Lowender Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) Right off the bat -- if you love something and are willing to pay the price, it's worth it. Enjoy. Now, let's move on, shall we? One can argue that MIM aren't as good as a Squier VM, therefore it's overpriced, and that may be a viable argument. There are dozens of boutique and custom built basses that cost 10 times as much as a stock Fender but aren't 10 times as good so the cost can't be justified. Maybe. But which company do you think is the most outrageously overpriced? I have to go with Fodera. True, personally I'm not that impressed with the basses. They play well but don't sound all that great and don't look all that great. But that's subjective. And even if I loved them, I'd STILL think the price was nuts. THIS [url="http://www.fodera.com/FoderaAdmin/Uploads/ContentDocument/Fodera%20Price%20List%20Feb.2013.pdf"]http://www.fodera.co...%20Feb.2013.pdf[/url] is not only obscene, it's insulting in my opinion. And those numbers are American dollars, so double that. (And add shipping costs from the U.S. ) And Fodera's don't even come finished! It's bare wood, so it looks worn just a few months after purchase. I feel this is a product that depends mostly on "snob appeal." The funny thing is, besides a few famous endorsees (who I assume get basses for free) it seems that the people buying these instruments are more hobbyists looking for that "dream instrument" than pros who need a solid workhorse. No offense is intended toward Forera owners. But if there's anyone out there more bonkers in regard to cost, let's hear it! Edited October 19, 2013 by Lowender Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebassman75 Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 In terms of whether a Fodera is overpriced, it's a relative question. There's nothing else on the market like a Fodera as far as I can see so you can't say that it's overpriced because there's nothing to compare it to in terms of design, materials, sound, feel.. Your point about MIM and Squires is far easier to work out because you could argue that the design, materials, sound, feel and component parts are so very similar but a Fodera is in many terms 'unique' to the market, which is why the company can dictate the price.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skej21 Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I always thought that Fodera were known for NOT giving any kind of freebies to endorsers. Those guys endorse the products and pay for them because they believe in them. Im also pretty sure that Foderas are finished and won't wear that quickly. Also, US dollars aren't doubled to get the British prices. £1000 is roughly $1500, so if anything the price in pounds of stuff on that list is about a third cheaper (plus postage etc). Personally, I agree about the sound. They are stunning basses both aesthetically and in terms of quality and worth every penny from that side if things but the thing that would stop me from buying one is that I PERSONALLY don't like the sound and sooner or later it would bug me enough that id sell it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) Fodera's are expensive but, imo, they are not overpriced. "Overpriced" is so subjective I wonder where this thread can go and still make sense. Edited October 19, 2013 by chris_b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I don't think Fodera's are overpriced to be honest, never played one mind. In the guitar world I've never understood the appeal of PRS. The entry level US models yes... but the AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA grade updates and so on..... ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Can't get my head round status, seems a lot of money for a plastic neck! Ok I'm sure there's more to it but when I read from various posts that the neck heel is hollow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Any bass I can't afford is overpriced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hutton Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 [quote name='neepheid' timestamp='1382180761' post='2248946'] Any bass I can't afford is overpriced. [/quote] Excellent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Yawn... Yet another Foderas are overpriced thread. What next? Is Mark King better than Flea? How about posting a video of a cross-dressing Korean bassist or a drummer at the wrong gig... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapolpora Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) When you compare high end basses to top of the line other instruments I find basses relatively cheap. Admittedly other instrumentalists don't have to spalsh out on amplification like we do - but when you consider a professional flute will cost you between £5000-12000, the price of bass seems reasonable. The flautist may not have a dozen instruments and never ending GAS though Edited October 19, 2013 by lapolpora Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Vincent Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 My answer to the original question is US Fenders. How they can justify such a comparatively high price for a factory mass produced instrument is beyond