The next "big thing" in bass development?

[Ghost_Bass]

AHA! Here: [url="http://www.mikeyguitar.com/"]http://www.mikeyguitar.com/[/url]

[Ghosts Over Japan]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1378468096' post='2200734']
AHA! Here: [url="http://www.mikeyguitar.com/"]http://www.mikeyguitar.com/[/url]
[/quote]

Now that is cool. As a person that can only afford to have one bass at a time currently, this would be great! Thanks for sharing
Cai

[chris_b]

Rather than looking forward, I've been trying to remember the last "big things" to shake my bass world.

They were a passive P bass and flats. So I'm improving by going backwards it seems.

[Acebassmusic]

[quote name='Oversoul' timestamp='1378429939' post='2200299']
Hey you never know, 10 years ago I used to wonder when a major brand would release a 7 string bass. Ibanez did that a few months back!
[/quote]

I remember seeing about 10 years ago in the States, Conklin Groove Tools had their Korean version of the Sidewinder 7 string bass on sale at Guitar Centres. Although not as major a brand as Ibanez, but certainly not boutique.

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1378467844' post='2200726']
But you can focus on having the sound improoved on the area you'll expect your audience to be standing (normally front center).
[/quote]

But time domain problems mean that every single person in the room hears something different and none of them are stood where the mixing desk is. EQ solutions are at best a compromise for a small number of people in the audience and you can actually make things much worse for those not in the "sweet spot".

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1378468096' post='2200734']
AHA! Here: [url="http://www.mikeyguitar.com/"]http://www.mikeyguitar.com/[/url]
[/quote]

A terrible solution as it works by lowering the frets rather than raising the fingerboard leaving you with a very high fretless action.

[Lfalex v1.1]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1378465377' post='2200664']
You can't do room acoustic correction on an amp, because most room problems are time domain related (nodes and reflections) and trying to apply a frequency domain solution (EQ) doesn't give consistent results - improving things in one area of the room usually makes it much worse somewhere else.
[/quote]

I agree, but was suggesting it in the context of onstage monitoring use rather than using it as something the audience would hear directly. In that sense, I was considering the player rather than the audience. Needless to say, any DI feed would be "clean", and if correction were applied, make mic'ing the cab extremely problematic...

[Kiwi]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1378468000' post='2200731']
Can't remember the make on this one, is it really a Steinberger or are we talking about different models?
[/quote]
Different models but I believe the principle of rotating frets is the same. The steinberger version was operated by a rotating knob at the headstock rather than a sliding lever at the heel.

http://www.steinbergerworld.com/special/xm2fl.htm

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Lfalex v1.1' timestamp='1378471195' post='2200805']
I agree, but was suggesting it in the context of onstage monitoring use rather than using it as something the audience would hear directly. In that sense, I was considering the player rather than the audience. Needless to say, any DI feed would be "clean", and if correction were applied, make mic'ing the cab extremely problematic...
[/quote]

For on-stage monitoring you are far better off experimenting with cab position - which is actually then compensating for the real problem and not trying to fix the symptoms only with EQ. Of course if you move about on stage to any degree then it's still not going to be very effective.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1378470542' post='2200790']
But time domain problems mean that every single person in the room hears something different and none of them are stood where the mixing desk is. EQ solutions are at best a compromise for a small number of people in the audience and you can actually make things much worse for those not in the "sweet spot".
[/quote]

I see where you're going to but i think we're maybe talking about different things. It's probably my fault for not being able to explain it better in english. Try to see the "room accoustics correction" like something that just does the same thing we all already do in each venue that is to play and hear wich freqs are ressonating in the room and cut them and at the same time hearing whtat's being damped by the room and bring it up!

