Does anybody actually PLAY like this?

[spog]

Someone recently suggested to me that the best way to mute strings/reduce unwanted ringing was to actually play 'through' the string and let your finger come to rest on the next one. In practice this would mean playing a note on, say, the D-string and muting the A-string. Funilly enough, in all the books I have (and I must have upwards of 20) I have never seen this suggested before. I don't doubt the guy is trying to be helpful, but I am finding this a pretty hellish task after having gotten into the habit of just playing the one string and 'ignoring' the others. I guess starting out playing punk hardly helped! Listening to (and trying to play) something like Dune Tune, you can see there is a valid enough reason for keeping things tidy. Stuart Clayton suggests a 'wandering' (anchoring/muting thumb) which also feels odd when you're used to perching on the bridge pick-up and staying there. Whatever technique is used, you would surely tie yourself in knots pretty quickly if you tried it with 16th notes wouldn't you?

[Paul Cooke]

Yes, I do play like that... they're called rest strokes...

here, try this exercise:

[url="http://www.basssessions.com/aug04/triplet.html"]http://www.basssessions.com/aug04/triplet.html[/url]

[Sibob]

Yes, rest strokes and 'wandering thumb' for me! It helps towards muting and keeping all the notes you play nice and clear!

I used to think and play like you actually, rest strokes being weird, but once you have them down, you will find that you play a lot more evenly, stronger & faster than the way you're going now, because your fingers have a point of reference for each attack.

And with regards to wandering thumb, if you look at the shape of your hand as you play each string while your thumb is anchored to the pickup, it changes, its almost like 4 different techniques. Whereas if you change the position of where you rest your thumb based on what string you're playing, you keep the hand shape similar to when you're playing the low E. So although it seems like more work, you're actually making life easier in the long run!

Si

Edited June 15, 2008 by Sibob

[chris_b]

[quote name='Paul Cooke' post='219009' date='Jun 14 2008, 10:07 PM'].... they're called rest strokes....[/quote]
I have always done that, and had no idea it had a name!!

[OutToPlayJazz]

The term "rest stroke" comes from the classical guitar world. If a player is playing a "single line" piece with no bass notes or chordal content, that's how they play, using alternate strokes of the index & middle fingers, walking into the next string, thereby creating a damping effect. (Much like us bass players, really!) I use this technique & also left hand damp at the same time.

I also use extra "damped hits" on the right hand for damping and percussive effects as well.

There are some interesting videos of Gary Willis showing his more advanced version where he actually uses unused fingers to further damp strings he's moving away from. Scary!

[spog]

Thanks for that folks. All I'd like to know now is how my post ended up HERE (my previous moan refers)! Is there someone out there who is able to move other people's posts (Oooer!)
[quote name='Sibob' post='219138' date='Jun 15 2008, 11:05 AM']Yes, rest strokes and 'wandering thumb' for me! It helps towards muting and keeping all the notes you play nice and clear!

I used to think and play like you actually, rest strokes being weird, but once you have them down, you will find that you play a lot more evenly, stronger & faster than the way you're going now, because your fingers have a point of reference for each attack.

And with regards to wandering thumb, if you look at the shape of your hand as you play each string while your thumb is anchored to the pickup, it changes, its almost like 4 different techniques. Whereas if you change the position of where you rest your thumb based on what string you're playing, you keep the hand shape similar to when you're playing the low E. So although it seems like more work, you're actually making life easier in the long run!

Si[/quote]

[thisnameistaken]

Start recording yourself practicing. If you're not using both hands to mute strings you'll probably find that some stuff you play comes with noisy overtones!

Actually one song that's terribly over-studied at the moment does a really good job of teaching you good muting habits: Hysteria by Muse. Slow it down if you need to, just for the sake of getting through it, and you'll find playing it cleanly is actually pretty complicated in terms of muting, and techniques like the one you're talking about come in very handy.

[Merton]

[quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='219476' date='Jun 15 2008, 09:56 PM']There are some interesting videos of Gary Willis showing his more advanced version where he actually uses unused fingers to further damp strings he's moving away from. Scary![/quote]

I think I sometimes do that sort of thing totally subconciously. Must check out how he does it...

[quote name='spog' post='219478' date='Jun 15 2008, 10:00 PM']Thanks for that folks. All I'd like to know now is how my post ended up HERE (my previous moan refers)! Is there someone out there who is able to move other people's posts (Oooer!) [/quote]

Yes. You originally posted in the wrong part of the forum so a Mod moved it to the correct place I guess. Nothing spooky or sinister, just keeps th eplace tidy so people can find things in the logical place

[Sibob]

Yeah, It's all about muting with both hands!

Si

[ahpook]

[quote name='Paul Cooke' post='219009' date='Jun 14 2008, 10:07 PM']here, try this exercise:

[url="http://www.basssessions.com/aug04/triplet.html"]http://www.basssessions.com/aug04/triplet.html[/url][/quote]

i'm prolly being dense, but i don't understand what's being described there...what does the author mean by

"allowing your finger to come to rest on the string directly below it."

[Sibob]

If you anchor your thumb on the pickup and play the E string, you're probably bringing your plucking finger back to rest on your thumb. So when you play the A string, bring your plucking finger back to rest on the E string, and so on!
Rest strokes can be used separately to 'wandering/floating thumb', but they obviously go hand-in-hand

Si

p.s.
In case it wasn't that obvious, this is a fingerstyle technique

Edited June 16, 2008 by Sibob

[wotnwhy]

[quote name='chris_b' post='219286' date='Jun 15 2008, 04:40 PM']I have always done that, and had no idea it had a name!![/quote]

same as, to be honest i can't really understand how you can [i]not[/i] do it. unless you use an almost 'pop' movement... i'm gonna have to go and have go at it later

[ahpook]

[quote name='Sibob' post='219995' date='Jun 16 2008, 04:22 PM']If you anchor your thumb on the pickup and play the E string, you're probably bringing your plucking finger back to rest on your thumb. So when you play the A string, bring your plucking finger back to rest on the E string, and so on![/quote]

oh ? i do that anyway..except when i'm playing bass [i]properly[/i]..with a plectrum.