me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thodrik Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Its all relative and for most people 'overpriced' will just equate to a high end bass that they don't actually like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou7shined Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 In the case of vintage it needn't be high end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snotsnail Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I do find both Fender and Gibson re-finishing the same instrument models over and over for decades and stating their uniqueness and high pricing lies in only so many produced with the same colour scheme and minor hardware set up within basically a factory line pretty incredible way of controlling the market, good for their business model, but whether that's actual true value for the recipient is a personal thing I guess. Does kind of skew innovation in the market at an affordable level a bit maybe. I'm probs a bit out on a limb with this though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1382158382' post='2248754'] Right off the bat -- if you love something and are willing to pay the price, it's worth it. Enjoy. Now, let's move on, shall we? One can argue that MIM aren't as good as a Squier VM, therefore it's overpriced, and that may be a viable argument. There are dozens of boutique and custom built basses that cost 10 times as much as a stock Fender but aren't 10 times as good so the cost can't be justified. Maybe. But which company do you think is the most outrageously overpriced? I have to go with Fodera. True, personally I'm not that impressed with the basses. They play well but don't sound all that great and don't look all that great. But that's subjective. And even if I loved them, I'd STILL think the price was nuts. THIS [url="http://www.fodera.com/FoderaAdmin/Uploads/ContentDocument/Fodera%20Price%20List%20Feb.2013.pdf"]http://www.fodera.co...%20Feb.2013.pdf[/url] is not only obscene, it's insulting in my opinion. And those numbers are American dollars, so double that. (And add shipping costs from the U.S. ) And Fodera's don't even come finished! It's bare wood, so it looks worn just a few months after purchase. I feel this is a product that depends mostly on "snob appeal." The funny thing is, besides a few famous endorsees (who I assume get basses for free) it seems that the people buying these instruments are more hobbyists looking for that "dream instrument" than pros who need a solid workhorse. No offense is intended toward Forera owners. But if there's anyone out there more bonkers in regard to cost, let's hear it! [/quote] Posted at 4.53 AM? Do you stay up at night and try to think up silly posts that will get up peoples noses? I would be very interested to know how many Foderas you have played and in what circumstances to formulate this opinion that they are all smoke and mirrors and that you will not be suckered into purchasing one. Yet another thread based on someones assertion that they wouldn't buy something that they [u]CAN'T AFFORD ANYWAY[/u] . It's like listening to someone on Income Support talk about how they have decided not to start their own International Space Programme because they have decided that those billions of pounds could be better spent on International Aid . Do you think Vinnie Fodera reads threads like this and then lies awake at night worrying that people who couldn't buy his basses to begin with have now been enlightened by one of these" discussions " and now ... [i]really[/i] won't buy one ? You obviously have no knowledge of how Fodera have gained their formidable reputation for excellence . They most certainly do not give away basses for free to famous players ( I would like to see you say that to the crew at Fodera and then listen to their reaction ; native New Yorkers don't suffer fools gladly , to say the least), but the top players particulaly in NYC but now also the rest of the World gravitate towards them because of the degree of care and attention they put into making their basses and looking after their customers. Fodera are a fantastic example of a small business making high quality products in an individualistic and uncompromising way for a niche market , and long may they prosper. Are Foderas expensive? Well , they cost a lot of money , but if you understand the amount of hours it takes uniquely skilled craftsmen to make them then they are very fairly priced . Are they actually any good as basses? Yes, they most certainly are , but they will only suit people after a particular sound and feel , just like most basses. No bass can be all things to all men . If you don't like them then that is fine , but that in itsef isn't justification for your assertion that they are not really worthwhile instruments . Regarding the rest of what you have to say though , you have hit on a fair point . Are very expensive bespoke-made basses worth the extra over a decent quality "ordinary" bass? Well , it all depends how fussy and exacting you are as a player and what is important to you . A stock Fender can be as satisfying as a Fodera , depending on the sound and feel you want from a bass . The law of diminishing returns applies to buying basses as much or more as anything else, and the final