Bass Direct

[nottswarwick]

We live is a goldfish bowl in these days of,the Internet, trip advisor, google reviews, forums.

God help anyone who has an "off" day! Threads like this can be hugely damaging to a small business. No one is perfect all the time, and let us not forget that the written word (emails) carry no emotion and are thus open to misinterpretation. Equally, phone conversations do not carry the non verbal element of the discourse, which is also thus open to misinterpretation.

I'm not saying that those on here with negative experiences are wrong in how they feel they were treated, but I do think that is it a sometimes thankless task running such an establishment, since you are constantly on show and vulnerable to potentially reputation harming world wide negative publicity.

I have no affiliation with Mark or his shop, and the fact that I have had great experiences have no bearing on my words in this thread.

[Jah Wibble]

[quote name='BassTractor' timestamp='1377881589' post='2193237']
I have one experience with Bass Direct only, from a single telephone conversation, and in my mind, Mark was stellar during that.
On the basis of that experience, plus what has been written about them on here, I've decided that my next amp is gonna be bought there, just to support their way of doing bizniz.


As to the laughing bit, from my perspective as an owner of a similar importer/shop biz, I'd guess his experience is that [b]virtually no[/b] customers who ask about price matching ever buy anything at any rate.
IME, being friendly, polite and nice about it doesn't help one iota. Explaining the difference between different types of shops doesn't help one iota. Using one's professionality to help them to a good choice doesn't help one iota.
They will just not buy. They seem to think they steal from themselves if they buy from a better shop, and that better shops are thieves. In fact, experience tells me they will often go online to complain about prices even after they've been given the royal treatment.

If you had called me asking about price matching, you would've gotten a polite and friendly answer, and I'd use time on you in the vain hope that you would turn around, but afterwards I'd realise I'm only hurting myself this way, and that I really should have laughed. Laughing is liberating.
[/quote]

Well I was pretty straight up and polite about it to begin with. I generally go on the custom or treat people how you'd like to be treated. I really wasn't asking for anything crazy (even though I was treated as if I was)

If he'd politely said he couldn't of done anything, perhaps I might have had a better view of the store for the future?

Like I said I would like to support independent stores ....but not if you get that kind of assistance.

[Jah Wibble]

[quote name='nottswarwick' timestamp='1377883093' post='2193252']
We live is a goldfish bowl in these days of,the Internet, trip advisor, google reviews, forums.

God help anyone who has an "off" day! Threads like this can be hugely damaging to a small business. No one is perfect all the time, and let us not forget that the written word (emails) carry no emotion and are thus open to misinterpretation. Equally, phone conversations do not carry the non verbal element of the discourse, which is also thus open to misinterpretation.

I'm not saying that those on here with negative experiences are wrong in how they feel they were treated, but I do think that is it a sometimes thankless task running such an establishment, since you are constantly on show and vulnerable to potentially reputation harming world wide negative publicity.

I have no affiliation with Mark or his shop, and the fact that I have had great experiences have no bearing on my words in this thread.
[/quote]

Yeah I agree, anyone can have an off day and then you get this sh*t storm online. I don't want to take away from all the good experiences other people have had.... It's just mine wasn't.

[stingrayPete1977]

Regarding serving other people when you haven't rang in first, I can imagine the post on here saying they had rang weeks in advance to try a £3k bass and £3k amp, had cash in their pocket yet Mark was too busy serving some guy who called in on the off chance even though they had specifically arranged to be there while the tc rep was there sorting their fx unit! Can't win can he?

[nottswarwick]

He asked me to book an appointment, job done

[timmo]

I went in with no appointment. I was the only one in there so maybe I was lucky. All the left hand basses were upstairs so I asked to see the Clover, which he bought down. He plugged me in, went into his office and left me too it. A few words of advice after I asked him to look at an MTD, he let me play it and I settled on the Clover, and after a small chat after, it all went well. He held the door open for me as I was leaving and he said to come back when it settles down if I wanted for him to make sure it was ok. I would go back, but maybe I would make an appointment first, because to be fair, it does say to call for an appointment if you would like a demo on his website.