[Sibob]

What you've done there is use the word "properly" very wrongly




Si

[Dr.Dave]

Me too - it all came fairly natural , not a concious thing.

I didn't know they were called rest strokes either but I use them all the time , along with the wandering thumb thing. Another thing I do , partic in slower parts with long sustained notes - lets say one sounding on the A string - is stretch my third finger over to rest on the D and G strings to stop any chance of them sounding.

Add that to a fairly good left hand damping technique and I don't get any unwanted notes sounding........

most of the time !!!!

[Bilbo]

Me too. Never done it any differently.

The Gary Willis technique OTPJ mentions is astonishing and it is hard to argue with its efficacy (his improvised lines are profoundly sophisticated and his technique impeccable) but I have to say that, despite loving some of the early Tribal Tech stuff (Spears particularly), I have grown to loath his fundamental [i]sound[/i] (very processed and 'digital' ). What I don't really know is the relationship between his technique (using a soft touch as I recall) and his tone.

[mcgraham]

[quote]The Gary Willis technique OTPJ mentions is astonishing and it is hard to argue with its efficacy (his improvised lines are profoundly sophisticated and his technique impeccable)[/quote] It seems efficient by his logic, but I cannot bring myself to acknowledge it's overall efficiency over equivalent (or less!) hard work poured into standard two finger technique. The complications and endless permutations and technique switching his requires for the benefit of having a 3rd finger to ascend (and even then only on some phrases!) seems (to me) to be an awful lot of effort for very little reward. But that is just my opinion.

[quote]I have to say that, despite loving some of the early Tribal Tech stuff (Spears particularly), I have grown to loath his fundamental sound (very processed and 'digital' ). What I don't really know is the relationship between his technique (using a soft touch as I recall) and his tone.[/quote] I've not listened intensely or intently to Tribal Tech (though I have warmed to Henderson's style in recent months; I/my ear used to be quite at odds with his playing), I have to agree that [i]sometimes[/i] his sounds is not on the same level as his playing. However he seems to have relaxed his stance on playing right up near the fretboard for a 'fat' tone and has developed some nice variations in tone. I will acknowledge that his light touch, his choice in bass and technique does lend itself to very even notes all told, which make each note fat, but ultimately somwhat unremarkable/uninteresting. Like you say, a little digital.

Mark

[Faithless]

I've 'found' this technique myself, while watching Rob Trujillo playing with his Ring and Pinky fingers raised(Thumb on pickup), and couldn't understand, how, playing the stuff so fast, he doesn't ring, for eg. B string( when plucking E)..

So, after a bit of practice I've figured the Thing out..
But I don't use it as my main muting technique, only in exceptive cases.

When playing with two fingers, I use so-called Jaco's muting technique ( incorporate Ring and Pinky fingers..)..
Three? 'Floating' thumb. But it doesn't 'float' in the air - it rests on the string/pup.

Anyone's also about Jaco?

[fekalizatorius]

Well... This technique is very effective while playing something fast-paced, like death metal, but requires a lot of practice, until you can play accurately enough not to pluck the string you are "resting" on

[Faithless]

Well, I do not have problems at all with my 'muting' fingers so far..

What about 'deathy' metal - most of players use a pick [shame, isn't it? ], but, if I'd do 'deathy', I'd defo go for 3-finger tech with 'rest stroke system' instead of 2 + 'Jaco syst..' ...

Just make sure, you do decent flowing, strength, and control outta them..

[fekalizatorius]

[quote name='Faithless' post='248704' date='Jul 27 2008, 01:52 AM']Well, I do not have problems at all with my 'muting' fingers so far..

What about 'deathy' metal - most of players use a pick [shame, isn't it? ], but, if I'd do 'deathy', I'd defo go for 3-finger tech with 'rest stroke system' instead of 2 + 'Jaco syst..' ...

Just make sure, you do decent flowing, strength, and control outta them..[/quote]
Ok Now about picks in extreme metal... Well.. It does not depend on the genre of the music, but more on weather you decided to pick or not to pick at the begining :]

[bassicinstinct]

[quote name='spog' post='219005' date='Jun 14 2008, 09:55 PM']Someone recently suggested to me that the best way to mute strings/reduce unwanted ringing was to actually play 'through' the string and let your finger come to rest on the next one. In practice this would mean playing a note on, say, the D-string and muting the A-string. Funilly enough, in all the books I have (and I must have upwards of 20) I have never seen this suggested before. I don't doubt the guy is trying to be helpful, but I am finding this a pretty hellish task after having gotten into the habit of just playing the one string and 'ignoring' the others. I guess starting out playing punk hardly helped! Listening to (and trying to play) something like Dune Tune, you can see there is a valid enough reason for keeping things tidy. Stuart Clayton suggests a 'wandering' (anchoring/muting thumb) which also feels odd when you're used to perching on the bridge pick-up and staying there. Whatever technique is used, you would surely tie yourself in knots pretty quickly if you tried it with 16th notes wouldn't you?[/quote]

Yes, I've always played like that, although it gradually developed over the years rather than being a conscious technique.

Seems like a VERY natural way to play to me.