results you can get with a bass that cost ten thousand pounds are not neccesarilly much better or even much different to the results you can get with one that cost two thousand quid, but the experience of creating those results will differ between the two instruments. Only the individual can decide which is most preferable. Why have I just spent so much time typing this response? I just fell for it ...again. Edited October 19, 2013 by Dingus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowender Posted October 19, 2013 Author Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1382186551' post='2249037'] Posted at 4.53 AM? Do you stay up at night and try to think up silly posts that will get up peoples noses? I would be very interested to know how many Foderas you have played and in what circumstances to formulate this opinion that they are all smoke and mirrors and that you will not be suckered into purchasing one. Yet another thread based on someones assertion that they wouldn't buy something that they [u]CAN'T AFFORD ANYWAY[/u] . It's like listening to someone on Income Support talk about how they have decided not to start their own International Space Programme because they have decided that those billions of pounds could be better spent on International Aid . Do you think Vinnie Fodera reads threads like this and then lies awake at night worrying that people who couldn't buy his basses to begin with have now been enlightened by one of these" discussions " and now ... [i]really[/i] won't buy one ? You obviously have no knowledge of how Fodera have gained their formidable reputation for excellence . They most certainly do not give away basses for free to famous players ( I would like to see you say that to the crew at Fodera and then listen to their reaction ; native New Yorkers don't suffer fools gladly , to say the least), but the top players particulaly in NYC but now also the rest of the World gravitate towards them because of the degree of care and attention they put into making their basses and looking after their customers. Fodera are a fantastic example of a small business making high quality products in an individualistic and uncompromising way for a niche market , and long may they prosper. Are Foderas expensive? Well , they cost a lot of money , but if you understand the amount of hours it takes uniquely skilled craftsmen to make them then they are very fairly priced . Are they actually any good as basses? Yes, they most certainly are , but they will only suit people after a particular sound and feel , just like most basses. No bass can be all things to all men . If you don't like them then that is fine , but that in itsef isn't justification for your assertion that they are not really worthwhile instruments . Regarding the rest of what you have to say though , you have hit on a fair point . Are very expensive bespoke-made basses worth the extra over a decent quality "ordinary" bass? Well , it all depends how fussy and exacting you are as a player and what is important to you . A stock Fender can be as satisfying as a Fodera , depending on the sound and feel you want from a bass . The law of diminishing returns applies to buying basses as much or more as anything else, and the final results you can get with a bass that cost ten thousand pounds are not neccesarilly much better or even much different to the results you can get with one that cost two thousand quid, but the experience of creating those results will differ between the two instruments. Only the individual can decide which is most preferable. Why have I just spent so much time typing this response? I just fell for it ...again. [/quote] Not everyone is in the same time zone as you mate. : ) Another thing you're wrong about (and it cracks me up how people make these assumptions) is that I OBVIOUSLY have no knowledge of Fodera's! lol !!! You're wrong again. I owned one. I kept trying to convince myself it was the Rolls Royce of basses but it just didn't cut it. The final nail in the coffin is when I was hired to play a bass part, (via email mp3's) and used the Fodera and the client came back asking if I could get a thicker sound. I added more lows -- he still didn't like it. Then I recorded the part with a Squier J Deluxe. His reaction? THAT'S IT! He was right. It simply sounded better. That's when I realized, if I don't like the sound, or the look, it doesn't work live and it doesn't work on recordings, why do I own this thing? To tell everyone I have an expensive bass? I sold it for a profit. Edited October 19, 2013 by Lowender Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elom Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 The bass that you own but never play, that's the overpriced one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 [quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1382192034' post='2249108'] ....It simply sounded better. That's when I realized, if I don't like the sound, or the look, it doesn't work live and it doesn't work on recordings, why do I own this thing?.... [/quote] I don't disagree but what your story actually illustrates is the importance of using the right tool for the job, not that one bass is inherently better or worse than