[Dingus]

The "next big thing " happened about twenty years ago when the consensus of opinion shifted towards the idea that technological and design innovations for bass guitars were largely redundant because for most players in most situations , the existing traditional designs were the best ( or at least the[i] preferred[/i] choice , let's say) tools for the job . This realisation was indeed so "big" and its' impact has been so significant that it shows no signs of receding , as any bass retailer will tell you . For better or worse , the only innovation that will have any impact in the retail sector is finding ways to re-. market those old designs . Hi-tech and radical-design basses will remain marginal for the forseeable future and insignificant in terms of sales. Despite the claims that some folks make for them , lightweight cabs and digital-based amps still have a long way to go in most cases before they can match the sonic attributes of the best traditional-design amplification , but I am sure that in the next twenty years that gap will decrease significantly . There is much more chance that hi-tech amps will continue to prosper than that new -design basses will catch -on in any meaningful way . .

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1378470603' post='2200793']
A terrible solution as it works by lowering the frets rather than raising the fingerboard leaving you with a very high fretless action.
[/quote]

We're talking about innovation and development[u] in the future[/u]. I think it won't be too hard to design this system, or a similar one, with a nut (or zero fret) that changes it's height from fretted to fretless position.

I just think that the core idea of this is very appealing and can be a real solution in the future. Just a case o minimizing fret wear or making it easier to replace frets and address those action issues with nut or bridge adjustments. Easier to be said than done but that's what R&D departments are there for!


I think today i'm a bit too confrontational, seems that every post i write, even outside this thread, originates a (healthy IMO) discussion! I'll keep of the keyboard for a while and go grab a cup of coffee. Cheers

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1378474991' post='2200872']
I see where you're going to but i think we're maybe talking about different things. It's probably my fault for not being able to explain it better in english. Try to see the "room accoustics correction" like something that just does the same thing we all already do in each venue that is to play and hear wich freqs are ressonating in the room and cut them and at the same time hearing whtat's being damped by the room and bring it up!
[/quote]

And what you are doing is trying to fix the symptoms and not the cause.

Frequencies are resonating in the room because of sound reflections coming off the various surfaces combining with the direct sound from the speakers. These combinations happen in different amounts for different frequencies in different places in the room. Using EQ to fix them can only go so far and won't produce consistent results because the problem is caused by both the frequency of the waveform as well as the position of the listener in relation to the speaker and the reflective surfaces of the room.

[Acebassmusic]

For me the next "big thing" doesnt have to be unique, never before seen, but could be the utilisation of technology in a way not fully exploited before or by making it available to a wider (bigger) audience. I know that some of the ideas below have been done before, its just that its usually theres something thats stopped them becoming widespread. Some ideas:

Midi bass / interface that really works and doesnt cost the earth but allows you to use your bass
Setting and saving amp eq to presets for easy re-call
Alternate materials / composites (although I think Status might have been doing something like this for a while )

Edited September 6, 2013 by Acebassmusic

[molan]

One of the biggest innovations in amplifier and cabinet technology has been weight reduction.

As someone who meets a lot of 'ordinary' players every week, I'd say the single most common question I get asked is about how much a bass weighs and ways in which to reduce back or shoulder strain because of years of playing 'abuse'.

There are some people making consistently light instruments that still sound amazing and feel like a 'real' bass - Jens Ritter 4 strings regularly come in at 7.5lbs with solid woods and Roger Sadowsky has made consistently good basses under 8lbs using chambered bodies. Of course there are others as well - in fact I have a Martin Petersen Sei that's only 6.5lbs - I just happen to have had a lot of first hand experience with Ritter and Sadowsky.

So my theory is that manufacturers will eventually produce instruments that are lighter, without incurring huge cost, and don't cause their players to have long term health issues.

There's always been a negative reaction to man-made materials and non-traditional body shapes so I'm going with things that look and feel like a Fender but weigh around 7lbs with no loss of perfect balance of depth of tone

Edited September 6, 2013 by molan

[chris_b]

[quote name='Acebassmusic' timestamp='1378476194' post='2200895']
....For me the next "big thing" doesnt have to be unique, never before seen....
[/quote]

+1

The next big thing could be when the cost of neodymium goes through the floor, enabling neo cabs to price ceramics out of the market.