Edited August 30, 2013 by timmo

[goblin]

I've never really bought anything of significance off Mark, (basically a set of strings online), but when I did everything was fast and smooth, and I had no issues at all. However I met him at London Bass Guitar Show this year, and I'll give credit where credit's due as he's such a nice guy. As previously said though, with the internet era and review sites etc, one bad day which everyone has, and it can have a massive impact!

[BassTractor]

[quote name='Jah Wibble' timestamp='1377884006' post='2193268']
Well I was pretty straight up and polite about it to begin with. I generally go on the custom or treat people how you'd like to be treated. I really wasn't asking for anything crazy (even though I was treated as if I was)

If he'd politely said he couldn't of done anything, perhaps I might have had a better view of the store for the future?

Like I said I would like to support independent stores ....but not if you get that kind of assistance.
[/quote]


You're still only seeing this from one single perspective. Your being polite does not take away years of his experience with questions about price matching. My guess is most of them have been polite. But do these customers understand and appreciate what sets shops like this apart from the rest?
My take:
No, some groups of customers don't, as long as they ask professional independent stores to price match, and complain on webfora when they've burnt their noses.


Ideally, of course he should've been friendly and service minded.
However, I assume a certain history here, and one that I can heavily relate to. My own being an understanding, polite and friendly seller is really a form of raping myself, and it is damaging my self image. Maybe if I'd laughed more, I'd be a happier person. To some degree I envy him this ability.


"that kind of assistance" was not at the root of the problem. It was the result.
You did not ask him to price match first after he'd laughed, now did you?
So your "support independent stores" becomes worthless. You did not want to support the professional independent store. You wanted the professional independent store to price match. Enough said.

[goblin]

And with regards to the appointment thing too, that's entirely fair enough. It shows that his customers are also genuinely interested, and don't just want to come in to try a fancy instrument as a chancer. It saves him a lot of time and effort that way, which is important for smaller businesses, and he'll be able to devote more time to someone who's there because they want are 100% interested, rather than jumping in between people who just want to play something expensive.

[GregBass]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1377887675' post='2193334']
I would make an appointment first, because to be fair, it does say to call for an appointment if you would like a demo on his website.
[/quote]

When I read this, I actually went to the website to check. There is a big panel on the right saying Visit the shop and it's close to the motorway. The address is there too. No mention of an appointment. I looked at the special offers page - the same. Second hand basses - the same. Then I found it - on the Contact us page. Surely if making an appointment is the way he wants to work, it should be fairly prominent on the pages where he is selling things? I have never had to make an appointment in a music shop before, so it didn't occur to me that I would need to there.

As it happens, I tend to buy on impulse when I see something that takes my eye. If I could have tried the Vigier he had on show, I may have bought it. In the couple of weeks following my visit to Bass Direct I bought a German Warwick 5 string, a Genz Benz amp and a Bass Collection fretless Jazz. I didn't lose - I'm sure there will be other Vigiers if I fancy one - but Bass Direct lost a good chance of a sale.

[stingrayPete1977]

To be fair most of us are used to big stores like guitar guitar or pmt, this is a small unit stuffed with pro gear run by mostly one person so its not a place where you can wonder around while Mark shows someone a bass expecting one on one attention which you get if you ask.

[GregBass]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1377888724' post='2193357']
To be fair most of us are used to big stores like guitar guitar or pmt, this is a small unit stuffed with pro gear run by mostly one person so its not a place where you can wonder around while Mark shows someone a bass expecting one on one attention which you get if you ask.
[/quote]

Indeed. I didn't know what his set-up was like, but the "Pay us a visit" pane on the website implies that it's OK to just drop in, doesn't it? He acknowledged that I was there and a couple of times said "Be with you in a minute" - but then someone else came in and got his attention immediately. Even if he'd said "there's no free amp, but sit on that stool and give it a go for feel" he would have kept me interested. I did get the feeling that the others were locals who he knew, so maybe that affected things.

I don't want this to turn into a bashing exercise because other people's experiences show he's a knowledgeable and friendly guy. If we are expected to make appointments, that should clear on every page of the website shouldn't it?