the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1382192034' post='2249108'] Not everyone is in the same time zone as you mate. : ) Another thing you're wrong about (and it cracks me up how people make these assumptions) is that I OBVIOUSLY have no knowledge of Fodera's! lol !!! You're wrong again. I owned one. I kept trying to convince myself it was the Rolls Royce of basses but it just didn't cut it. The final nail in the coffin is when I was hired to play a bass part, (via email mp3's) and used the Fodera and the client came back asking if I could get a thicker sound. I added more lows -- he still didn't like it. Then I recorded the part with a Squier J Deluxe. His reaction? THAT'S IT! He was right. It simply sounded better. That's when I realized, if I don't like the sound, or the look, it doesn't work live and it doesn't work on recordings, why do I own this thing? To tell everyone I have an expensive bass? I sold it for a profit. [/quote] You may well be making a false assumption about what time zone I am in, too . You are also wrong to assume that I am trying to infer that you have never played a Fodera. You may have played or indeed owned one but how many others have you played? Foderas vary greatly from example to example - they are a custom builder after all- and so even if you didn't like yours that doesn't mean they are all like that . I have played loads of Foderas , and I didn't like most of them either , so consequently I have never bought one , but that doesn't mean that I would want to denigrate them in any way . Different strokes for different folks and all that . Some of their five string basses are amazing , it has to be said, and put the competition to shame , so they would be a worthwhile purchase for someone who primarily plays a five ( not me) . What's for certain is the amount of hours put into each bass justifies the price . If you don't like 'em , don't buy one . No one will force you . Your Squire anecdote proves nothing except the eccentricities of people's preferences . If you crave a Fender tone ( like I usually do) then a Fodera won't satisfy you , in all likelihood . Most exotic wood basses sound to polite and sweet for my taste nowadays ( with certain notable exceptions). But does that mean that exotic wood basses like Fodera are a con or for the gullable ? Edited October 19, 2013 by Dingus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowender Posted October 19, 2013 Author Share Posted October 19, 2013 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1382193153' post='2249128'] I don't disagree but what your story actually illustrates is the importance of using the right tool for the job, not that one bass is inherently better or worse than the other. [/quote] Good point. That's why I have several basses. But then, what's the point of that "ultimate" bass, if it's just one of many potential tools? And not necessarily one that you'd go to very often? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowender Posted October 19, 2013 Author Share Posted October 19, 2013 [quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1382193831' post='2249137'] You may well be making a false assumption about what time zone I am in, too . ..................... [color=#ff0000]Then why'd you mention it? [/color] ....................... You are also wrong to assume that I am trying to infer that you have never played a Fodera. ..................... [color=#ff0000]I assumed it because that's what you said. : /[/color] ............. You may have played or indeed owned one but how many others have you played? .................................... [color=#ff0000]Quite a few. I spend a lot of time in the States. Care to try again? [/color] [color=#ff0000]........................................[/color] Foderas vary greatly from example to example - they are a custom builder after all- and so even if you didn't like yours that doesn't mean they are all like that . I have played loads of Foderas , and I didn't like most of them either , so consequently I have never bought one , but that doesn't mean that I would want to denigrate them in any way . .................... [color=#ff0000]I see. You actually share my opinion but want to make a point that when I say it , it's denigrating. Got .it. [/color] [color=#ff0000].......................................................................[/color] Different strokes for different folks and all that . Some of their five string basses are amazing , it has to be said, and put the competition to shame , so they would be a worthwhile purchase for someone who primarily plays a five ( not me) . What's for certain is the amount of hours put into each bass justifies the price . If you don't like 'em , don't buy one . No one will force you . ............................ [color=#ff0000]Thanks for the tip. [/color] ................................. Your Squire anecdote proves nothing except the eccentricities of people's preferences . ............................ [color=#ff0000]No, it doesn't. The point is that the guy was calling it as he saw it and he was right. [/color] [color=#ff0000]...................................................