TheRinser Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 Hey everyone, Well, it's been a good and bad week, bought Gwilym's V-type and PPA300, this is a good thing. However, plugged it in to my peavey cabs which I haven't used since my last gig. The 15 sounds fine but the 210 isn't working properly, which is a bad thing. One of the speakers works fine, the other one does nothing when I'm playing high up but when I hit the low notes it seems to be sympathetically vibrating. The sound is a mixture of scratchy white noise and the sound when you unplug your bass when the amp's on. Not the hum, but the loud crackle kind of thing. I've been having problems with this cab since I let a support band use my rig back in May. The bassist left the stage with effects on and her bass resting up against my amp feeding back. Not really the done thing with someone else's equipment... When I set up to play there was no sound at all coming out of the 210. So I played the gig with just my 15. Got home, plugged in and nothing, then really dug in and the note seemed to shock my 210 back to life. The next day it didn't work so I thought there was a loose connection, took it apart and everything looked fine. Plugged it in after that and it worked. It's been fine since then, gigged with it a few times and been playing at home with no problems until yesterday. My AH600 and the PPA300 have 2 separate power amps each so I've tried it with both of them them, changing the speaker cables around (made by OBBM) all to no avail. Noticed earlier today that when playing with just the 15, the dodgy speaker on the 210 is making the same noise but quieter, it's not even plugged in. I took the cab apart yesterday and it seemed fine, everything's connected, the dodgy speaker looks no different to the other one, tried moving the speaker and it doesn't feel rough and isn't snagging through its travel, which I have heard is what happens when they overheat and get knackered... So, anyone had a similar problem? Any idea what to do? Cheers, Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 To use the technical term - its f***ed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted June 29, 2008 Author Share Posted June 29, 2008 Seems that way eh? I just don't get why it'd start off intermittently doing it and now this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted June 29, 2008 Share Posted June 29, 2008 It can only be an electrical or mechanical breakdown. If the driver is getting the same juice as the other (check for dry joints) then it could be a fault with the voice coil not inducing the cone to move or the voice coil is OK but something mechanical is stopping the cone from moving. It does not have to be much and pushing the cone to make sure it moves only really proves its not really really f***ed and not just f***ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowhand_mike Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 [quote name='TheRinser' post='229055' date='Jun 29 2008, 03:19 PM']Seems that way eh? I just don't get why it'd start off intermittently doing it and now this... [/quote] things like that start off intermittent and then just die. (electrical equipment is so dramatic, it does just stop working, it dies!) i've had speakers (car ones) where the cone has dropped but still played but really distorted as it was scratching on the coil so it was still getting a signal. sounds like yours isn't even getting a signal to try and use. i'd go with ferret's diagnosis of it's f***ed!! you could just replace the one speaker but you would be better off getting a new matching pair. unless the speaker input is a bit screwed. ok that didnt help much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huge Hands Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 I'd try tracing the cables to both drivers inside the cab. Hopefully, at some point, there will be a connector which means you can swap the feed between each driver with out having to use a soldering iron. Feed the signal intended for one into the other and vice versa, and see if the problem moves. If not, then there's likely to be a problem wih the driver or the bit of cable up to the swap. What you described does sound like a knackered driver - does it move with the same amount of resistance to your push than the working one? It could be a faulty connection between the voice coil and the cable terminals, which you could try and freshen with a soldering iron. Otherwise it's probably a new driver or re-cone required. All the best with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted June 30, 2008 Author Share Posted June 30, 2008 Cheers for the tips, all the wires are soldered, no connectors to mess about with. All the connections seem fine. It's wired in series (i think). There's a crossover on the backplate for the horn, then the wires run first to the broken speaker, then on to the one that's working ok. So