[Jah Wibble]

[quote name='BassTractor' timestamp='1377888311' post='2193349']



You're still only seeing this from one single perspective. Your being polite does not take away years of his experience with questions about price matching. My guess is most of them have been polite. But do these customers understand and appreciate what sets shops like this apart from the rest?
My take:
No, some groups of customers don't, as long as they ask professional independent stores to price match, and complain on webfora when they've burnt their noses.


Ideally, of course he should've been friendly and service minded.
However, I assume a certain history here, and one that I can heavily relate to. My own being an understanding, polite and friendly seller is really a form of raping myself, and it is damaging my self image. Maybe if I'd laughed more, I'd be a happier person. To some degree I envy him this ability.


"that kind of assistance" was not at the root of the problem. It was the result.
You did not ask him to price match first after he'd laughed, now did you?
So your "support independent stores" becomes worthless. You did not want to support the professional independent store. You wanted the professional independent store to price match. Enough said.
[/quote]

Well no you're wrong. When I phoned back up I'd said to him had you not laughed at me I would have probably bought it from his store so.....

The general jist I'm getting from you is "you don't own a shop so you dont know what people can be like" - Your right I don't, but this thread is about what it's like from the otherside if the counter.

Edited August 30, 2013 by Jah Wibble

[stingrayPete1977]

That's fair enough I'd feel the same, just trying to juggle everything and everyone I guess. I'm sure he could have a bigger store, employ some kids, stock cheap christmas tat and have all the stuff pmt do but then we would lose another shop that sells rarer brands as floor space would dictate, I'm not sure I can take another shop full of fender basses and ashdown amps!

[Zodiak]

I happen to work with people a lot as a part of my job, though I'm not in sales so there's absolutely no personal interest or gain in it for me. And I have to explain the same things over and over again 300 a day. Yet, bad day or good day, I always try to help people, be polite but also, more importantly, try to anticipate what needs more explaining, which issues generally cause trouble etc. I'm sick of this, the people are mostly idiots and they can pretty much burn in hell for all I care, since I don't get any profit from them. But I always try to do my job well becuase what's easy and boring and mundane for me, is of vital importance to many people and they need my help. They count on me. Just as I counted on Mark's help, knowledge and expertise, buying blind online. Be runs a shop and, theoretically, wants to sell stuff. I was 100% interested and ready to spend. It's his fault if he thought otherwise. Yet he seemed to show no interest whatsoever in selling anything to me. Our "conversation" ran over the course of 2 weeks, so it wasn't just a bad day.

Again, I'm sure he's a great bloke in person or to people he knows. But he chose to provide the option of buying online. And having done that, isn't it natural to expect more obnoxious questions than from people who can actually visit the shop and try everything out. IRL I hardly ever use shop assistants because everything's there to see. But online it's a different story.

Plus he sold me a bass with a faulty pickup.

Just sharing my recent experience. No Internet bashing. And I will order more from Mark because he has a great shop. But I expected more for my money, especially from a "small independent business"

[BassTractor]

[quote name='Jah Wibble' timestamp='1377889738' post='2193378']
Well no you're wrong. When I phoned back up I'd said to him had you not laughed at me I would have probably bought it from his store so.....
[/quote]

Yes, but my being right or wrong in your case is not the point. It's about the statistical value of a customer who asks to price match.
My point is to try and present one of the alternative ways of looking at these things - one that might be able to explain where he may come from.


[quote name='Jah Wibble' timestamp='1377889738' post='2193378']
The general jist I'm getting from you is "you don't own a shop so you dont know what people can be like" - Your right I don't, but this thread is about what it's like from the otherside if the counter.
[/quote]

I certainly did not try to express that you don't know what people can be like as a result of your not owning a shop. However, I fear I've already repeated myself too much, so I won't try to express again what I think I've already expressed.

This thread, btw, is about what we write in it.
Some customers complained. I tried to present a possible explanation of one of the cases, as well as an alternative way of looking at it.
You seem to not accept that way of looking, which is your perogative.

[goblin]

Just out of interest (incase I've missed it), have you been in touch with him about the faulty pickup?

