August/September Mix Competition - Kit Richardson's You Look So Good Tonight

[Dad3353]

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1376819550' post='2179364']
Just to reiterate, that is NOT all the BVs

I will upload the rest on Monday if I have time at wwork....
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[MiltyG565]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1376830145' post='2179585']

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[Dad3353]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1376830241' post='2179589']

[/quote]

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1376832551' post='2179638']

[/quote]

Alright, if it's an emoticon war you want, let's take this over to Skype!

[Dad3353]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1376833083' post='2179653']
Alright, if it's an emoticon war you want, let's take this over to Skype!
[/quote]

[51m0n]

Right all the BVs are now uploaded!

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/y7rlfncmc2lw0ip/F-WJ8a5Kkw

There are something like 18 or 19 tracks of BVs to download, so not too manyt on this one (seriously, theres 50 tracks of yummy BVs in Russian Dolls, and the result sounds utterly mesmerising).

Knock yourselves out chaps!

Edited August 19, 2013 by 51m0n

[Dad3353]

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1376906988' post='2180521']Right all the BVs are now uploaded!...[/quote]

Excellent; many thanks.

I've just got to the point where I have what I consider to be a 'credible' version, so slotting in these bonus bvs will be an interesting exercise. Nothing but surprises so far, so a few more won't hurt. I've not listened to any one piece of music for so long for many, many years (I've a rather long anecdote concerning Schubert's 9th, but that's for another day...), and each time I come across yet another detail to investigate and appreciate. Once again (can never be too much..!) thanks for the quality of these tracks, from many points of view, and kudos to the good lady herself and her team for firstly producing such material, and secondly for making it available to numpties such as myself. Can I do it justice..? Hmmm... I can try...

[51m0n]

At least in this case you can listen to the artists own final product, since Kit had massive input into the mix and final sound of the track - just follow the link in my sig.

Of course you are encourage to take it in whatever direction you feel like!

[Dad3353]

No, I'm deliberately refraining from being influenced by others (especially by those better at this; that's to say: everyone..!). It'll be my take, warts an' all (...and there [i]will [/i]be warts, I promise...).
I'll hear how it [i]should [/i]sound afterwards, and bitterly regret my own choices...

[Dad3353]

First listen-through of the new bvs.

First reaction: [size=5]Bloody Nora..! [/size]

[51m0n]

Honestly you should Hear just the bvs off Russian Dolls mate

Actually I sense a 'personal remix' coming on

[Dad3353]

Well, for better or worse, that's that. I'm not going to improve on this, not least because my PC is now bordering on 100% occupation, with all those tracks running..! I've rendered, and I'll give it a final listen on the eldest's system, just for good measure. It'll then be presented for inclusion. I've not dared to fiddle about with my metering. I might turn my hand to that once all is done, but I'd prefer a result that's at least workable to the catastrophe that I'm perfectly capable of engendering once I 'take the lid off'.
Once finalised and committed, I'll give the 'official' Kit version a spin, although I may also be tempted to 'bin' the lot if the comparison is too cruel (no, no bets please...).
I'm not equipped for mixing philharmonic orchestras, either.

[ironside1966]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1376953290' post='2181585']
Well, for better or worse, that's that. I'm not going to improve on this, not least because my PC is now bordering on 100% occupation, with all those tracks running..! I've rendered, and I'll give it a final listen on the eldest's system, just for good measure. It'll then be presented for inclusion. I've not dared to fiddle about with my metering. I might turn my hand to that once all is done, but I'd prefer a result that's at least workable to the catastrophe that I'm perfectly capable of engendering once I 'take the lid off'.
Once finalised and committed, I'll give the 'official' Kit version a spin, although I may also be tempted to 'bin' the lot if the comparison is too cruel (no, no bets please...).
I'm not equipped for mixing philharmonic orchestras, either.
[/quote]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Try not to get too down hearted and give it your best shot. there's plenty of time.[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif] [/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif]if you are not used to working on projects this size, try breaking it up into smaller chunks, Work on just one section at a time . Work on the harmonies in sections and then render them to a stereo tracks so instead of having a load of vocal tracks you have three or four stereo harmony stems maybe do the same with the piano, guitar, strings Ect you could bounce the kick and snares to individual tracks. Doing this will take some of the strain off the CPU and make them easer to work with. Remember George Martin only had 4 tracks for most of the Beatles albums. I work in sections and create various views of the mixer for different sections and group them together. I keep a main page for the sub groups and important things like bass and lead Lead Vox.[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif]if you don't think your mix will stand up to others put it up anyway because you may have some good ideas that we all can learn from. No one is here to pull any one apart or pretend they are a mix wizard. it's hard to have an ego because even if you win the majority of people prefer someone else's mix [/font]

