Conan Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) [quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1386261783' post='2297910'] Thank you for not saying "Kettle lead". [/quote] I'm no sparky - but what's wrong with calling them "kettle leads"? Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead....Kettle lead.... kettle lead.... Joking aside (for the moment) - I have honestly never thought of buying a spare UK mains to IEC (or whatever you call it) lead! Now that I think about it, I've been lucky so far never to need one! Note to self - buy a spare Edited December 5, 2013 by Conan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) Ah-ha. Ah-ha ha ha. 'Just like that'. Kettle lead, lead kettle. Ha, ha. lead - kettle. Ha ha. Edited December 5, 2013 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RhysP Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1386262331' post='2297915'] I'm no sparky - but what's wrong with calling them "kettle leads"? [/quote] Because the connector on an actual kettle lead is a different shape so it wouldn't fit the mains input socket on an amp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1386262506' post='2297923'] Because the connector on an actual kettle lead is a different shape so it wouldn't fit the mains input socket on an amp. [/quote] Well bugger me - I never knew that! So why do they get called kettle leads then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Rotten Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) [quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1386261783' post='2297910'] Thank you for not saying "Kettle lead". [/quote] We specify them in PDU (Power Distribution Units) for clients' installations day in Day out. More Specifically it is IEC C13 (female) socket on the mains lead and where it plugs into, on the amp is called IEC C14 (male). Hello...? Hello...? Oh sorry, I thought you might be interested ! Edited December 5, 2013 by Jonnyboy Rotten Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='discreet' timestamp='1386262504' post='2297922'] Ah-ha. Ah-ha ha ha. 'Just like that'. Kettle lead, lead kettle. Ha, ha. lead - kettle. Ha ha. [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Jonnyboy Rotten' timestamp='1386262712' post='2297928'] We specify them in PDU (Power Distribution Units) for clients' installations day in Day out. More Specifically it is IEC C13 (female) socket on the mains lead and where it plugs into, on the amp is called IEC C14 (male). Hello...? Hello...? Oh sorry, I thought you might be interested ! [/quote] Fascinating! Well, OK... quite interesting anyway... And what (if anything) does IEC stand for? International Electrical Connector or something similar? The things you learn on Basschat! Edited December 5, 2013 by Conan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RhysP Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1386262689' post='2297927'] Well bugger me - I never knew that! So why do they get called kettle leads then? [/quote] Because there are lots of really stupid people about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Rotten Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Conan' timestamp='1386262843' post='2297931'] Fascinating! Well, OK... quite interesting anyway... And what (if anything) does IEC stand for? International Electrical Connector or something similar? The things you learn on Basschat! [/quote] International Electrotechnical Commission.... here....fill your boots - FYI a true kettle plug is IEC C15/C16 [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60320"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60320[/url] Keep asking - there is more where that came from....or are you begging for mercy! mwahahahha! Edited December 5, 2013 by Jonnyboy Rotten Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Unequivocably, an amp should come with a power cable. How could it be argued otherwise ? The power cable is part of the amp. It's the part that connects it to the mains. I find that I get far more output from my amp when I use it in conjunction with electricity, and most other people probably find the same, so if I sold my amp I would include the mains cable it was supplied with . If I didn't have that mains cable, I would tell the buyer. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1386260873' post='2297893'] A bass sold without strings..? After all, we all have spares, don't we..? Well don't we..? [/quote] Yes I have spare strings , and I would happily use them to strangle someone who sold me an amp without a bleedin' power lead ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Bassy Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 So, can I sell a cab without a speaker lead? - after all it's pretty useless without one. - and how long should said speaker (or indeed mains) lead be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I'd certainly expect to be told if an amp I'd bought didn't come with a power lead. And they'll always be 'kettle leads' to me... sorry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyquipment Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Yes it should come with the power lead. It's like buying a telly with no remote!