Aguilar db750 vs EBS Fafner

[Denzel]

Hi all,

Looking for your opinions on which head to go for.

Both second hand options; db750 or Fafner blue stripe. Will decide on cabs after getting the head but suggestions are welcome!

I have owned (and sold last year to help finance my woodwork business) an EBS Fafner grey stripe with 2 210 evolution cabs (no tweeter control) Which I owned for 10 years. Loved the sound and tone variety but a bit low end shy. Maybe it was the cabs. Sometimes would have liked to turn the tweeters off as well.

The grey stripe was a little unreliable. All the classic problems I have read from other owners of early models. Power switch failure / scratchy pots.

My playing is pretty varied. Influences include but not limited to; Robbie Shakespeare, Paul Jackson, Pino Paladino, Larry Graham, George Porter, Stuart Zender . . . It could go on and on. Mostly Jazz Funk & Dub Reggae.

My weapon of choice is a Warwick Streamer Stage II 4.

So very familiar with the Fafner, Heard the 750s smooth powerful tone but not with a Warwick.

Any input would be much appreciated.

D

[EBS_freak]

Both great heads... the 750 is a monster however, the Fafner does the top end bright that the Aggie doesn't. Whether that is your thing or not is a different matter. You can take away the brightness of the Fafner but you can't add that to the Aggie. Conversely, the Aggie has a more old school coloured feel about it which is polar opposite to the bright, clean, almost neutral hifi sound of the Fafner.

[thodrik]

I would echo EBS_freak's comments. Both are great heads. I can't speak for the older Fafner, but I have had a blue stripe Fafner for about 5 years or so and have not had any reliability issues whatsoever.

[Graham]

I tried both of these amongstsome others when I was in the market for a new amp a few years ago, I ended up buying the Fafner, came close to getting the DB750 though. At the time I needed the clearer tone of the EBS, but would still choose it over an Aguilar again.

The DB750 was a very good amp, but a little too much of a one-trick pony - very clean, tubey sound (reminscent of a Mesa 400+) that doesn't really break up. It's a very good sound, but it doesn't quite suit me, whereas with the EBS filters, the Fafner gives you a lot of tone-shaping potential so sounds great in a lot of different situations.

[JTUK]

The 750 is brilliant right out of the box.... but not suited to chasing a sound.
In this regard it is like the 400 and SVT...but better than both, IMO.

If your basses sound good, the 750 will work but if you want a powerful EQ stage, then look elsewhere.
The 750 is not complicated sound-wise but then it doesn't need to be, IMO

[molan]

For me it's the Aguilar every day.

Fafner is big and powerful but doesn't have the 'musicality' of the Aggie.

Deep, rich, warm and full of natural tone that I think the EBS struggles to replicate. Notes just seem to bloom and fill out as you're playing.

The joy of the Aggie is that you just turn it on, plug in your bass and play. Maybe just minor tweaking but no need to spend hours fiddling with controls

[PauBass]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1376085061' post='2169696']
For me it's the Aguilar every day.

Fafner is big and powerful but doesn't have the 'musicality' of the Aggie.

Deep, rich, warm and full of natural tone that I think the EBS struggles to replicate. Notes just seem to bloom and fill out as you're playing.

The joy of the Aggie is that you just turn it on, plug in your bass and play. Maybe just minor tweaking but no need to spend hours fiddling with controls
[/quote]

I have onwed both amps I completely agree with what Molan has said!
For me it's also the DB750 without a doubt.

Edited August 9, 2013 by PauBass

[molan]

Should also add that the 750 (or 751) partners the DB410 or GS410 really, really well.

In fact the best live bass sound I've ever heard was a DB750 through a pair of GS410's as used by Paul Turner

[Platypus]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1376085061' post='2169696']
For me it's the Aguilar every day.

Fafner is big and powerful but doesn't have the 'musicality' of the Aggie.

Deep, rich, warm and full of natural tone that I think the EBS struggles to replicate. Notes just seem to bloom and fill out as you're playing.

The joy of the Aggie is that you just turn it on, plug in your bass and play. Maybe just minor tweaking but no need to spend hours fiddling with controls
[/quote]

Was meaning to ask you how you were getting on with rig!

[Denzel]

Thanks for all your input people. This is really useful info but I still can't decide!

There are elements of both I really like. I'd love an amp/cab combination that will do subtle clarity at lower levels up to really punch you in the guts at higher volume while still maintaining complete composure. I have no objections to trying to liquidise the crowds internal organs. In fact I demand it! haha.

I may have to buy both heads and sell one on if I survive the next three months eating food I find on the street. A straight-up shootout in practice and gig situations would be ideal. Trouble is I have no cabs either yet. I do like having both my kidneys. . .

Must admit I do like the idea of the Ag750 with a 4ohm GS410. That cab goes down to 40Hz. My old ebs set started to roll off at about 70hz-100hz. Also noticed the 750 has a power amp input so another pre for tone shaping is not out of the question if I felt there was something lacking. To be honest the Stage II is such a tone chameleon I'm not sure it needs tons of eq. I always played with the Fafner's eq settings because eq'd flat it sounded pretty thin.

As I type this I sway towards the 750 but the EBS has been a good friend and I know it well. Thinking about it I always rolled back the top end of the Fafner and still wanted to turn the tweeters off on the cabs for dub stuff. If the 750 has more low end presence, less treble presence and more headroom. . .that may be it for me.

[chris_b]

Time for a change....... because you can.