[Dad3353]

[quote name='ironside1966' timestamp='1377032112' post='2182586'][font=Arial, sans-serif]Try not to get too down hearted...[/font][/quote]

Good evening, ironside 1966...

Many thanks for your encouraging reply, somewhat undeserved on my part, as I am far from dis-spirited; in fact rather more elated by the results obtained so far from this superb material. I am indeed determined to give this my 'best shot'; to do less would be unfair to the spirit in which these tracks were offered.
On the other hand, your excellent advice and tips are entirely appropriate, and of course very welcome. I have a reasonable knowledge and (limited...) experience of 'hands-on' mixing on physical consoles (indeed, I worked for Trident Studios for a while, in Shepperton, building their consoles...), but Reaper is a whole new environment for me. I'm finding out slowly ([i]very [/i]slowly...) how to do the most basic of things, and your comments come at the most suitable of moments. I'll certainly go round again trying out the approaches suggested, but I'm not sure that they, in themselves, will improve the audio result. The limitations of my equipment are a part of the equation, but only a small part. The weakest link, by far, is my hearing..!. I can no longer discern the subtleties (or even some grossnesses..!), and have to resort to rather heavy-handed guesswork much of the time. 'Pitching' a snare drum in a mix is a tad haphazard, and there's no point in me spending hours over 1 or 2 dbs of compression.
No problem..! As you so rightly point out, the 'winning' of the challenge is the fact of having participated and learned something otherwise ignored (as is illustrated by your very post...). It's less certain how much anyone else will gain from my offering, except maybe as a warning to protect one's hearing early, as later is too late..!
Enough from me; thanks again for the help given; much appreciated.

[51m0n]

This might ehlp you to work out grouping in folders in Reaper - I find this one of the nicest things about Reaper, you can set up sub-mix group busses so fast:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dejEW5YjxbQ

Group your bvs in a folder, get it sounding as good as you can for now, render that folder track and it mutes all the original tracks and gives you a new track with the rendered result in - which frees up your CPU from all the tracks in the folder too!

Do the same with the strings in another group, the drums in another, the keys in another.

In fact you can have folders in folders too, I tend to have very very complex groupings like this (ie a drum folder with a snare folder with a snare top and snare bottom track in etc etc). This makes level control a snap, I can raise the entire snare volume up or down easily, or all the kit or just the overheads etc etc. You can take this a very very long way indeed, but it starts to take a lot of time and effort to set the routing up. For me its worth it, but some people like to work without submixes.

You can select a bunck of tracks and render them without being in a folder too.

[51m0n]

Another way of setting up submixes and aux sends is detailed here:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-oA-B1YzEE

[MiltyG565]

Simon - That's exactly what I want to do in Logic, but as far as I've gotten with the idea is to place things under groups Although my mixer is looking very tidy and organised this month. I have each part of the mixer assigned for different instruments, which all go into one group (Like drums). The worst part is when you decided that maybe only one little track needs to be turned down a little bit, and have to ungroup it, make the adjustment and regroup it.

