Immo Custom Shop/Encore TwinSplit P-Bass

[Immo]

Finally!
Work, general indolence and other stuff led to suspensions of all my projects I used to coin as "Immo Custom Shop". But enough! Finally, it's time to do the job again!

Previous projects (a Tele/Jag bass mixture with EB-3 electronics and Thinline Tele Bass) are postponed as they demanded building nearly from scratch. My new project is based on something slightly less demanding. Already at the time of acquisition, the bass is nearly fully operational.
We are talking about a nice material for a project bass, an instrument manufactured in the vile depths of 90's in India - Encore Precision Bass. White pickups, Fender type headstock and blocky string tree = 100% Indian Encore.



[i]Project bass, he said?[/i] Let's head back to the start. Two years ago I found an offer - a white split coil PU from Indian Encore P-Bass. That little P-thingy reached my mind telepathically and asked me to buy it, so I reached deep into my wallet and fulfilled it's demands. Said pickup sounded pretty well when tested (suspended upside down on a pickguard over the strings of another bass). It was white/creamy, so I started thinking about the white bass with black pickguard. And then about adding a the black split PU in the bridge position.... And so I was thinking about it, and the years passed by. Then suddenly 12 days ago I was idly browsing the internet sales and came across this here Encore bass, with the same type of pickups and origin. I immediately thought - man, that's it! Called dibs on the bass, I bought and two days ago it finally arrived!

God, the maintenance of this bass was sloppy! Strings - rusty. Screws, springs - the same. Neck - a bit bananized (as we call it in Poland), action: ~ 1cm, pots - loose, bridge - not in line with the neck.
A little worried, I took the bass apart and found some interesting wood:



What kind of wood is it? Cosmic wood, mahogany, oak, stone-pine, limba, korina, rosewood, walnut, nyatoh (a.k.a. nato or Indonesian mahogany) or... God alone knows what else, each asked person had his own idea. I'm still not sure what it is, but it sounds cool and resonates nicely - that's what matters. The body is very heavy, no neck-dive. Lacquer's battered and boring, so I guess eventually repaint it, especially if the whole body has interesting grain.
Inspection of the neck made ​​me realize that the truss rod nut was completely loose, explaining why the neck was bent under the pressure of the strings (with no strings it was actually straight). Unfortunately, the nut has a hole for the allen size 17/72 inch (or some other ridiculous imperial measure; in metric, it's approximately 5.6 mm). As you can guess, 5mm allen slips, 6mm - won't fit.

So, I started to bring the bass back to usefulness. I tightened the truss rod a bit with the screwdriver (temporary solution). I added some old tapewounds, replaced the bridge with a one with several slots per string on each saddle), lowered the action... Okay, rock and roll!

Geez! Electronics cracks and creaks when I try to negotiate, butterfly part of G tuner falls into the annoying vibration and string A induces a strange sound inside the neck. The sound of that bass! for the price, it sounds sensational (especially A string) - like a true thoroughbred P-Bass! With it's quite comfortable neck and a decent, though battered body, it makes a great bass for project and I'm sure I haven't wasted my money. I think I found an instrument which, after renovation, will be really great!

I came up with a plan.

Things to do :
- doing some decent neck adjustment
- drilling new holes on the bridge so it won't be misaligned and askew
- replacing the pickguard with a black one (with holes suitable for Encore PU, which has a slight diference in shape to standard one)
- routing a new cavity for the second split coil PU
- changing pots (I'll keep the original capacitor, as it works perfectly the way I want it to work) and jack and setting up a V-V-T configuration (or maybe VBT, though this variant seems better for two single coils)
- installing a thumbrest, bridge chrome cover and white chicken- head knobs
In the first phase ready bass should look like that:



If there are funds and ambitions, the next points would be:
- Adding some custom electronics with some switches, like this maybe:



- Repainting the body for some nice transparent color (or maybe transparent black?) and custom pickguard

I'll keep you updated with news and pics. Keep your fingers crossed!

[dlloyd]

Looking forward to seeing the paint stripped... Maybe these are a source of decent quality bodies.

[Immo]

[quote name='dlloyd' timestamp='1386168752' post='2296663']
Looking forward to seeing the paint stripped... Maybe these are a source of decent quality bodies.
[/quote]
The thing that keeps me away from the repainting idea is a fact that I have no experience, ability or equipment to do a repainting, while the cost of cheapest professional guitar painting offered around is equal to the price of the bass itself.

[allighatt0r]

People have had brilliant results with waxing instead of full on painting. There are build diaries somewhere. I think it was Truckstop and his ibanez blazers that I'm thinking of.

