Expensive Bass .. Cheap Packaging

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1375736848' post='2165065']
Thanks. I'd love that gold 5er!

How much are they normally? Any comments on how good they are yet?
[/quote]

This MiK appears to have been discontinued. The Warwick web site only shows the Rockbass and MiG versions. According to Thomann the original price was approximately £1600.

Edited August 5, 2013 by BigRedX

[Telebass]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1375733963' post='2165011']


But the polystyrene slabs were better protection than the polythene bag the OPs Warwick came in, which was my point.
You can package something all you want but you can't counteract the actions of an idiot courier.
Telebass' new Bareface cab turned up with a hole right through the side of it from a forklift fork I seem to remember.
Sometimes a reinforced steel case won't be enough.
[/quote]
Still shuddering remembering that!

[4 Strings]

[quote name='Maude' timestamp='1375733963' post='2165011']
But the polystyrene slabs were better protection than the polythene bag the OPs Warwick came in, which was my point.
You can package something all you want but you can't counteract the actions of an idiot courier.
Telebass' new Bareface cab turned up with a hole right through the side of it from a forklift fork I seem to remember.
Sometimes a reinforced steel case won't be enough.
[/quote]

Wonder who ended up copping the cost of that?

[Musicman20]

These sounds amazing. Totally off topic...sorry. Get some pics of the basses up!

[mart]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1375740226' post='2165138']
This MiK appears to have been discontinued. The Warwick web site only shows the Rockbass and MiG versions. According to Thomann the original price was approximately £1600.
[/quote]
Yes, the MiK version is discontinued, and the Chinese (Rockbass) version is slab, not an archtop. As soon as I heard that I was hunting down a reasonably priced Korean fretless. They were always rare, but were going for £1500ish until quite recently. In fact I remember just 4/5 months ago seeing one for about 1500 euros and thinking it was a bargain compared with the other prices I'd seen.

Edited August 6, 2013 by mart

[BigRedX]

Well my 5-string Star Bass arrived today.

Granted that the Warwick branded cardboard box is the bare minimum, but for shipping the whole thing was encased in a very heavy duty Thomann shipping box and packed with air-filled bags. The bass itself has arrived in perfect condition.

On the other hand it only just fits into my spare gig bag - which offers the minimum acceptable level of protection - and the only hard case that that is big enough is the massive semi-flight case for my Overwater Original.

Anyone know of a good quality gig bag which is comfortable to wear that will fit this bass?

[mart]

Er, we've already had a thread trying to track-down a case/bag for these buggers. There is an official Warwick one, but it seems only one or two German/Swiss shops have it in stock (and not Thomann).

I'd expect the Starbass to be very similar proportions to the Epiphone Jack Casady bass, so the hardcase they sell would probably do for the Warwick.

And there's an Ibanez (Artcore?) hollowbody bass that comes with a gigbag, so if you could get that bag separately it might do, but I haven't managed to track down a supply of the bag, except with a free bass inside!

Meanwhile, I've snagged a Ritter bag on here which looked like it might fit, but I'll only know whether it actually fits the bass when it arrives.

Mind you, I'm assuming the 5-string Starbass has the same size body as the 4-string. What's the width on the 5er? The 4-string is 39.5cm across at its widest.

[BigRedX]

Body of the 5-string seems to be the same width as yours. I'm only really after a well-padded gig bag as the flight case that fits the Overwater will do in those situations when I need something more heavy duty.

Let me know how you get on with the Ritter and which one it is if it fits. I am somewhat reluctant to get another Ritter bag after the last one I had the straps all but disintegrated after about a year of use.

[mart]

So what's the string spacing on the 5 like? And does it have a nut that is the correct width for the neck? (unlike on my 4-string, that has almost 1mm either side of the nut!)

I'll report back on the Ritter once it arrives. But it sounds like the official Warwick gigbag might be the best for you; it's got a fair bit of padding, and it looks reasonably well built. (I don't have the Starbass one, but I have two other bags from the same range). The catalogue number is RB20631 if you can find a dealer.

[BigRedX]

Nut appears to be the correct width for the neck. String spacing is 16.5mm between string centres at the bridge and 37mm between the string centres of the B and G strings at the nut. It's a slightly tighter string spacing compared with my Gus and Overwater basses but not as tight at the nut as the Yamaha. TBH until I just measured it I hadn't really noticed that the strings were a bit closer together than what I am used to. I'm fairly tolerant of things like this and it's only very wide spacings of 19mm plus that feel weird.

