Getting More Low End From My Precision

[jonsmith]

I have a P bass (US late 90s I think, all stock except scratch plate) that I bought from someone on here a few years ago. It's nice to play, with a zingy top end which has been great for doing Stranglers tunes & the like. However recently I've noticed that it seems incredibly lacking in real low frequencies compared to my other basses. I mainly use Rickenbackers (sorry everyone, but I love them) with the capacitor that removes bottom end either not present or bypassed. I also use a GL Jazz and a Warwick ProM 5. My fretted Wal also has a thinner tone, but it's strung with RS Funkmasters and is deliberately being used for that particular tone.

To be honest, the P normally gets out the house when I need to stop off for a bit on my travels, as the case will fit in the boot alongside my other gear and thus be out of sight. This has been necessary quite a bit over the past few weeks.

At rehearsal on Monday, one of the guitarists (correctly) asked for more low end & I had to whack the bass on my TC Electronics RH750 right up (with my Ricks this would have been into serious dub/reggae territory). On Monday I was running through an RS210 cab, but last night I found the same thing when running through an Ampeg 8x10 that normally has everyone's trousers flapping.

I'm using the same strings (RS66 Nickels 40-100) on all my basses (except the Wals).

So, can anyone suggest how I get more low end from my Precision (preferably without sacrificing its snarly top end)? Different pick ups perhaps? If so, what would you recommend?

Thanks.

[LukeFRC]

try screwing the pickup down a bit....

[Jack]

What you have to realise here, is that it's not a particularly 'low' low end on the P and that's just that. That passive P humbucker right where it is gives good thump and low-mid push but no real sub lows. Try a different pickup? Maybe a DiMarzio, or an octave pedal set just so. Compressor? None of this changes the real answer though, you're fighting against the tide.

[Lozz196]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1376070629' post='2169410']
try screwing the pickup down a bit....
[/quote]

+1 on this - pickup height can make a great difference - too close gets the aggression, but without the muscle to back it up.

Plus, I don`t know what eq you`re using, but drop some high end, and add some more mids. The TC has both low & high mids if I recall correctly, so push both a bit more. Solo it will probably not be too pleasing, but in the mix it will really bulk it out. Add some of the Tubetone to get the aggression, and a bit of the Spectracomp, and away you go.

Edited August 9, 2013 by Lozz196

[iceonaboy]

+10 to moving the pick up height. I have found a HUGE difference by just a tweak of a screw. I find it strange that you cant find enough low end from a P bass , because they are renowned for their low end. much more so than a GL Jazz, therefore, I surmise that you must alter the pup height in relation to your strings. Get the D+G side lower and raise the A+E, then low is at your disposal. Sorry if this sounds a bit condescending, but I really am struggling to comprehend how a P bass can be not giving enough "bottom"

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='iceonaboy' timestamp='1376071342' post='2169429']
+10 to moving the pick up height. I have found a HUGE difference by just a tweak of a screw. I find it strange that you cant find enough low end from a P bass , because they are renowned for their low end. much more so than a GL Jazz, therefore, I surmise that you must alter the pup height in relation to your strings. Get the D+G side lower and raise the A+E, then low is at your disposal. Sorry if this sounds a bit condescending, but I really am struggling to comprehend how a P bass can be not giving enough "bottom"
[/quote] A P doesn't have as much bass as say the neck pup on jazz. What it has is low mids, which sound like "bass sound" but are actually higher freq - if something about the set up, the amp eq or the cab flattens out this low mid bump then it would sound like it had little bottom end.

[iceonaboy]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1376071722' post='2169443']
A P doesn't have as much bass as say the neck pup on jazz. What it has is low mids, which sound like "bass sound" but are actually higher freq - if something about the set up, the amp eq or the cab flattens out this low mid bump then it would sound like it had little bottom end.
[/quote]

You think so do you? I have 2 Jazzes and 2 P's and the P basses have loads of bottom end, much more so than the J's

[jonsmith]

Not condescending at all, but I can assure you it is lacking in real low end at the moment compared to everything else (including the Jazz). I'll try lowering the pickups as advised & hopefully this will improve things. If not, I'll be back. Thanks for the advice everyone.

[skej21]

[quote name='Jack' timestamp='1376070695' post='2169411']
That passive P humbucker right where it is gives good thump and low-mid push but no real sub lows.
[/quote]

Do you mean the classic p-bass split coil pickup?

To the OP, I found the same issue with my precision before moving it on. Even flats and an out-board preamp couldn't get the sound I was looking for. Maybe something like the MXR Bass octave deluxe pedal using the separate sub-octave very subtly might add that extra depth?

Edited August 9, 2013 by skej21

[4000]

[quote name='jonsmith' timestamp='1376072105' post='2169449']
Not condescending at all, but I can assure you it is lacking in real low end at the moment compared to everything else (including the Jazz). I'll try lowering the pickups as advised & hopefully this will improve things. If not, I'll be back. Thanks for the advice everyone.
[/quote]

Hi Jon,

Good to catch up.

