Not a relic in sight......

[BetaFunk]

Just watched 'Totally British: 70s Rock' part one 1970-1974. Lots of old BBC sessions of SAHB, Heavy Metal Kids, Humble Pie, Family, Status Quo, Faces, Babe Ruth, Nazareth etc and there's hardly a worn guitar or bass in sight. Nearly every one looked as if it had just come out of a shop window. I can imagine the Beeb's dressing room floors were full of discarded Fender, Gibson and Ricky tags and hangers. I wonder what any of today's relicers thought as they sat in front of the telly watching this with their orbital sander by the side of their armchair?

[gary mac]

Watched that last time it was broadcast and really enjoyed most of it. Always a treat to see Humble Pie and The Heavy Metal Kids.

Half way interesting fact....... my budgie whistles the riff to Heavy Metal Kids track Hangin' On.

[D.I. Joe]

You're right, but those instruments that were new at the time are the ones which today show 40 years of wear and battle scars. I'm sure that the relicing process is more about making a new instrument look like one of that age as it is today, rather than replicating how it would have looked at that time.

[Len_derby]

Interesting observation. I remember seeing Rory Gallagher for the first time, in about 1973. As an impressionable teenager I was genuinely stunned that he was playing such a beaten-up guitar (sunburst Strat). I'd never seen anything like it before.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='D.I. Joe' timestamp='1380359621' post='2224186']
You're right, but those instruments that were new at the time are the ones which today show 40 years of wear and battle scars. I'm sure that the relicing process is more about making a new instrument look like one of that age as it is today, rather than replicating how it would have looked at that time.
[/quote]
That's true but all of those groups could have chosen to play and early 60s version of practically all of those guitars and basses. Some of which at even 10-15 years old would have had a lot of battle scars but they nearly all chose to play new ones. In fact the an early 60s Strat or Jazz Bass would have cost a lot less than a new one in the mid 70s.
I suppose again it was the that it was the fashion to play a new shiny guitar in the 70s just as it is to play an old relec'd one nowadays.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='Len_derby' timestamp='1380359835' post='2224190']
Interesting observation. I remember seeing Rory Gallagher for the first time, in about 1973. As an impressionable teenager I was genuinely stunned that he was playing such a beaten-up guitar (sunburst Strat). I'd never seen anything like it before.
[/quote]
Yes, Rory and Paul Kossoff were always mentioned in the press for the beaten up look of their guitars. They stood out so much in the shiny world at the time.

[Len_derby]

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1380360205' post='2224193']

Yes, Rory and Paul Kossoff were always mentioned in the press for the beaten up look of their guitars. They stood out so much in the shiny world at the time.
[/quote]

At a (much) lower level of skill I remember that most of us playing guitars and basses back in the 70's had bought them new on the 'never-never'. Usually with their mum having signed the H.P. agreement. That was the most common way for a kid to get an instrument. Probably the cheapest in terms of cash needed up-front. Before the internet the second-hand market was miniscule (certainly in small towns).

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='Len_derby' timestamp='1380360661' post='2224205']
At a (much) lower level of skill I remember that most of us playing guitars and basses back in the 70's had bought them new on the 'never-never'. Usually with their mum having signed the H.P. agreement. That was the most common way for a kid to get an instrument. Probably the cheapest in terms of cash needed up-front. Before the internet the second-hand market was miniscule (certainly in small towns).
[/quote]
In the mid 70s i went with a mate of mine when he took his battered early 60s Lake Placid Blue Stratocaster to a music shop to part exchange it for a brand new Gibson SG. The guy in the shop pointed out every single chip and ding on the Strat before offering him £90 because he said that it was so worn and no one wanted guitars in that condition. How times change eh?

[steve-bbb]

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1380326869' post='2223990']
Just watched 'Totally British: 70s Rock' part one 1970-1974. Lots of old BBC sessions of SAHB, Heavy Metal Kids, Humble Pie, Family, Status Quo, Faces, Babe Ruth, Nazareth etc and there's hardly a worn guitar or bass in sight. Nearly every one looked as if it had just come out of a shop window. I can imagine the Beeb's dressing room floors were full of discarded Fender, Gibson and Ricky tags and hangers. I wonder what any of today's relicers thought as they sat in front of the telly watching this with their orbital sander by the side of their armchair?
[/quote]
none at last weeks south east bass bash either

[White Cloud]

Reliced instruments are extremely "fashionable" at the moment...purely for reasons of aesthetic trend. Pristine instruments were the "fashion" of that period of time.

Fashions change almost as often as the weather. For example just look at the hair style and clothing of the 70's muso's playing those pristine instruments!

[Fat Rich]

[quote name='Len_derby' timestamp='1380359835' post='2224190']
Interesting observation. I remember seeing Rory Gallagher for the first time, in about 1973. As an impressionable teenager I was genuinely stunned that he was playing such a beaten-up guitar (sunburst Strat). I'd never seen anything like it before.
[/quote]

I think I read somewhere that Rory Gallagher had very acidic sweat that ate the finish off his guitar. Plus he probably played it a fair bit too.

The 70s were before my time as I was still a kid, but I get the impression that was when guitars from America became more available in the UK, maybe thanks to people like CBS' distribution? Getting these instruments in the UK maybe wasn't so easy in the 50s and early 60s so perhaps everyone was rushing out buying all this new gear?

Edited September 28, 2013 by Fat Rich

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1380362003' post='2224227']
I think I read somewhere that Rory Gallagher had very acidic sweat that ate the finish off his guitar. Plus he probably played it a fair bit too.