[molan]

[quote name='Platypus' timestamp='1376091445' post='2169765']


Was meaning to ask you how you were getting on with rig!
[/quote]

I really like it a lot - it's just a question of whether I can justify having two rigs as it's not really suited to home practice and small rehearsals

[Denzel]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1376155672' post='2170365']


I really like it a lot - it's just a question of whether I can justify having two rigs as it's not really suited to home practice and small rehearsals
[/quote]

[Denzel]

Molan,

Can the 750 not do a moderate volume rehearsal or practice at low volume?? Is it drowning everyone out?

I can deal with a headphone amp for personal practice but not up for having two heads long term really.

On viewing your gear lineup it looks like you have two of everything!!

Edited August 10, 2013 by Denzel

[molan]

[quote name='Denzel' timestamp='1376157834' post='2170400']
Molan,

Can the 750 not do a moderate volume rehearsal or practice at low volume?? Is it drowning everyone out?

I can deal with a headphone amp for personal practice but not up for having two heads long term really.

On viewing your gear lineup it looks like you have two of everything!!
[/quote]

It's fine at medium/low volume but the fan is very noisy for home use (or studio if you were to use am ambient mic's).

I do have a habit of doubling up on things, maybe I need both a 750 and a 751, lol

[JTUK]

I don't find it practical for smaller pubs.... it makes the drummer sick........plus it is as heavy as hell.
I run a 550-B for those gigs, but despite all that, it is a must have amp, IMO.

It just has sheer beans in the sound.. the bass does everything else, the amp just AMPS it.

[Sandmann]

the db750 will sound perfect with your active warwick. i love it with active basses but sometime think it lacks some eq-possibilities with passive basses. the fafner has all the sounds but the power stage i a different league to the db750.

if you are not sure which of these two amps is perfect for you than you might should consider the fafner II. it has all the tone possibilities of the fafner and than some and the power and oooomph of the db750. maybe a little too much knobs but for me it is the perfect bass amp.

sandmann

[Denzel]

Sandmann, thanks for you input.

I tend to agree with you on the Fafner II. Too much going on. I'm never going to use that overdrive channel either. Plus used ones are rare as cats with three ears.

If I had the cheddar for a new Fafner II. It would go on the Aguilar 751 with 10 year warranty. . . Takes fish knife to kidney. . .

[Denzel]

Sandmann, thanks for you input.

I tend to agree with you on the Fafner II. Too much going on. I'm never going to use that overdrive channel either. Plus used ones are rare as cats with three ears.

If I had the cheddar for a new Fafner II. It would go on the Aguilar 751 with 10 year warranty. . . Takes fish knife to kidney. . .

[Denzel]

Well I thought I would just thank you kind people for your input on my amp dilemma. I came very close to buying a mint Gold Anniversary Edition Fafner found while trawling the net.

After some sleepless nights and very helpful input from you lot I dropped my money on a 750. Now on to loosing sleep over cabs!

If anyone is looking for a mint Limited edition Fafner (Only 50 ever made) get in touch and I will pass the guys info on. A friendly genuine seller and a gorgeous amp. Feel bad for not going through with the purchase. Ahh well. I'm sure someone here will fall in love with it when they see it.

[JTUK]

The DB cabs work very very well... as you'd expect
I use 2xDB210 at 4 ohms but I would like to get a DB410 I could run underneath at 2 ohms
for a large stage. I think the power and oomph from a 750 is close to running the 700w 2xDB210
pretty close to a limit but of course, most of the time you will not need that volume.
It depends how careful you can be with your on stage monitoring.

They say the GS cabs are great with the amp as well... but I prefer the DB cabs.

If only Aguilar made a DB610....????? maybe the Berg NV610 is a good bet as well.

[Denzel]

JTUK,

I'm gonna have to try out as many cabs as I can before I commit. DBs, GSs and Berg are on the list for sure. Didn't that Berg NV610 get discontinued?? To be honest I'd probably give making one of those NV610 style cabs a go rather than buying one (I'm a joiner by trade). They are very simple designs. 610s in a sealed enclosure sharing the same air space, some decent bracing, wadding and no tweeter or crossover! Can't get much more simple. I'm sure a lot of R&D went into driver selection and enclosure air space though. hmmm.

There's so much choice in bass cabs now! 12's have really taken off in a major way since I last bought a rig. Never played through 12s always 10s and on occasion 15s. There is such a thing as too much choice. I think you guys call it GAS!

[JTUK]

You could advertise here for a NV cab... there are a few around, as they are big cabs.

I don't think the bespoke chassis' are THAT special but I am gagging for a DB610...( they don't bl***** make one ) or maybe I'll bite the bullet and get the DB810...if some came about.

Think I might ask Barrie if he knows of one F/S

[Denzel]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1376330793' post='2172282']
You could advertise here for a NV cab... there are a few around, as they are big cabs.

I don't think the bespoke chassis' are THAT special but I am gagging for a DB610...( they don't bl***** make one ) or maybe I'll bite the bullet and get the DB810...if some came about.

Think I might ask Barrie if he knows of one F/S
[/quote]

I'd have to hear one before buying. Nv610 that is. Never played through a sealed cab before. Obviously you loose some perceived volume compared to a reflex design, like the old ampeg fridge.

Regarding the 810 is there really that much difference between 2x410 and 810 in terms of performance? 810 is such a big cab to lug!

Edited August 12, 2013 by Denzel

[Dread Bass]

Cant really help with the amps but i used to use an EBS classic 410 and replaced it with a Aguilar GS410 and the difference was unbelievable.