unfortunately no manufacturers quote the excursion limited power handling but rest assured that it is FAR less than the thermally limited figure (Acme are a unique exception to this). For a 1000W rated neo 4x10" you're probably looking at 300W excursion limited and for a 500W rated neo 2x12" you're looking at 225W excursion limited. All that 500-1000W figure does is sell cabs, it doesn't actually make any difference in the real world. Factor in the high sensitivity of this 2x12" design and the power handling becomes even less relevant. Alex[/quote] And when translated into English that means...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIM Basses Posted June 14, 2008 Share Posted June 14, 2008 Alex is the man when it comes to FreQ's , I always smile when he talks to me about cabs and power stuff. To me if it sounds good Im happy. We had a good time teching out the 2460 against the El Whappo Jr, in the end the El Whappo had a slightly low bottom end on a flat setting of the Tfunk. But at 3 times the price Im sure we can just dial in abit more bottom on the 2460 right? Cheers, Robbie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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