[Zodiak]

No. I see no point. It's damn hard sending something like a bass back across Europe. And, I'm being honest here, I would have swapped the pickups anyway. And I mean, what's the point? I can't prove anything. I didn't want to complain just for the sake of it. Besides, as I have said, my experience buying the bass wasn't that pleasant, I felt it would only get worse once I complained. I just took it to the best tech in the country whom I've never ever seen in my life and he confirmed it's faulty. So I thought "Oh well, wanted different pups anyway, so the fuss isn't worth it". I do like the bass, it's a damn fine instrument.

P.S. Funny that the only thing Mark did point out about the bass (a small mark on the finish) was easily cleaned off :-)

Edited August 30, 2013 by Zodiak

[Zodiak]

It's just a shame because, among other things, I specifically asked about 6 times whether there was anything I needed to know about the bass (previous owner, why he sold it etc. - all reasonable questions that I see asked all the time when selling/buying used gear), anything wrong with it, and all my questions were pretty much ignored or I just got one-liners (and a photo of the mark on the finish). Had he told me about the pickup (I doubt he knew, but I sure as hell couldn't try the bass and see for myself, the problem is immediate right after plugging in, and it's not both pickups which could be mistaken for a feature but just one), I would have bought the bass anyway. But saying it's immaculate is pushing it too far IMO.

Look, in the end, it all boils down to this: he never took me seriously right until the bank transfer cleared. I'm sure he thought I was just wasting his time asking all these questions and going nowhere. What was I supposed to do, send him a photo of my salary? That's what disappointed me. There's no way to show you really mean it over emails. But that's why I expect shop owners to treat everyone as if it's their last customer. This elitism is evident in music shops more than in many other places. If I'm not pro, if Im asking questions, that doesn't mean I'm broke and don't want a good piece of gear.

Edited August 30, 2013 by Zodiak

[ambient]

I've been there a few times and gotten a similar response to some other guys on here. It seemed to me that if you're not buying a Roscoe bass and bergantino rig to play it through then you're wasting his time.

I did phone him once asking if he'd got something in the store, he said yes so I drove 30 miles to him, only to find he hadn't, but that could probably happen with other shops too.

[fretmeister]

[quote name='ambient' timestamp='1377898989' post='2193518']
I've been there a few times and gotten a similar response to some other guys on here. It seemed to me that if you're not buying a Roscoe bass and bergantino rig to play it through then you're wasting his time.

I did phone him once asking if he'd got something in the store, he said yes so I drove 30 miles to him, only to find he hadn't, but that could probably happen with other shops too.
[/quote]

To be fair, the cheap end of gear is not his market. He doesn't do MIM Fenders, or BB series Yamaha etc. he does high end gear with some mid ranking stuff. No shop would put Squires next to a Lull!

He's had several thousand out of me and he'll probably get more too.

[Gordon Thudmaster May]

Does Mark criticise your bass playing??

[ambient]

[quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1377900133' post='2193543']
To be fair, the cheap end of gear is not his market. He doesn't do MIM Fenders, or BB series Yamaha etc. he does high end gear with some mid ranking stuff. No shop would put Squires next to a Lull!

He's had several thousand out of me and he'll probably get more too.
[/quote]

I wasn't actually after the cheap end of the market, I've got 6 basses, 3 worth well over a thousand (USA made Marcus Miller V, Pino P bass, Yamaha TRB6-P, and and 3 just under and I'm shortly getting a Celinder.

A sale is a sale after all.

I visit the Gallery quite often, and always feel more valued somehow.

Edited August 30, 2013 by ambient

[goblin]

Well personally my view is that no matter where it came from, and whether the experience was good or bad, if something wasn't right, I'd still be in touch with the seller. It's not really fair to criticise them for it being defective, I've had it before and it was simply a case of not initially noticing there was an issue, and they've paid to rectify the issue as sending it all the way back can be a pain. All you have to do it ask.

[fretmeister]

[quote name='Gordon Thudmaster May' timestamp='1377900537' post='2193548']
Does Mark criticise your bass playing??
[/quote]

Not to me. Has he done to others?