signal is definitely getting through the broken speaker. It's just not having any of it... As far as I could tell it moved just as easily as the driver that still works. Any suggestions as to where to get hold of a peavey driver? Is it best to go direct to peavey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowhand_mike Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 (edited) it may be worth going direct to peavey but they may not tell you ok just did a quick search and the TVX uses this speaker [url="http://www.copystars.com/peavey_sheffield_tvx_1035_4_18442_prd1.htm"]http://www.copystars.com/peavey_sheffield_..._18442_prd1.htm[/url] not found any in the UK yet though. they equate to about £35, so you would be far better off replacing both drivers with something a little better that suits the cab. you'll need someone like BFM or Alex to guide you further on that one though Edited June 30, 2008 by lowhand_mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted June 30, 2008 Author Share Posted June 30, 2008 Cheers Mike! Not a bad idea upgrading a bit, if I had the money I'd probably go for something a little more upmarket... Anyone got any suggestions? It's the deeper, vinyl covered, front ported version of the cab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowhand_mike Posted June 30, 2008 Share Posted June 30, 2008 (edited) you would need to work out the internal volume to match the speakers to it there is this quote about a similar driver( from the talkbass post) "It is nearly identical to an Eminence BP102. The BP102 is a better driver, but it requires a 23% larger volume." there is this post on talkbass that covers a similar theme. may help you choose the correct driver [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-150625.html"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/archive/inde...p/t-150625.html[/url] it also depends on the ohm rating of the speakers, i think your 2x10 is rated at 4ohms so you would need 2 8ohm drivers Edited June 30, 2008 by lowhand_mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted July 4, 2008 Author Share Posted July 4, 2008 Hello there, I called peavey about a replacement speaker, it's gonna be £58.50. Sooo... Would this do the trick? [url="http://www.loudspeaker.co.uk/bl10-200.htm"]http://www.loudspeaker.co.uk/bl10-200.htm[/url] It's about half the price at £35 and I'm on a tight budget. Any other/better suggestions? Oh, and yes Mike, it would have to be 8 ohm cos my cab is 4 ohm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 [quote name='TheRinser' post='232843' date='Jul 4 2008, 12:30 PM'][url="http://www.loudspeaker.co.uk/bl10-200.htm"]http://www.loudspeaker.co.uk/bl10-200.htm[/url][/quote] The specs of that driver make it unsuitable for electric bass IMO. [quote]there is this quote about a similar driver( from the talkbass post) "It is nearly identical to an Eminence BP102. The BP102 is a better driver, but it requires a 23% larger volume."[/quote] If it was 'nearly identical' it would use the same box size. Either get a Peavey or find out the Peavey specs and replace it with a driver that matches them precisely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted July 4, 2008 Author Share Posted July 4, 2008 Cheers for that Bill, I really don't know what I'm talking about regarding this stuff, I read a lot of the threads with yours and Alex's input and I'm learning slowly... Here's the T/S parameters for the Peavey from the thread over on TB, it's a 4 ohm speaker but would that make any difference to the specs compared to the 8 ohm? What's the best way to find a similar speaker? Just trawl through specs for loads or is there an easier/quicker way to do it? Any ideas off the top of your head? Sheffield TVX 1035 - 4 Ohm ITEM # 00493630 SPECIFICATIONS Impedance: 4 Ohms Power capacity: 300 W Peak 150 W Program 75 W Continuous Sensitivity: 91.4 dB 1 Watt I 1 meter Usable frequency range: 60 Hz - 4 kHz Cone: Kevlar@ impregnated cellu-lose Voice coil diameter: 1.75" 144.4 mm Voice coil material: 2 layers, thermally bonded copper wire Kaptan former Nomex@ stiffener Net weight lb./kg: 7.4 Ibs./3.4 kg Znom (ohms) 4 Revc (ohms) 3.25 Sd (Square Meters): 0.335 BL (T/M): 7.97 Fo (Hz): 44.7 Vas(liters): 51.7 Cms(uM/N): 325.2 Mms(gm): 39.0 Qms: 4.18 Qes: 0.520 Qts: 0.460 Xmax(mm): 2.5 Le (mH): 0.11 SPL (1W/1m): 91.4 No (%): 0.9% Vd (cu. in/ml): 5.1/84 Pmax (Watts pgm): 150 Disp(cu. in./m): 83/1360 Cheers, Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 4, 2008 Share Posted July 4, 2008 [quote name='TheRinser' post='232883' date='Jul 4 2008, 02:42 PM']Xmax(mm): 2.5[/quote] Ouch. That puts this bugger in the same class as that Celestion. It will only take 25 -30 watts thoughout most of the bass power band before running out of excursion. Its sensitivity is rather pitiful also. I wouldn't bother to get a matching driver, I'd toss both of them. The Eminence Beta 10 and Basslite