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1386265804' post='2298022'] So, can I sell a cab without a speaker lead? - after all it's pretty useless without one. - and how long should said speaker (or indeed mains) lead be? [/quote] Was one supplied new..? I think that's the key, not 'is it useless without'. Just my view, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I voted yes as they come with them new so should really be sold on with one I have bought most of my amps second hand and they have always been sent with the lead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I would expect one to be included... but I personally don't care as I have many of various lengths. In fact, I'd probably not use the one included because I tend to use longer ones than standard. But yes, I'd find it quite normal for a power lead to be included. For that reason, if it's not included, I would expect that fact to be indicated. No biggie, 'though. As for the "it came with one as new, so it should be sold liek that" crowd... I disagree. You are free to sell whatever you wish. Just indicate clearly what it is. Or am I not allowed to sell a bass that came with pickup covers without them? Maybe I removed them on day one and lost them. And those guitars that came with a case and a set of accessories... what does it matter? The ad says a guy is selling a guitar, and a guitar alone, without a case... what's wrong with that? Same here. Considering we're talking about something that costs so little... it seems a little strange to get worked up about it. Just like with instrument cables, I have a couple of power leads that I like and use for most things, and I would not be including them with anything. If I have a spare one that I can let go, then I'd include it when selling the amp. If not, I would not, but I'd make it known. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Rock Posted December 5, 2013 Author Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) I've traded one amp, and bought another in the last month or so. The first was a straight trade. Without even thinking, I packed the cable with the amp and off it went. My new amp arrived sans cable. My only other amp has its cable hard wired in, and I haven't had a desktop PC or monitor since about 1998, so had no others that I could use, the person I traded with said they never usually sent cables, but posted it on to me. The second was a straight cash sale. Again it arrived without the cable, the seller saying that this is the norm. To me, supplying an amp with a cable seemed so obvious, and it was a surprise to come up against this opposing train of thought. so I did a poll :-) I understand that it's not hugely important. I'm certainly not getting 'worked up' about it. Look at is a trivial counterpoint to the heavy 'Gay Thread' in Off Topic :-) It's more an exercise in gauging what people naturally think is the default stance Edited December 5, 2013 by Roland Rock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1386263475' post='2297947'] Unequivocably, an amp should come with a power cable. [b]How could it be argued otherwise ?[/b] The power cable is part of the amp. It's the part that connects it to the mains. [/quote] Er, quite easily. The power cable is demonstrably NOT part of the amp, that's why it's a physically separate item, in the same way that an instrument lead is not part of the amp either, but you won't get much out of the amp (more correctly 'into ) without one. Or a cab come to that. And the reason that the cable is not part of the amp is because different cables are required in different parts of the world. A UK mains lead is not going to impress anyone in France is it? Or vice versa. If you sold an amp to someone in France would you go to the trouble of buying a French mains lead for them or would you think it reasonable that they probably had a spare and if not could easily get one for a pittance? Talk about first world problems! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Rock Posted December 5, 2013 Author Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1386273753' post='2298197'] Talk about first world problems! [/quote] Just to reiterate, the poll was created NOT because of any significant problem, but rather to satisfy my curiosity regarding peoples' default expectations. One thing I've learned is that everyone except me seems to have hundreds of the buggers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingus Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) [quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1386273753' post='2298197'] Er, quite easily. The power cable is demonstrably NOT part of the amp, that's why it's a physically separate item, in the same way that an instrument lead is not part of the amp either, but you won't get much out of the amp (more correctly 'into ) without one. Or a cab come to that. And the reason that the cable is not part of the amp is because different cables are required in different parts of the world. A UK mains lead is not going to impress anyone in France is it? Or vice versa. If you sold an amp to someone in France would you go to the trouble of buying a French mains lead for them or would you think it reasonable that they probably had a spare and if not could easily get one for a pittance? Talk about first world