Musicman20 Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 [quote name='thebassman' timestamp='1380630226' post='2228056'] That's a bit worrying, i play through a Genz Shuttlmax and a zingy Stingray, so a clean cab may display my poor technique . I currently use a Mesa 2x12 powerhouse cab, and love the tone of this combination. I am after something a bit lighter and more manageable, that's why i was looking at maybe either a 1x12 cab on it's own or maybe a pair of 1x12's. I guess i could just get a light 2x12. cheers thebassman [/quote] I doubt it...I wouldn't worry about it. If you are already playing a Ray, and you have a Genz amp, you are already providing quite a zingy and precise signal. The Ray was the bass that showed me (compared to a P bass for example) that notes can really be heard as well as felt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Not always.... I think a MM with it humbucker isn't always a precise sound. The pickup is very powerful as is the EQ... so it can be a sloppy sound before you even get to who ever is playing it. I actually replaced the pickup and EQ with a passive pickup on my MM for that very reason... and still today, practice mostly in passive mode for that reason on my jazzes. But then that is all harking back to the day when a studio engr scared the crap out of me by soloing the bass in a track... it wasn't clean ... and it was a real wake-up call to how my playing was heard. With today's advances, you don't need to be that clean... as the mix time can hide a lot of that...but that is time consuming in getting the sound down. Again..it depends which way you want to go.... but you can always dirty up something... it is a lot harder to clean it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 [quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1380648669' post='2228468'] I actually replaced the pickup and EQ with a passive pickup on my MM for that very reason... [/quote] So you took away the very thing that makes a MM a MM? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1380650048' post='2228505'] So you took away the very thing that makes a MM a MM? [/quote] Yep... I had Kent Armstrong knock up a few pickups as he was custom winding for all sorts at the time so I couldn't turn that offer down.. I had tired of the MM sound but loved the way the bass felt...rock solid neck and great to play. So yes..exactly that. It was the end of the MM for me in that I was de-tuning and needed a 5st... thought about a MM 5 but as I said, the sound was tired from my perspective so I then got the 5...and never wanted a 4 again. That MM remains a fondly remembered bass, but things moved on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380576503' post='2227475'] But why do people always mention the 'poor technique' thing....its quite derogatory.[/quote] [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380549443' post='2226881'] Personally, I'd opt for a Berg CN212. [/quote] So is stating, on a thread specifically about BF products, that you would buy something completely different - especially when you don't bother to give any justification of your reasoning. And I agree that a very clean set-up does expose any technical deficiencies in its owner's playing. Still, you can be a "good player" but have poor technique, can't you? Edited October 2, 2013 by Conan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1380699656' post='2228979'] So is stating, on a thread specifically about BF products, that you would buy something completely different - especially when you don't bother to give any justification of your reasoning. And I agree that a very clean set-up does expose any technical deficiencies in its owner's playing. Still, you can be a "good player" but have poor technique, can't you? [/quote] Ay? I'm just giving my point of view. It isn't really derogatory to BF as I haven't said anything overly negative. I haven't heard or seen the new BF cabs, and I hope they sound and look as good as the descriptions that are around on the site. I've tried an early Compact, at the time, not for me. The whole technique thing is getting tired now. Unless you are playing technical music for a living, no one cares anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twigman Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1380699656' post='2228979'] a very clean set-up does expose any technical deficiencies in its owner's playing [/quote] A characteristic for which I am grateful. If it wasn't for the transparency of my setup I would be oblivious to the shortcomings of my technique and thus would not work to improve it. I think having a Barefaced cab has made me a (slightly) better player (albeit still a hamfisted amateur).....it has improved me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Twigman' timestamp='1380711946' post='2229249'] A characteristic for which I am grateful. If it wasn't for the transparency of my setup I would be oblivious to the shortcomings of my technique and thus would not work to improve it. I think having a Barefaced cab has made me a (slightly) better player (albeit still a hamfisted amateur).....it has improved me. [/quote] No offence, I mean you were probably just as good before, but a cab cannot really make you a better player. It might make you play more as you like the sound, which makes you better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twigman Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380712368' post='2229267'] No offence, I mean you were probably just as good before, but a cab cannot really make you a better player. It might make you play more as you like the sound, which makes you better. [/quote] It makes me better precisely because I can hear what is wrong with my playing and do something about it. I have heard things that I previously had not noticed and been able to correct them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barkin Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380702708' post='2229030'] The whole technique thing is getting tired now. Unless you are playing technical music for a living, no one cares anyway. [/quote] I disagree, quite strongly, but each to his own. I returned to playing bass about 4 years ago, after a break of some 8 years. I thought I was doing OK, until i was forced to offload my gear from the '80s in favour of some modern lightweight cabs. These are in a different league in terms of clarity & transparency, and it was quickly apparent that my technique and playing was a lot more sloppy than I thought. I think I'm a far better player now as a result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Twigman' timestamp='1380712528' post='2229270'] It makes me better precisely because I can hear what is wrong with my playing and do something about it. I have heard things that I previously had not noticed and been able to correct them.[/quote] [quote name='barkin' timestamp='1380713297' post='2229291'] some modern lightweight cabs are in a different league in terms of clarity & transparency, and it was quickly apparent that my technique and playing was a lot more sloppy than I thought. I think I'm a far better player now as a result.[/quote] Yes, that is exactly what I meant (although maybe I did not put it quite so succinctly!) It is hard to improve if you don't know what you are doing wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380712368' post='2229267'] a cab cannot really make you a better player. [/quote] No, of course it can't. But if it makes you realise that you can do things better, and you then put the effort into doing them better - then (indirectly) the cab has made you a better player by making you aware of what needs improving. I think so, anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380702708' post='2229030'] The whole technique thing is getting tired now. Unless you are playing technical music for a living, no one cares anyway. [/quote] Come back here saying that when you've developed RSI! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1380728634' post='2229676'] Come back here saying that when you've developed RSI! [/quote] I've seen a few wrist problems with guitarist friends. I had a strict bass tutor from day one, on a thick p bass neck. No problems in 16 years....so hopefully he taught me well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raggy Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380702708' post='2229030'] The whole technique thing is getting tired now. Unless you are playing technical music for a living, no one cares anyway. [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1380743970' post='2230016'] I've seen a few wrist problems with guitarist friends. I had a strict bass tutor from day one, on a thick p bass neck. No problems in 16 years....so hopefully he taught me well. [/quote] So you probably have pretty decent technique! So why all the "technique is bad" vibes? We are not talking about playing "technical" stuff, but just that having a clean (or transparent if you like) sounding set-up makes you aware of things like sloppy fingering (oo-er!), which is often caused by poor hand/wrist/thumb position... Listen to me sounding like I know what I am talking about! Edited October 3, 2013 by Conan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 Pshh, why even bother learning to use your fingers, just use the bass to scratch your nuts. Actually playing notes is for jazzers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1380806667' post='2230847'] Actually playing notes is for jazzers. [/quote] That's right! The bastards! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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