S2010 have specs close enough to work in the same cab. Of those the S2010, despite a lower power rating, will actually take more power. Four ohms is not an option for either, so if you must have an 8 ohm cab find the Beta 10b version, which is 16 ohms, wire the pair parallel for an 8 ohm load. BTW, have you actually tested the bad driver? If they are two 4 ohm drivers series wired for an 8 ohm cab an open voice coil in the one would prevent both from working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted July 4, 2008 Author Share Posted July 4, 2008 Ah, I see... I'll be honest, tone and sound-wise, I've had no problems with the cab so far, I've been using it alone for about a year for most gigs. (vertically aligned of course ). The speaker itself is 8 ohm, but the cab is 4 ohm, to get the best from my trace elliots. Both of which are two separate 4 ohm min. power amps within one box, the AH600 is 2x300W and the PPA300 is 2x150W. I understand that there are better drivers out there, but I really am working to a budget here... How do I go about testing the bad driver? All I can tell you is what it sounds like now. If it would help I could get an audio file of what it sounds like uploaded. Think they must be wired in parallel then, because the 2nd driver in the chain, wiring wise, works fine. Would this be right? The wires run from the crossover to the knackered speaker, then on to the one that's still working fine. Cheers, Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted July 5, 2008 Share Posted July 5, 2008 [quote name='TheRinser' post='232976' date='Jul 4 2008, 07:56 PM']How do I go about testing the bad driver? All I can tell you is what it sounds like now. If it would help I could get an audio file of what it sounds like uploaded. Think they must be wired in parallel then, because the 2nd driver in the chain, wiring wise, works fine. Would this be right? The wires run from the crossover to the knackered speaker, then on to the one that's still working fine. Cheers, Tom[/quote]Touch a 9 volt battery to the terminals of the exposed speaker cable end, both cones should move. You could use one of the recommended drivers for now, replace the second when funds permit. I wouldn't invest in another Peavey, it's not a good driver. I believe Blue Aran is a good source for Eminence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted July 10, 2008 Author Share Posted July 10, 2008 Hello Bill, cheers for the advice, I've gone for the Beta 10. I can get 2 of them for only about £30 more than one of the peavey ones... I checked the cab with a battery by the way, the working speaker moves, the other one just sits there. So yeah, thanks for the advice everybody, much appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowhand_mike Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 good to hear you have a solution, though didn't bill say the beta 10b is 16 ohm, so with 2 of them you would have an 8ohm cab, which would draw less power from your amp, unless of course you have found an 8ohm beta 10b in which case i'll can it and its much safer to replace both drivers as bill said the oem drivers tend to be a bit cack. (and overly priced) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted July 10, 2008 Author Share Posted July 10, 2008 Haha yeah definitely overpriced mike! Cheeky buggers... Yeah I've got the 8 ohm version, the beta 10a. So should be fine, now just gotta remember how to solder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowhand_mike Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 [quote name='TheRinser' post='236466' date='Jul 10 2008, 01:10 PM']Haha yeah definitely overpriced mike! Cheeky buggers... Yeah I've got the 8 ohm version, the beta 10a. So should be fine, now just gotta remember how to solder [/quote] haha, patience young sparrow. nice hot iron, good solder and some flux. though you already know that much. have fun and let us know how it all sounds when done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRinser Posted July 22, 2008 Author Share Posted July 22, 2008 No need luckily, got one of the speakers through (the other one is on its way as i type), took the old one out, realised it's just little pushfit connectors. so no chance of me bodging it beyond repair/dropping solder on the cone etc. Sounds fine as far as i can tell, guess it will take a couple of gigs to get it bedded in, will give you a progress report once that's happened. Cheers again for all the help guys, and here's hoping I never have to solder, ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 [quote name='TheRinser' post='245507' date='Jul 22 2008, 04:38 PM']Cheers again for all the help guys, and here's hoping I never have to solder, ever. [/quote] Yeah. Whenever I try I end up with none where I want it and loads where I dont. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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