problems! [/quote] Firstly, French people's opinions don't count for much by virtue of the fact that we won two World Wars to save their useless cheese eating surrender monkey arses . They can either start using the same electricity as us or go acoustic , as far as I am concerned. My grandad didn't fight the Waffen SS in the bocage hedgerows of Normandy so his nearest and dearest had to worry if one of the local peasants could use their previously owned Genz Benz rig at the church hall without having to send off to Thomann for a cheap mains cable. The power cord [u][i]is [/i][/u]part of the amplifier. Are you saying that an amplifier isn't allowed to have detatchable componants? Where is that written in stone? Furthermore, it is a componant that, depending on its' construction and composition, can have a direct bearing on the sound quality of the amp. So what that different markets need different cables? They also need different output transformers, so you wouldn't sell an American a Euro voltage amp ( unless they wanted you to for some reason ) . Let the buyer beware, but it is not unreasonable for the buyer to assume that the appropriate means to access power will be included , surely? Edited December 5, 2013 by Dingus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 [quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1386275082' post='2298213'] Firstly, French people's opinions don't count for much by virtue of the fact that we won two World Wars to save their useless cheese eating surrender monkey arses . They can either start using the same electricity as us or go acoustic , as far as I am concerned. My grandad didn't fight the Waffen SS in the bocage hedgerows of Normandy so his nearest and dearest had to worry if one of the local peasants could use their previously owned Genz Benz rig at the church hall without having to send off to Thomann for a cheap mains cable... [/quote] Hear, hear..! ([i]distant sounds of ringing church bells and cheering mob[/i]...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1386275082' post='2298213'] Firstly, French people's opinions don't count for much by virtue of the fact that we won two World Wars to save their useless cheese eating surrender monkey arses . They can either start using the same electricity as us or go acoustic , as far as I am concerned. My grandad didn't fight the Waffen SS in the bocage hedgerows of Normandy so his nearest and dearest had to worry if one of the local peasants could use their previously owned Genz Benz rig at the church hall without having to send off to Thomann for a cheap mains cable. The power cord [u][i]is [/i][/u]part of the amplifier. Are you saying that an amplifier isn't allowed to have detatchable componants? Where is that written in stone? Furthermore, it is a componant that, depending on its' construction and composition, can have a direct bearing on the sound quality of the amp. So what that different markets need different cables? They also need different output transformers, so you wouldn't sell an American a Euro voltage amp ( unless they wanted you to for some reason ) . Let the buyer beware, but it is not unreasonable for the buyer to assume that the means tio access power will be included , surely? [/quote] Where to start . . . . . (we are having a laugh about all this aren't we - I don't want any falling out over a bloody mains lead! ) 1. The French DO use the same electricity as us - in fact they typically supply us with about 10% of our needs. But they just happen to be good Europeans and use the European mains connectors. I couldn't possibly comment on your other characterisations about the French. 2. You're right - amps ARE allowed to have detachable components . . . like instrument leads and loudspeakers for example. I look forward to those being included when you sell me an amp. 3. Don't start me on the sonic characteristics of mains leads, otherwise we probably will fall out! 4. Most modern amps have 'universal' PSUs, which is the [u]very reason[/u] why mains leads have become separate items over the years. It makes things easier and cheaper for manufacturers, so easy in fact that it's not unusual for products to be shipped with multiple mains leads - which is why I have boxes of European and US mains leads as well as spare UK ones. 5. Let the buyer beware? Yes! Don't assume an amp will be shipped with a mains lead - check! 6. All the above subject to (hopefully that'll be enough to avoid any offence). Edited December 5, 2013 by flyfisher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I would never expect a used amp to come with one, and I would probably forget to include one if I sold an amp on (just ask Beedster... he'll confirm I've done it before!). I'd have to remind myself to do it. I have a couple of heavy-duty cables which are 'my' cables. Any others (usually cheap) I pick up along the way go straight into my cables box, and get forgotten about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seashell Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 If I was buying a kettle I'd expect it to come with an actual kettle lead. Likewise I'd expect any electrical item to come with a suitable lead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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