Edited August 7, 2013 by BigRedX

[mart]

Interesting. At the nut I've got 30mm between E and G, so very slightly wider spacing than yours. And at the bridge it's almost 20mm between strings, although I see that the E and G saddles have been nudged over as far apart as possible, so I think I could get it down to almost 18mm spacing by adusting those to the other extreme. But I'm actually happy with it as it is, and it suits my finger-style playing.

[swanbrook]

One the things I used to love about musicman was the hard case, it was rock solid. I spent €3600 on a ltd about 3 years ago and it came in what could only be described as a cheap copy of the original case. It's flimsy, doesn't close right the clasps feel like they will snap off in your hand. It's not strong enough to go in the back of a van so why bother with it. If its only ment for light use then what's the point of it, surely a hard case is ment for protection.

[yorks5stringer]

Oh crap. Got an attack of GAS last night and just pulled the trigger on a Gold 5er this morning. Still if it does not suit, it can always go back to Thomann. I may be having a fire sale soon, anyone want a Stagg EUB, Godin A5 and Squier VM 5?!

[BassTractor]

[quote name='swanbrook' timestamp='1375947511' post='2167670']
One the things I used to love about musicman was the hard case, it was rock solid. I spent €3600 on a ltd about 3 years ago and it came in what could only be described as a cheap copy of the original case. It's flimsy, doesn't close right the clasps feel like they will snap off in your hand. It's not strong enough to go in the back of a van so why bother with it. If its only ment for light use then what's the point of it, surely a hard case is ment for protection.
[/quote]

Do you mean you spent theat money on an LTD bass or on a Lim.Ed. Music Man?
If the latter, I mean especially if the latter, then I concur with the utmost vehemence.

I received a 2006/2007 Lim.Ed. Bongo that had cost near € 3,000, and it arrived with the volume knob almost broken off. Why? Simples: the floppy ABS or PP lid allowed the bass to travel through the case during transit, and at one point during the travel, the whole weight of the bass must have rested on the volume pot shaft, bending the shaft beyond the point where bending back was a viable option.

To compare:
When I received my £170 Hohner, it was inside a plastic bag inside a currogated board box, and obviously that box would not protect it against heavy forces, but as long as the box was undamaged, it wouldn't harm the bass. So if I am to transport my Bongo and my cricket bat in my car, the corrugated board Hohner box actually functions better that the posh MM case when I suddenly have to brake - or other similar impacts.


The MM case IMHO was the culprit itself.

Annoyed, yes. Very much so.


best,
bert

Edited August 13, 2013 by BassTractor

[molan]

As some of you may know, I help out from time to time in a bass store and we see lots and lots of basses coming in all sorts of packaging and with a huge variance in quality of gig bag and hard cases.

However, the single common factor amongst all of them is that not one has ever arrived with any damage

I hear horror stories from time to time but we've never experienced a single shipping issue because of poor packing. Admittedly we tend to operate at the higher end of the market but we've also bought in quite a few instruments at cheaper price points.

There's a real variance in what people are looking for in terms of cases and gig bags. Some are really pleased with a decent fitted hard case whilst others (generally those who gig a lot) take one look at a hard case and say it'll go straight in the loft and that they'll be using a high end gig bag instead.

Meanwhile others see something in a great gig bag and express disappointment because there wasn't a hard case included in the price

We can sometimes swap things around but a lot of stuff is branded and/or unique to the manufacturer so it's often difficult.

A quick summary of what we get and people's reactions are:

Fodera - all new basses over £4K - teardrop Fodera branded hard case - people like the unique case but don't often use them.

Ritter - also £4K+ - G&G type hard case without brand logo (as used by Fender for CS and Vintage models) - generally like and more likely to be used as regular transport

Alleva Coppolo - again over £4K - usually come in a top quality Protec Contego gig bag - everyone likes these but some people wish they were bespoke models and branded. Now and then people wish they had a typical Fender style hard case.

Laurus - circa £4K - slightly odd shaped bespoke gig bag designed to really fit the bass well - everyone does a double take when they first see the case but appreciate that it's a good piece of design to fit the instrument

F Bass - circa £2.5K and up - bespoke branded gig bag - generally liked but not as strong or versatile as Protec or a Mono - generally well liked

Fender Custom Shop - start at £2K but can rise rapidly - Fender branded G&G type classic hard case, sometimes with colour options like tweed or brown, usually nice bright plush lining - people like these, especially the tweed and brown options and they fit the CS brand really well. Another one for the loft storage though - sometimes because the case is seen as an investment in the future value if they come to sell the bass

Wood & Tronics - around £2K - Fairly basic Warwick Rockbag soft/hard case (like a Sadowsky) - people ask why the case has a Warwick logo but usually like them, some comments about the fact that they are the cheapest of this type of design

Carvin - starting at around £1K and up to £2K - Carvin branded Fender type hard case - with this brand everyone seems really impressed that they come with a nice hard case. possibly because the basses are perceived to be a 'value' brand and people assume they will only get a gig bag.