[Immo]

[quote name='allighatt0r' timestamp='1386171894' post='2296718']
People have had brilliant results with waxing instead of full on painting. There are build diaries somewhere. I think it was Truckstop and his ibanez blazers that I'm thinking of.
[/quote]
I'll do some research, but those are cosmetics; the structural changes (routing and fixing the position of the bridge) and electronics (new wiring, pots and switches) are my primary concern now

Speaking of the structure, I have a driller at a standby. Will fix the bridge today. Also, I'll prepare the pickguard for new electronics.
Speaking of the latter, I bought three B500K pots and two DPDT "on-off-on" switches for new wiring (serial/off/parallel for each PU).

Edited December 4, 2013 by Immo

[Immo]

All necessary components bought.
Bridge cover, chicken-head knobs, flatwound strings, screws n' stuff.
Tomorrow I'll do some routing and soldering. Will post pics from the process

[lee4]

[quote name='allighatt0r' timestamp='1386171894' post='2296718']
People have had brilliant results with waxing instead of full on painting. There are build diaries somewhere. I think it was Truckstop and his ibanez blazers that I'm thinking of.
[/quote]
I stripped and waxed a friends Samik P bass.
Get it totally striped,dye it then wax it.Just make sure that the dye will not react with the wax.

Edited December 7, 2013 by lee4

[Immo]

[quote name='lee4' timestamp='1386455518' post='2300433']
I stripped and waxed a friends Samik P bass.
Get it totally striped,dye it then wax it.Just make sure that the dye will not react with the wax.
[/quote]
Not really sure if I want to refinish it at all - maybe instead I'll let the time to do relicing job on it?

[Immo]

Today the chicken-head knobs were delivered to me and, man, they have that cool vintage vibe even when they're still in a zip bag!

Body routing went wrong (fortunately, I first started with the space for additional pot which will be covered by the pickguard) and I decided to leave it to PRO's. I left the body in luthier's hands and will pick it up at Friday. Day before, a package with all the missing hardware - bridge cover, springs and screws - and strings will be delivered, so I predict that fully playable and gigable instrument will be ready on Sunday.

[Immo]

GHS Precision Flatwound strings, bridge chromed cover, screws, pots and cables - this came to me few hours ago. I have all the stuff I need now. When the routing will be done by a pro, the bass will be ready to be put together and rocked.
Plus, I bought new power source for 5 effects and coiled cable as a bonus!

[Immo]

Two screws for bridge broke when almost totally screwed into the body.
Project needs to be postponed until I'll buy a new bridge with other screw layout, as the broken ones are unmoveable.

EDIT: I guess "unmoveable" is not a word in my dictionary. I removed the most problematic screw and I can continue.

Edited December 13, 2013 by Immo

[Immo]

There she is:


Sounds pretty neat! Went simple on the wiring and it's only Vol, Vol, Tone.

[Cosmo Valdemar]

[quote name='Immo' timestamp='1387058333' post='2307917']
There she is:


Sounds pretty neat! Went simple on the wiring and it's only Vol, Vol, Tone.
[/quote]
Fantastic! I do love the PP arrangement. It's no wonder Entwistle was so fond of it.

[Immo]

[quote name='Cosmo Valdemar' timestamp='1387060873' post='2307940']
Fantastic! I do love the PP arrangement. It's no wonder Entwistle was so fond of it.
[/quote]
Yeah, but something is wrong. You'd expect the bass would sound like a punchier Jazz Bass - it has the same wiring and similar PU layout. In Jazz Bass when two PU's are on the same volume level (balanced, that is), it has an even sound (you'd say - a balance between the sound of either PU's).
But in this bass - it doesn't happen. If both PU's are balanced, the instrument sounds much brighter and with less low end (sort of like when a humbucker has reversed phase or two humbuckers are set in series). The effect stops whenever either pickup is set on higher volume than other. I was thinking that maybe it occurs because one of the coils is set improperly and it results in improper phase or something?

[Grreth]

That looks fantastic! Keep us posted on the pick-up/phasing issue, please.

[Shockwave]

[quote name='Immo' timestamp='1387106021' post='2308180']
Yeah, but something is wrong. You'd expect the bass would sound like a punchier Jazz Bass - it has the same wiring and similar PU layout. In Jazz Bass when two PU's are on the same volume level (balanced, that is), it has an even sound (you'd say - a balance between the sound of either PU's).
But in this bass - it doesn't happen. If both PU's are balanced, the instrument sounds much brighter and with less low end (sort of like when a humbucker has reversed phase or two humbuckers are set in series). The effect stops whenever either pickup is set on higher volume than other. I was thinking that maybe it occurs because one of the coils is set improperly and it results in improper phase or something?
[/quote]

Switch the bridge pickups wires with each other.