Except for small niche manufacturers providing limited product to curmudgeonly bassists who insist that their backs are fine and they really can hear a difference.

[tauzero]

It would be nice to have a bass properly integrated into MIDI - perhaps a long-scale version of the YR1000 is the answer to that, though that then loses the ability to have a native bass sound as well as the MIDI generated notes.

I can't see there being any great change to the basic construction of the bass - the basic concept of a long stick protruding from a wider flat bit is going to stay the same. The two basic methods of combining the stick bit and the other bit, ie. either having the stick bit go all the way along the other bit or have it attached at one end with glue or screws, seems pretty immutable, though there has been the odd instance of a metal frame and suspended fretboard. I can think of three current pickup systems - magnetic, piezo, and Lightwave. I'm not sure that any great advances can be made on those fronts - after all, it's all about sensing how a string is moving.

Seeing as how we all have different ideas about how a bass should look, perhaps the most significant advance that could be made would be to have a flat screen on the front of the body that would show a picture of the bass body that you love most. I suppose I'd better go and patent that then.

[Ghost_Bass]

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1378475675' post='2200887']
And what you are doing is trying to fix the symptoms and not the cause.

Frequencies are resonating in the room because of sound reflections coming off the various surfaces combining with the direct sound from the speakers. These combinations happen in different amounts for different frequencies in different places in the room. Using EQ to fix them can only go so far and won't produce consistent results because the problem is caused by both the frequency of the waveform as well as the position of the listener in relation to the speaker and the reflective surfaces of the room.
[/quote]

True but what i was mainly saying about [i]cutting the ressonant freqs[/i] was, in a practical example, find and cut out the freq that is making the venue's walls/counter/glasses/vent grills/etc. vibrate and producing that annoying buzz!

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Ghost_Bass' timestamp='1378479459' post='2200952']
True but what i was mainly saying about [i]cutting the ressonant freqs[/i] was, in a practical example, find and cut out the freq that is making the venue's walls/counter/glasses/vent grills/etc. vibrate and producing that annoying buzz!
[/quote]

But from a listener's PoV the resonant frequencies change depending on where you stand in the room. Yes you can find the notes that make the various fixtures and fittings rattle, but things like the boominess of the room varies in both frequency and intensity depending on where you are in relation to the direct and reflected sound sources. Using EQ to sort this out only fixes it for a small area which will change again as the room fills up.

[stingrayPete1977]

A 3/4 upright that folds down to the size of a briefcase and has no feedback issues even at full volume and sounds imense would be nice.

[timmo]

Apart from advancements in tuition etc, has there been an innovation to make learning and playing a bass easier from the first basses ?

[Adrenochrome]

Hopefully the end to heavy, unergonomic basses that don't have decent fret access. There's no need in this day and age.

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='timmo' timestamp='1378573217' post='2202013']
Apart from advancements in tuition etc, has there been an innovation to make learning and playing a bass easier from the first basses ?
[/quote]

OK basses being really cheap has helped. Compare to the nasty Woolworths jobs in the 60s, you can get very serviceable bottom end basses, like the £50 pink Westfield jobs and the Sue Ryders. Problem is proper setups are about as rare as ever, and more instruments about than ever before.

[Kiwi]

I had an idea yesterday which is basically to take the Casiotone DG20, fit the tech into a more traditional body and include all those bass synth patches from the Akai SB1 which noone else seems to have nailed in other pedals yet. The lack of any need for pitch to MIDI should take care of lag.

The only downside would be that it wouldn't be possible to get the sound of a real bass guitar with it but for most pop, techno or electronica songs where keyboards would otherwise be used in the studio, I don't think that would be an issue.

[Kiwi]

I've just done a bit of reading up on the matrix of sensors used in the fingerboard of the DG 20 and it sounds in principle a lot like the system Steve Chick uses...although his is resistance based rather than pressure based. Oh well...