Strangely I've been using a P for the odd thing recently - also for 'away' trips and risky gigs - and I agree (always have) that compared to the Rics it doesn't have real depth in the lows. What is does have is width in the lows. As Jack says, it's all about low mids. The way I look at it is from the perspective of pickup placement. Look where the neck pickup is on a Ric, and then where the P pickup is. I've considered this in the past and I'd say you might want to put a true neck pickup in there, a la Billy Sheehan. That's what I'd do. Or you could look at the John East preamp made specifically for P Basses as a different approach, although it's not cheap. Of course eq might help but then I'm sure you've been through all that.

Slightly worrying to hear that about the Wal (although my first Custom was guilty of it too) as I've just bought a Pro and thin is not the plan!

How do you find the Pro M? Always really liked those when I've tried them in shops.

[MattM]

Ps are inherently middly which works well enough for most things. If you're getting more the tone you need from switching basses, maybe something like a Ray would be a good shout? Active, bucker, never ever been short on bass on one in my experience.

[throwoff]

Longer strap?

[Musicman20]

Yep, more low mids compared to huge low bass with a P bass.

[chris_b]

Did this problem occur recently?

Did the bass ever sound "right" to you?

My guess is that if you are EQing the bass to be "zingy" then, as there is only one tone control, you're going to be moving the sound well away from what bass there is, so it's not surprising you're sounding "bass-lite".

It's one or the other!

[chris_b]

Seems like you're doing the right thing by EQing what you need on the amp.

You just need a Rick preset and a Pbass preset.

[Noisyjon]

Something sounds very wrong here - Is the pickup wired out of phase somewhere/how?
Worth checking the wiring first as it's easy fix if need be.

[bassmachine2112]

Dial back the tone control
Eq will be different try cutting top end on amp and up volume to compensate.
Pick up height as well,mind when you lower it the volume will need to tweaked up a bit.

[jonsmith]

Thanks again for the advice everyone - even those who seemed to disbelieve that the problem could exist . I didn't want to roll the tone on the bass back, as to me this just cuts highs, but still leaves the lows and mids the same. I actually hate the sound of all my basses with the tone dialled back and make a point of having everything full up most of the time. I finally got round to lowering the pickups, which seems to have resulted in a more 'balanced' sound, although I've yet to test it in a band setup.

Good to hear from you again 4000 - like you I'm still of the opinion that the Ricks have more power in the really low frequencies, but hopefully I have a usable sound from the Precision now. Bear in mind my fretted Wal is strung with Funkmasters, which are almost like guitar strings (I was going through my Geddy Lee in a Rush tribute phase at the time). If you string yours with something normal I'm sure it will sound very nice indeed!

Interesting point you raise chris_b, because I hadn't always noticed this problem. The first few gigs I did with the Precision I was going through massive PAs, everything sounded enormous and I could feel the bass on the stage. Even after that, I don't really remember noticing a problem at first. It's been in the past year or so that it's sort of crept up on me.

[wateroftyne]

Try raising the action a bit - let the strings breathe.

[iconic]

Strange that someones posted that a jazz can sound 'bassier'....ive been flipping bass!s all this week and i agree that a solo front pup on a jazz does sound...well...has a warmer bass sound to it.

but i would take a poke under the hood...check wiring and cap' value too.

[dannybuoy]

Rolling the tone control off does actually boost the lows on a standard passive tone control - the Fender American Specials feature a 'greasebucket' tone control that rolls of highs leaving the rest alone. I bought one of these in a wiring harness from KiOgon but ended up preferring the original setup!

[iconic]

[quote name='dannybuoy' timestamp='1376689677' post='2178191']
Rolling the tone control off does actually boost the lows on a standard passive tone control - the Fender American Specials feature a 'greasebucket' tone control that rolls of highs leaving the rest alone. I bought one of these in a wiring harness from KiOgon but ended up preferring the original setup!
[/quote]

tone control on a passive only cuts treble...no bass boost per se...unless ive missed something?

[discreet]

[quote name='iconic' timestamp='1376707102' post='2178331']
tone control on a passive only cuts treble...no bass boost per se...unless ive missed something?
[/quote]

That's what I thought. It's a subtractive control.

[nottswarwick]

In know they have the low mid growl but I'd be wondering if there is something amiss. I've played mine through my studio set up with headphones, and I've not found it lacking in proper low E fundamental frequencies at all

[Grangur]

[quote name='nottswarwick' timestamp='1376722260' post='2178353']
In know they have the low mid growl but I'd be wondering if there is something amiss. I've played mine through my studio set up with headphones, and I've not found it lacking in proper low E fundamental frequencies at all
[/quote]
If you don't mind me asking, do you also play jazz bass as well as the p-bass?
I ask this because I have a jazz, a P-J and a P.
My P is the one with the thinnest tone. I bought it after I found that on the PJ I was loving the P pup. Yet in comparison the P bass wirh Bart pups just doesn't have to lows of the other 2.