[/color] If you crave a Fender tone ( like I usually do) then a Fodera won't satisfy you , in all likelihood . Most exotic wood basses sound to polite and sweet for my taste nowadays ( with certain notable exceptions). But does that mean that exotic wood basses like Fodera are a con or for the gullable ? .............................. [color="#ff0000"]When did I use the word "gullable." Maybe you need reading glasses mate. Yo';re seeing things that aren't there. [/color] [/quote] ..... .......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1382194302' post='2249142'] ..... .......... [/quote] [quote name='Lowender' timestamp='1382194302' post='2249142'] ..... .......... [/quote] As usual , your manners betray your true intention . Your the one who brought up time zones . I never said that you hadn't played a Fodera. I questioned [u]HOW MANY [/u] you had played. You say you've played a lot of Foderas in the States -fair enough . I 've spent a lot of time in the States , too , and the only place I've come across a lot of Foderas is in Vinnie Fodera's workshop or at the NAAM show , so presumably that is where you encountered all these basses too . You are indeed denigrating Fodera basses in way in which I am not , and I would explain to you why that is if it were not for the fact that I am sure the subtleties of the English language would be wasted on someone of such definite "opinions" as yourself. You imply in your post that they are a choice for players less informed than yourself . Thank you for your hilarious suggestion that I need reading glasses . May I suggest to you in the same humorous and friendly manner that it is better to need reading glasses than reading lessons , as you seem to be in need of . Edited October 19, 2013 by Dingus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jellyfish Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 [quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1382181215' post='2248960'] Yawn... Yet another Foderas are overpriced thread. What next? Is Mark King better than Flea? How about posting a video of a cross-dressing Korean bassist or a drummer at the wrong gig... [/quote] Gotta echo that to be honest. That, and Ritter threads. [u][i]If you aren't the target audience, don't worry about it.[/i][/u] Seriously though, Fodera make instruments that are clearly different from your average off-the-shelf bass, and even other custom builders to a degree. They're selling them for what they think they're worth, and if people are buying them, they must be doing something right. In fact, if you compared all basses in the £1000-£1500 price range, you'd find many people would be able to pick out the overprices ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowender Posted October 19, 2013 Author Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1382195239' post='2249158'] As usual , your manners betray your true intention . ................. [b]Make an accusation to take attention off your own rude comments. Works every time. [/b] [b].................................[/b] Your the one who brought up time zones . ...................... [b]Read your first sentence from your first post. [/b] [b].....................................[/b] I never said that you hadn't played a Fodera. I questioned [u]HOW MANY [/u] you had played. You say you've played a lot in the States -fair enough . I 've spent a lot of time in the States , too , and the only place I've come across a lot of Foderas is in Vinnie Fodera's workshop or at the NAAM show , so presumably that is where you encounters all these basses too . ........................ [b]There and several store in Manhattan have them. As do some friends. [/b] [b]........................[/b] You are indeed denigrating Fodera basses in way in which I am not , and I would explain to you why that is if it were not for the fact thast I am sure the subtleties of the English language would be wasted on someone of such definite "opinions" as yourself. You imply in your post that they are a choice for players less informed than yourself . ..................................... [b]You're projecting again mate. You may want to watch that so not to look so foolish. [/b] [b]......................................................[/b] Thank you for your hilarious suggestion that I need reading glasses . May I suggest to you in the same humorous and friendly manner that it is better to need reading glasses than reading lessons , as you seem to be in need of . ........................ [b]Nice try. Better luck next time. [/b] [/quote] ................ Edited October 19, 2013 by Lowender Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slapmonsta Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 [quote name='roger' timestamp='1382180438' post='2248940'] Can't get my head round status, seems a lot of money for a plastic neck! Ok I'm sure there's more to it but when I read from various posts that the neck heel is hollow! [/quote] Sorry fella but you've obviously never played one.The construction on every one I've ever owned has been totally faultless,the "plastic neck" is a joy to play,is even with no dead spots,and will stay rock-solidly in tune in the most demanding of gig temperatures.Undeniably superbly made instruments,whether you like their "styling" or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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