R

Edited December 31, 2013 by Shockwave

[Immo]

[quote name='Shockwave' timestamp='1388495917' post='2322631']
Switch the bridge pickups wires with each other.
[/quote]
Ok, I'll try switching the wires, that may help...

But anyway, right now I'm considering ordering a balance/blend pot with PUSH-PUSH switch (my entrusted shop has only blend pots with that switch, so I'd give it a whirl) whenever my salary arrives. Will rewire everything to V-B-T configuration with PUSH-PUSH wired either to be:
[b]a. [/b]a quick phase reversal switch
[b]b. [/b]series/parallel switch
[b]c. [/b]on/off switch for an entire bass
[b]d.[/b] tone pot bypass
Dunno which option would be the best.

Either way, first I'll check whether the whole PU configuration would work correctly in V-B-T.

Will keep you guys posted.

Edited January 2, 2014 by Immo

[FlatEric]

Nice.

I am a big fan of the Double P.

I have a Canadian Odyssey, which has the switching you were looking for.

This one.
[URL=http://s779.photobucket.com/user/FlatEricPics/media/Od1-1.jpg.html][IMG]http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/yy74/FlatEricPics/Od1-1.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

When I first had it, there was "much playing around with the switching" but after the novelty had worn off,
I now leave then in phase, in series - which is how your is now and use the Vol and Tone controls.
Other switching options take away some of the power/punch of the bass.

Perhaps leave it for a while and see how you get on?
You may end up doing it and then setting the switches to what you have already.

Cheers.

[dannybuoy]

[quote name='Immo' timestamp='1388666466' post='2324492']
Ok, I'll try switching the wires, that may help...

But anyway, right now I'm considering ordering a balance/blend pot with PUSH-PUSH switch (my entrusted shop has only blend pots with that switch, so I'd give it a whirl) whenever my salary arrives. Will rewire everything to V-B-T configuration with PUSH-PUSH wired either to be:
[b]a. [/b]a quick phase reversal switch
[b]b. [/b]series/parallel switch
[b]c. [/b]on/off switch for an entire bass
[b]d.[/b] tone pot bypass
Dunno which option would be the best.

Either way, first I'll check whether the whole PU configuration would work correctly in V-B-T.

Will keep you guys posted.
[/quote]

I would go for option B!

A - out of phase just sounds bad.
B - sounds cool on a Jazz so should do here too.
C - possibly but you already have a volume control.
D - sounds like a good idea, but I reckon it would make it sound too bright and thin - it will sound bright enough as it is with the 500K pots.

[Immo]

[quote name='dannybuoy' timestamp='1388670357' post='2324558']

I would go for option B!

A - out of phase just sounds bad.
B - sounds cool on a Jazz so should do here too.
C - possibly but you already have a volume control.
D - sounds like a good idea, but I reckon it would make it sound too bright and thin - it will sound bright enough as it is with the 500K pots.
[/quote]

Cool, as my thoughts were similar. The B option is a neat vision - may sound as a sort of a... errr... "quadrobucker", I'd say.

[Immo]

Apart from the fact that the schematic shows a push/pull volume pot, is it a correct wiring for what I'm trying to achieve?

[Immo]

[quote name='FlatEric' timestamp='1388669066' post='2324543']
(...)
I now leave then in phase, in series - [b]which is how your is now[/b] and use the Vol and Tone controls.
(...)
[/quote]
Are you sure mine ain't in parallel?

[Immo]

BUMP! on my question about the wiring, today I'm gonna resolder the electronics and I need to know, how to do this

[Jonnyboy Rotten]

[quote name='Immo' timestamp='1386966681' post='2307058']
Two screws for bridge broke when almost totally screwed into the body.
Project needs to be postponed until I'll buy a new bridge with other screw layout, as the broken ones are unmoveable.

EDIT: I guess "unmoveable" is not a word in my dictionary. I removed the most problematic screw and I can continue.
[/quote]

How did you get the embedded screws out in the end? I got the same issue with my Squier P build and have had several very helpful suggestions but want to have as many options as poss when I come around to doing it!

[Immo]

[quote name='Jonnyboy Rotten' timestamp='1389353187' post='2333113']
How did you get the embedded screws out in the end? I got the same issue with my Squier P build and have had several very helpful suggestions but want to have as many options as poss when I come around to doing it!
[/quote]
Two screws broke:
- One on the "neck side" of the bridge (it was broken 1-2mm below the body level and I left it there as it wasn't necessary to mount the bridge on the "neck side").
- One on the bent side - and it was broken 1mm above the body level, so I used pliers and carefully and slowly unscrewed it. Nothing fancy.