Godin - around £800 - bespoke branded gig bag, not heavy protection but obviously unique because of design/colour - most people expect to get something like this on a sub £1K bass. Never really hear negative or positive comments, just basic acceptance.

Obviously we get all sorts of used and PX instruments in as well but way too many to try and list out what they all come with! Happy to give a view on any (and more depth on any of the above) if anyone wants to know anything

[mart]

Wow, thanks Molan for a lot of interesting data!

[Jellyfish]

I've seen quite a range of packaging from my few months being here at a music shop but the way I see it is, if a courier wants to damage your package, he can. No amount of packaging below a flight case is going to stop that.

I'd be a lot more concerned with how much space there is for the instrument itself to move around in the box.

[mart]

[quote name='Jellyfish' timestamp='1375969827' post='2168063']
I've seen quite a range of packaging from my few months being here at a music shop but the way I see it is, if a courier wants to damage your package, he can. No amount of packaging below a flight case is going to stop that.

I'd be a lot more concerned with how much space there is for the instrument itself to move around in the box.
[/quote]
Yes, I think that's definitely true. And the instrument moving around within the box is definitely an issue. I remember buying my first expensive new Warwick, and it came in a flight case, which had a dent in it. But it was a dent outwards - so the instrument had clearly moved around enough to actually push the case out. It is a heavy lump of a bass, but still ... !

[Musicman20]

I think getting a hardcase is essential for a bass over £1000. Anything over £2k and I'd expect something very high end and fancy.

The best hard cases are the new Fender hardcases and the EBMM ones.

The best soft cases are the Mono cases.

[Maude]

[quote name='yorks5stringer' timestamp='1375950699' post='2167706']
I may be having a fire sale soon, anyone want a Stagg EUB, Godin A5 and Squier VM 5?!
[/quote]


Yes all of them, but I only have one half of a Twix and the green Tic Tacs from a carton of orange and lime ones to offer you ................. let me know

[bagsieblue]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1375987062' post='2168364']
I think getting a hardcase is essential for a bass over £1000. Anything over £2k and I'd expect something very high end and fancy.

[/quote]

I think that is a fair comment.

It also goes someway to showing how much the manufacturer 'values' the bass.

[molan]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1375987062' post='2168364']
I think getting a hardcase is essential for a bass over £1000. Anything over £2k and I'd expect something very high end and fancy.

The best hard cases are the new Fender hardcases and the EBMM ones.

The best soft cases are the Mono cases.
[/quote]

I have a loft full of hard cases - I really don't like them and have no use for them at all.

I'd much rather have a quality gig bag.

The only hard case I have any interest in is the original '64 Fender that came with my P. It's knackered and falling to pieces but looks quit cool

Edited August 8, 2013 by molan

[EssentialTension]

When I bought a Lakland bass directly from Lakland in Chicago, I was told by them that a hardcase was unnecessary and nor would they bother with insurance because damage was so rare, even on transatlantic flights.

The bass, in soft case and cardboard box, arrived undamaged.

[Jellyfish]

[quote name='mart' timestamp='1375974402' post='2168159']
Yes, I think that's definitely true. And the instrument moving around within the box is definitely an issue. I remember buying my first expensive new Warwick, and it came in a flight case, which had a dent in it. But it was a dent outwards - so the instrument had clearly moved around enough to actually push the case out. It is a heavy lump of a bass, but still ... !
[/quote]

Actually push the case out? Holy moly!

[Jellyfish]

[quote name='bagsieblue' timestamp='1375999138' post='2168553']
I think that is a fair comment.

It also goes someway to showing how much the manufacturer 'values' the bass.
[/quote]

Having them package it in a soft-case of their choosing also shows how much knowledge they have about how susceptible their instruments are to damage if package properly. In all honesty, I'd prefer my gear in a soft-case, or no case at all, as long as it arrived undamaged. I don't want to pay extra for a hard-case I didn't choose. Not only that, but as I stated before, there isn't a fine line between your bass getting damaged in transit and it arriving safely. If the courier does something that could damage your bass while it's in a soft case, it would probably damage whilst in a hard-case too. Not always, but in most situations.