The 70s were before my time as I was still a kid, but I get the impression that was when guitars from America became more available in the UK, maybe thanks to people like CBS' distribution? Getting these instruments in the UK maybe wasn't so easy in the 50s and early 60s so perhaps everyone was rushing out buying all this new gear?
[/quote]
American guitars were relatively easy to get (compared to the 50s and early 60s and as long as you had the money) since the mid 60s in the UK so no one was rushing to buy them because of that. It was purely that everyone wanted a nice shiny guitar in those days.

Edited September 28, 2013 by BetaFunk

[RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE]

The first 'worn' looking bass I saw live , was Burke shelleys yellowish colour precision back in 1980. I would imagine it must have been made in the '60s or something.
When I was a young , naive kid I would've thought it odd that bands on the telly would. Use secondhand instruments. On the other side of the coin, you had the guitarist (or bass player) who preferred copies rather than the original.

[Fat Rich]

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1380363533' post='2224245']
American guitars were relatively easy to get (compared to the 50s and early 60s and as long as you had the money) since the mid 60s in the UK so no one was rushing to buy them because of that. It was purely that everyone wanted a nice shiny guitar in those days.
[/quote]

Ah, OK. I vaguely remember that things were pretty grim in the 70s and people were really proud when they got something shiny and new.

Now there sometimes seems to be a backlash against glossy new stuff, a few players choosing basic instruments and making them look like they've worked hard.

[Lozz196]

And don`t forget those 70s finishes could be bomb-proof. My two 70s Precisions that I had, aside from a couple of dings, the actual finish itself was on each was barely worn/touched. A good clean and I`m sure they would have looked brand new.

[Lowender]

One year shiny chrome is in fashion, the next year it's brushed chrome. One year it's pastel colors, the next year it's muted colors. White brick. Aged brick. High gloss finishes / Satin finishes, etc, etc, etc.

Once people realized, that worn out nitro finishes looked cool, they became fashionable. I think it's fine, though it does hint of being disingenuous if the person is trying to pretend that wear comes from actually being on the road for years.

And yeah, when people talk about the sound of "aged instruments" they forget that all of those classic recordings were done on new instruments. (Though some will claim the wood was older -- though I'm not so sure).

Edited September 28, 2013 by Lowender

[Lord Sausage]

I don't understand how aged wood makes a difference anyway as it's dead as soon as it's cut from the tree. I can't see how it alters over time. If it is covered in paint surely it would preserve it in it's state. Maybe it's all in the head. Wouldn't it be things like the pick up coils loosening over time etc that affected the tone?

[Dingus]

[quote name='Lord Sausage' timestamp='1380383550' post='2224585']
I don't understand how aged wood makes a difference anyway as it's dead as soon as it's cut from the tree. I can't see how it alters over time. If it is covered in paint surely it would preserve it in it's state. Maybe it's all in the head. Wouldn't it be things like the pick up coils loosening over time etc that affected the tone?
[/quote]

Scientifically speaking ( and I've got a Grade 3 C.S.E in Biology , so I know what I'm talking about ) , older wood usually has a lower moisture content and the resin contained within the grain of the wood crystallises over time , supposedly giving it a different resonance

[Dingus]

I expect that back in the 1970's if you had attempted to relic your brand new electric guitar or bass you would probably have been Sectioned under the Mental Health Act . It is a peculialy modern affectation that will inevitably go back out of fashion again sooner rather than later , leaving a lot of people owning expensive guitars with questionable aesthetics because of their fake " distress". I remember when guitars with pointy angled headstocks were all the rage and promoted as being structurally superior and the way of the future , yet nowadays it would be a brave man that would dare play one in public, and you would probably feel less self-concious wearing a shell suit and sporting a mullet haircurt than playing one .

Edited September 28, 2013 by Dingus

[White Cloud]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1380385657' post='2224619']
Scientifically speaking ( and I've got a Grade 3 C.S.E in Biology , so I know what I'm talking about ) , older wood usually has a lower moisture content and the resin contained within the grain of the wood crystallises over time , supposedly giving it a different resonance
[/quote]
Absolutely correct!

[Dingus]

[quote name='White Cloud' timestamp='1380386738' post='2224633']
Absolutely correct!
[/quote]

The C.S.E was a rigorous exam procedure , even at Grade 3 level.

[Lowender]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1380385657' post='2224619']
Scientifically speaking ( and I've got a Grade 3 C.S.E in Biology , so I know what I'm talking about ) , older wood usually has a lower moisture content and the resin contained within the grain of the wood crystallises over time , supposedly giving it a different resonance
[/quote]

Also, there is something called "metal fatigue." When metal vibrates over time it actually changes molecular structure. This is why old saxophones sound more mellow and cymbals go dead. (No, it isn't from a build up of dirt as many believe). It's the same with strings -- you can clean them, but they just lose high end after being played over time.

As far as that is a factor in a guitar is arguable.

[jezzaboy]

There wasn`t any "reliced" basses but there was a few "stripped" P basses. I believe that in the late 60`s early 70`s, this was the fashion, relicing is the fashion at the moment.

[BetaFunk]

[quote name='jezzaboy' timestamp='1380393517' post='2224755']
There wasn`t any "reliced" basses but there was a few "stripped" P basses. I believe that in the late 60`s early 70`s, this was the fashion, relicing is the fashion at the moment.
[/quote]
As you say there were a few and nowhere near the current relicing craze has produced. It was less of a fashion and more of a 'how can i make my battered and chipped Precision look decent without spending any money on it'.

[risingson]

I wouldn't actively relic an instrument unless it actively relic'ed itself by me dropping it down a flight of concrete steps accidentally. But I love wear and tear on old basses, instruments with history are far cooler than stuff rolling off the production line looking brand spanking new, probably only really relevant to Fender, Gibson, Musicman etc.