[Dad3353]

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1377076886' post='2182923']...You can select a bunck of tracks and render them without being in a folder too.
[/quote]

Pre-rendering can even help with a single track..! I discovered the 'Performance' tool in Reaper, which shows the CPU usage, track by track. I had heavily treated one of the tracks, which only plays for about 20 seconds. This track, despite being short, was alone taking up over 10% of the CPU, due to the fx treatment. I rendered the track and gained an instant 10%..! Win..!
Following the above advice, I also created a sub-folder for bv's, and applied fx to the folder, rather than to the individual tracks (this implies, of course, wishing the exact same fx on all tracks, which is my case...). This too freed up enormous resources, as well as simplifying and making 'neater' the interface.
Given another few decades, I may even become rather good at this lark (modestly, of course...)..! Great tips, anyway; thanks to all. Keep 'em coming...

Edited August 21, 2013 by Dad3353

[51m0n]

[quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1377077548' post='2182943']
Simon - That's exactly what I want to do in Logic, but as far as I've gotten with the idea is to place things under groups Although my mixer is looking very tidy and organised this month. I have each part of the mixer assigned for different instruments, which all go into one group (Like drums). The worst part is when you decided that maybe only one little track needs to be turned down a little bit, and have to ungroup it, make the adjustment and regroup it.
[/quote]

Surely Logic has a concept of submix tracks/folders rather than you having to group tracks together for volume?

This is not some new idea its exactly what a real mixer does, you send tracks to a group buss rather than the main stereo buss and can still affect the levels within the group by playing with faders.

I havent used Logic in anger for well over ten years though....

[51m0n]

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1377077840' post='2182951']
Pre-rendering can even help with a single track..! I discovered the 'Performance' tool in Reaper, which shows the CPU usage, track by track. I had heavily treated one of the tracks, which only plays for about 20 seconds. This track, despite being short, was alone taking up over 10% of the CPU, due to the fx treatment. I rendered the track and gained an instant 10%..! Win..!
Following the above advice, I also created a sub-folder for bv's, and applied fx to the folder, rather than to the individual tracks (this implies, of course, wishing the exact same fx on all tracks, which is my case...). This too freed up enormous resources, as well as simplifying and making 'neater' the interface.
Given another few decades, I may even become rather good at this lark (modestly, of course...)..! Great tips, anyway; thanks to all. Keep 'em coming...
[/quote]

Absolutely!

You can also route fx sends through the folder by adding channels to the folder and then each indivdual track within the folder can have more or less of an effect as you see fit. This is what I meant by taking it further, it offers absolutely the best 'bang for the buck' in terms of groups for ease of use and track specific fx sends, since you can have for instance a single reverb that everything sends to via its folder tracks which means if youturn down the folder you also turn down the fx send of every track in that folder.

Bit of a headache to set up but absolutely brilliant once its working, and the absolute best way I havefound for get the most out of my mix lappie's hardware (yes I mixed this on a laptop, and I didnt need any track/folder rendering, largely because of how I set these things up).

Edited August 21, 2013 by 51m0n

[MiltyG565]

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1377085597' post='2183102']
Surely Logic has a concept of submix tracks/folders rather than you having to group tracks together for volume?

This is not some new idea its exactly what a real mixer does, you send tracks to a group buss rather than the main stereo buss and can still affect the levels within the group by playing with faders.

I havent used Logic in anger for well over ten years though....
[/quote]

Probably, I've just not learned how to do it yet.

[51m0n]

Wow, already had 1 entry in, remember we wont be looking for a drop dead date until nearer the end of September so plenty of time left to squeeze every last ounce of fabulous out of your mixes

[lurksalot]

Those vocal tracks are beautiful , I could ditch the rest of it and go acapella just so that you can pick the detail , I think I have a new plan

[Dad3353]

[quote name='lurksalot' timestamp='1377344504' post='2186489']...ditch the rest of it and go acapella...[/quote]

Total agreement here, but then, when one kicks the band back in again, it lifts off even further..! Great fun..!

[lurksalot]

Absolutely , But I am really trying to get the band to compliment the vocals and the harmonies IYSWIM , they stand up all on their own and getting the detail to come through will take some doing